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195hp Tb42 Turbo ..

Tech Talk for Nissan owners.

Moderators: toaddog, V8Patrol

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Post by CRUSHU »

Yes, Auto's drag more HP, as do Hi Stall convertors, the opposite is true of Low Stall convertors.

You are comparing the price for drive in drive out, compared to guys who just buy the bits, and fit it themselves. It is easy to blow a few days working on a car, even upto a week or 2, of solid work, for 1 or 2 people. 8 hours a day each, times anywhere upto $70 per hour.
www.CVEPerformance.com

Crushu F150 Buildup: http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/ftopic21987.php&highlight=crushu
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Post by Jimbo »

Actually the reverse too lean down low.
Yeah i read it back to front :roll: Stupid me..


Another thing to point out is that Mulisha hasn't gone down the "cheap road" He has spent a fair bit of $$$ getting this setup custom built for him. All he did was fit the manifold himself!

Also it seems that a lot of ppl on here think that if you go pay some1 $20,000 your automatically going to have the best setup. There is nothing wrong with going out and doing a little research, sourcing your own bits and then fitting it yourself and then saving a lot of $$$ at the same time.
GQII Patrol YAY!!
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Post by nastytroll »

That was engine only price I still had to buy the engine would have been around the $30,000 + once I got it back did the exhaust, wiring, air system ect ect aswell as freight from MLB to BRIS.
But what a motor
Any one with a drag racing back ground would know the cost involved to gain 0.1 sec on the 1/4 is alot.
So to get back on topic do all the cheap things, snorkel, air box ect.
A good indication is drivability, have a go at couple of your mates patrols n see how it porforms, if you cant get the HP to the ground its a hinderence, The ON TRACK cars were detuned cos they where to volitile, once they hit booste they were un controlable.
You got to remember you drive a patrol not skyline
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Post by Jimbo »

Who do ontrack send their motors to, to get machined up?
GQII Patrol YAY!!
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Post by dansedgli »

Jimbo wrote:
Another thing to point out is that Mulisha hasn't gone down the "cheap road" He has spent a fair bit of $$$ getting this setup custom built for him. All he did was fit the manifold himself!
He hasnt really spent a lot. I would say he has spent bugger all in the scheme of things.

Custom or not, all turbo kits need a manifold, turbo, wastegate and a pipe from the turbo to intercooler. That is as basic as it gets.
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Post by Mulisha »

dansedgli wrote:
Jimbo wrote:
Another thing to point out is that Mulisha hasn't gone down the "cheap road" He has spent a fair bit of $$$ getting this setup custom built for him. All he did was fit the manifold himself!
He hasnt really spent a lot. I would say he has spent bugger all in the scheme of things.

Custom or not, all turbo kits need a manifold, turbo, wastegate and a pipe from the turbo to intercooler. That is as basic as it gets.
Yeah but i could have brought a log type manifold instead of tunned length manifold.

I could have got impco gear and used that instead of the Gas Research gear.

I could have got a small cheaper external wastegate or even a internal gate instead of the 50mm gate i have.

I could have used my old 2.5" exhaust system but i choose a 3" mandrel system with a resinator.

I tryed to do it all right the first time instead of buying stuff twice.

I'm thinking pi$$ the air con off and i'm 80% sure a large front mount will fit and keep my front grill as well.


I'm just thinking is it worth the hassle of fitting a front mount cooler a 3" think one?

Can someone give me a honest oppion not "yeah will make ya car better" i want to is it really worth the trouble becuase i don't want to spend like another $800 or so and find i got a extra 10hp becuase IMHO it wouldn't be worth it!!

What/were is the best place to get cooler piping ? Would it the best if i got a length of exhaust pipe like 2.5"? Is it worth paying more for 3" pipe or is 2.5" fine? Will mild steel pipe work fine?

Also with doing the piping would it be hard if i have a drop saw and mig welder and grinder etc to cut the pipe at certain angles then weld them together and then just use silcon bends to go on the intercooler and turbo and throttle body etc?

