Baleno Motor (With build up pics)

[BlueSuzy]

Hi, my engine is dying and im searching for a new engine. I dont want to go vitara cos they just seem 2 old now and everyone has 1. I am now looking at what has to be done to the g16b baleno motor as they seem like an easy fitment even though they are a fwd motor. I have searched and im getting things here and there, its so annoying

Things that i have found that need to be changed over/and optionals:

* New custom rear thermo housing and water outlet to front of engine with tapped hole for sensor. I used original top hose
* Cut and shut the 1.3 - 1.6 sump because of the 1.6 crankangle sensor
* Swap oil pickup tubing in sump, change the tubing locating end and reweld a bracket so it supports the tubing
* Change dipstick and tubing from 1.3 - into 1.6 block to suit sump
* Install the engine fan off the 1.3
* New exhaust manifold. Vitara 16v extactors, Cut and modded to fit into chassis/ Have heard jimny ones fit better.
* Spacer plate to adapt to the gearbox, They are about 5-6mm thick.
* Wider double row bearing for gearbox shaft if it is worn out. Mine was, but not needed for normal engine swap.
* Coily sierra tank with vitara efi pump. Bolt In Swap. /Vitara tank with pump(moremods required)/ Or surge tank and extra pumps
* Wiring to sort out, Alot of wiring...3/4 the wiring is a waste.
* Drivers side engine mount to be modified 20mm back
* Passenger mount 10mm slotted back. My engine sits back, the rubbers are straight. And gearbox mount is perfect.
* Starter motor to be modified and/or shave block. Or i have heard the vitara one fits or the gti motor one
* Change Throttle cable to same model baleno cable, modify the pedal so it takes the baleno cable end, Have a look how the baleno pedal is.
* Vss sensor out of a vitara speedo unit. Use Baleno Tacho unit. Sierra one doesnt work with twin coil.

* Optional:Change airbox, Probably to a sierra 1L box, looks small, easy fit simple intake hose adapters. (1L airbox feels restrictive) Probably look into other boxes..I'm running a fully pod filter atm. My 1.3 box didnt seal properly.
* Optional:Baleno gauges look nice. 240km speedo! Bit fiddly but possible!

Thanks

[Gutless]

Mate depending on which year model baleno motor you use, they are almost exactly the same as vitara anyway.

As mentioned there are the water outlet and sump differences. A set of 16v Vit extractors will solve your manifold problems also.

If you buy a later model one, you will have coil pack ignition, so you lose the dizzy and gain a CAS ( crank angle sensor).

As for fuel system, the best way to go is as follows.

[nicbeer]

engine mount also to mod.

200 buys BenTs adapter kit btw. for engine and box

[Gwagensteve]

Gutless, I don't actually think that's the best way of running he fuel system. It might have it's place in a performance car, (where the factory HP pump cna't flow enough volume @ pressure for a high Kw engine) but I've seen a couple of sierras set up this way and there is generally a lot of noise, a mess of hoses, lots to go wrong and a lot of $$$, and large reduction in load area.

I have set up four sierras with vitara fuel tanks and I am about to set up my 5th. It does require crossmember/mount modifications but when complete looks uber stock and the swimmer pump is reliable and quiet.

Just my 2c.

Steve.

[Gutless]

Gutless, I don't actually think that's the best way of running he fuel system. It might have it's place in a performance car, (where the factory HP pump cna't flow enough volume @ pressure for a high Kw engine) but I've seen a couple of sierras set up this way and there is generally a lot of noise, a mess of hoses, lots to go wrong and a lot of $$$, and large reduction in load area.

I have set up four sierras with vitara fuel tanks and I am about to set up my 5th. It does require crossmember/mount modifications but when complete looks uber stock and the swimmer pump is reliable and quiet.

Just my 2c.

Steve.

Fair enough. I have this setup under my zook, not in the back. Its not overly complicated, but it does cost a bit to do, especially with speedflow fittings and braded hoses. If an in-tank pump is being used then you shouldn't need a surge tank etc, but if running an external pump, the setup mentioned above is the safest way to keep fuel up to a 4WD off-road.

Noise is minimal.

[Gwagensteve]

I agree, under the car is best but it's always made me nervous having that many fittings etc under there.

The elegance of the stock vitara tank is that the amount of stuff to go wrong is greatly minimised.

Steve.

[BlueSuzy]

yup ok, in the process of picking up my baleno engine at $1090 with conversion wiring,computer,sensors,etc. my engine has the coil pack on top so yes i do have the crank sensor. with the fuel tank, i have heard you can just run a external fuel pump out of the sierra 1, like a comodore 1?

Questions?

* What if i made a guard to cover it and tucked away out of harms way?
* What mods are to be made to fit the vitara tank and pump? Anything major? Does it sit lower? Exhaust in the way etc?

I cant wait!

[Gwagensteve]

No you can't just run an external pump. The stock sierra tank has no baffles or swirl pot in it so if the fuel runs away from the pick up you will very very quickly have a lean out.

The vitara pump is inside the tank. it needs the fuel pump feed wires from your baleno loom sent to it.

to fit the tank all 4 mounts need moving as the vitara tank has a flat, not diagonal mounting plane. It will not hang lower than the stock sierra tank. the filler is in a slightly different spot and will be easier to fit with a BL. If the tank is offset as far to the RHS as possible, the exhaust (with mods) will clear the tank AFAIK.

I haven't fitted a vitara tank to a car without a BL, so I cant comment exactly on heights and filler clearances.

The REALLY simple way is to find/buy a coil sierra tank and bolt a vitara pump/pickup in. The coil tanks already have the swirl pot in them and will accept a vit pump as they were already designed for EFI, but this way