Or should i pay someone to weld the pipes up? Wouldn't mind trying myself becuase i need to save money now.. :oops:

What do you suggest ? Don't wanna spend a fourtune on piping if i don't need to so cheaper ways?

Thanks alot guys!

And this may sounds very very dumn but could someone quickly explain how a intercooler hooks up.

Rick.
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Post by Mulisha »

This is the coolers i'm looking at:

Can get these sizes:

600-300-80 $165 plus freight
600-300-100 $255 plus freight
450-300-80 $165 plus freight

Image

This is kinda my personal choice (below) only reaon becuase there were more sold then the other.

450x 300x 76mm $160
or
600x300x76mm $160

600x300x100mm's are also available, but are $260 each.

Postage $30.

Image


What do u reakon any good?

Rick.
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Post by dansedgli »

Cooler piping is a piece of cake. You only need a drop saw and a cheap welder.

If you cant weld that great tack it together and take it to an exhaust shop to get welded properly.

Buy the mandrel bends from an exhaust shop. Plan what you will need, and buy the bends and straight peices. 90 degree 3 inch bends are around $20 each. An exhaust shop will charge bugger all to weld it properly. I got charged $30 bucks to get my piping welded properly.

For under 250rwkw an ebay cooler will be fine and will make a difference as you can run more boost and more timing due to a cooler intake charge.

Cooler/Denser air = more power. You dont need a $1000+ cooler on a 200rwkw car.

You should be able to do it for under $400.

Buy the cooler that fits the best.

FYI heaps of guys on the Xr6turbo forum are making over 300rwkw with a "ethnic person cooler" which is just a 450 * 300 * 75mm cheap core with end tanks to suit the xr6.

I paid $200 for my hybrid 450 * 300 * 75 cooler. I sold my 2nd hand 600 * 300 * 100 core for $70 just last week.

As someone else said as well, dont be so hung up on power figures. It is a 2 ton 4wd afterall. If it is twice as nice to drive then it is probably pretty good.

I would be stoked with that much power in my Maverick.
SWB mav. Some mods.
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Post by Mulisha »

dansedgli wrote:Cooler piping is a piece of cake. You only need a drop saw and a cheap welder.

If you cant weld that great tack it together and take it to an exhaust shop to get welded properly.

Buy the mandrel bends from an exhaust shop. Plan what you will need, and buy the bends and straight peices. 90 degree 3 inch bends are around $20 each. An exhaust shop will charge bugger all to weld it properly. I got charged $30 bucks to get my piping welded properly.

For under 250rwkw an ebay cooler will be fine and will make a difference as you can run more boost and more timing due to a cooler intake charge.

Cooler/Denser air = more power. You dont need a $1000+ cooler on a 200rwkw car.

You should be able to do it for under $400.

Buy the cooler that fits the best.

FYI heaps of guys on the Xr6turbo forum are making over 300rwkw with a "ethnic person cooler" which is just a 450 * 300 * 75mm cheap core with end tanks to suit the xr6.

I paid $200 for my hybrid 450 * 300 * 75 cooler. I sold my 2nd hand 600 * 300 * 100 core for $70 just last week.

Thanks alot mate for that so u think 3" pipe is the way to go becuase i was scared it was going to cost around the same price as my exhaust lol..

my inlet temp on the dyno was 56 degrees and the hot days we have had here i reakon it would be easily 65 degrees!


One thing i have thought about though my car has just had a dyno tune will it need another tune now once the cooler is fitted? And becuase they have had to lathe the jet or something (they told me) will i be up for another jet or something? What do i do in this situation?


Cheers

Rick.
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Post by dansedgli »

Yeah a new tune would help your power output and you want to make sure its not leaning out.

Put an airbox or some heatshielding to help with the heat. A snorkel would work good.

2.5 inch piping will be fine for your cooler but the cheaper coolers have 3 inch inlets and outlets so you will need silicone reducers to match.

My cooler piping is 2.5 inch on the turbo side as it matches the compressor outlet and 3 inch on the throttle body side as it matches the throttle body.
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Post by Mulisha »

I have one reducer for the turbo already and yeah my throttle body is 3".

Were is the best place for those silcon bends becuase supercheap have them Monza ones but i don't want to use them if there shit..

may i ask why i would need mandrel bends becuase i'm hopping to be able to flip the intercooler above so that the outlet and inlet are up the top.

I already have a couple of silcon bends but one thing i was thinking was i might cut the pipe i already have up and get that welded in the new piping somewere becuase it has some pipe off my converter going to it and my BOV is fitted in there.

You can see what i mean in the pic below but now i have a BOV mounted in the black pipe above my rocker cover.

Image



Would u mind explaining what piping goes were like inlet and outlet on the intercooler and were that black pipe will go etc.

Also how much is 3" mild steel pipe becuase i might use 3" because i don't need reducers except one that i already have and 3" would be better i think.

Cheers

Rick.

Be online later on going out for a couple hrs.
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Post by shakes »

Can someone give me a honest oppion not "yeah will make ya car better" i want to is it really worth the trouble becuase i don't want to spend like another $800 or so and find i got a extra 10hp becuase IMHO it wouldn't be worth it!!
yeah will make ya car better :finger:

i'll say it again, spend hours trawling ricer forums and you will understand why you need a cooler, there's alot more to it than that extra 10hp
(the words hand grenade come to mind) high intake temps = pre-ignition = $$$$
One thing i have thought about though my car has just had a dyno tune will it need another tune now once the cooler is fitted? And becuase they have had to lathe the jet or something (they told me) will i be up for another jet or something? What do i do in this situation?
Welcome to the world of playing cars, you might make several trips to the tuners and spend lots of money playing with jet sizes all to find out the 2nd set you tryed was the best combo your gunna get :finger: :finger:

Simon
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Post by turbo4.8 »

kaboom!!!!!!!!!!
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Post by Mulisha »

turbo4.8 wrote:kaboom!!!!!!!!!!
:?:

Thanks shakes yeah i'll have a look at some other forums cheers


Rick.
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Post by bigbennymq »

run a pwr frontmount intercooler for around 400-700 $$ and you need that snorkle for the cold air, also how much pounds of boost you running
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Post by shakes »

(the words hand grenade come to mind) high intake temps = pre-ignition = $$$$
kaboom!!!!!!!!!!
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Post by chunderlicious »

intercooler piping; run the same size pipe as the turbo outlet to the cooler then run the size of the throttle body from the cooler to the intake. thats a money saving way of doing it, some will disagree but it works and most of the huge horsepower ricers run their set ups like this.

good luck dude, 195 at the tredlies is still a ShortyIQ nice punch in the revs.
turbos are nice but i'd rather be blown
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Post by eliteforce32 »

mulisha..... all the bends you need, the silicone ones, spf brand... used them for my old setup.. from ARE in brendale... northside brissie.
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Post by blackmav »

Tube and fin type cooler. 600x300x75
Infront of air-con condensor- no fan.
Move air-con drier to near firewall.
Rather large hole saw through radiator support pannel x2
Cut grill

Image

Yee hah :armsup:
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Post by blackmav »

chunderlicious wrote:intercooler piping; run the same size pipe as the turbo outlet to the cooler then run the size of the throttle body from the cooler to the intake. thats a money saving way of doing it, some will disagree but it works and most of the huge horsepower ricers run their set ups like this.

good luck dude, 195 at the tredlies is still a ShortyIQ nice punch in the revs.
^^^^

What he said :D
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Post by TUFFRANGIE »

I haven't piped up yet, but having gone through a build up of a supercharged efi shorty i know what you are going through. I started with no snorkel and pod filter under the bonnet near exhaust manifold, had around 90rwkw on 33's, installed 2 gu bonnet scoops, stainless mandrel snorkel and airbox and it went up to around 100rwkw. 600 x 300 x 76 mm PWR front mount Intercooler and new dyno tune power went up to around 140rwkw on 33's. So if you want small improvements do the snorkel and heat wrap but the biggest improvement was with a good quality front mount and some nice flowing pipework. I got rid of my aircon and she fits in between the radiator and grill no need for a cop bait looking intercooler haning off the front.

Rob
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Post by Mulisha »

Thanks alot guys!

Tuffrangie i was going through some pics of ya car on Nissan patrol forum last night trying to see in ur pics how u fitted the intercooler..

I don't really want to spend $800 on a intercooler i think i do some more research and look at something a little cheaper.

I was looking at mild steel for my pipe work but someone said it may rust i didn't really think of that..

Thanks alot guys

I might look at fabing up a some sort of air box and heat shields this week and just think about the intercooler for a little and gather more research and not jump into the deep end and then have to spill another couple of grand on tunning and intercooler and piping and different wastegate spring and decomp plate etc..

Cheers

Rick.
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Post by bogged »

Mulisha wrote:I don't really want to spend $800 on a intercooler i think i do some more research and look at something a little cheaper..
search for some replies from awill4x4 on the cheap IC's on ebay.. theres a reason they are cheap. Andrew knows his shit, he makes them.

You dont need to spend $1000's but you have gone this far, dont go jew on it now for a few weeks more saving.... do it right, do it once as you have so far.
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Post by Mulisha »

bogged wrote:
Mulisha wrote:I don't really want to spend $800 on a intercooler i think i do some more research and look at something a little cheaper..
search for some replies from awill4x4 on the cheap IC's on ebay.. theres a reason they are cheap. Andrew knows his shit, he makes them.

You dont need to spend $1000's but you have gone this far, dont go jew on it now for a few weeks more saving.... do it right, do it once as you have so far.
Very true.

I don't know enough about intercoolers at this stage that's why i thought there wouldn't be a big difference between the ebay one and the pwr one for a 4wd.

Cheers

Rick.
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Post by bogged »

www.are.com.au ... have a read.
like everything, there is good and bad.
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Post by TUFFRANGIE »

Heaps of info on intercoolers:

http://www.are.com.au/techtalk/intecoolersMR.htm

Info on Chinese ones 3/4 of the way down

Do it right the first time dude! My inlet is on the drivers side and outlet passenger, the cooler is mounted upside down. Mild steel should be fine just paint or powdercoat it preferably

Edit-Beat me to it with the link bogged
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Post by nastytroll »

you can fit an I/C in front of the A/c if you remove the brace from the bonnet latch to the bottom of the rad support then gring the back side of the grill away. My GQ ute has a Safari front mount cooler fitted this was n has done 250,000km like this with no cracks
If you get onto the Safari 4x4 engineering site it gives performance gains for the 4.2 deisel with same turbo jus non i/c vs ic, gives a rough guide
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Post by GRINCH »

use the gktech coolers all the vl boys seem to think they are alright. is there any reason for your mixer to be facing backwards, if you could turn it around it would make the piping easier
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Post by alj »

I think MudRhino is right, that is a great amount of power mate. I have a 1JZ soarer and have been playing around with the setup for years, you should seriously consider lowering the AFR to around 12-12.5, I would go out and buy a GTR cooler, and most important of all make sure you shroud it so all the air has to go in the cooler (otherwise the efficiency goes out the window).

Can you convert to EFI? If you can that would be the go. Then you wont have to worry about jets, you can just mod the AFR with an SAFC2 or something to the like... something to consider anyways..
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Post by BowTieGQ »

Sorry it's of topic Mulisha, but wouldn't you have been better fitting a Chev? Since you haven't skimped on money with your turbo setup, it probably would have been cheaper, a fresh engine and no fuss good power.
[quote="bazooked"]can i use a mate to position while i screw? :twisted:[/quote]
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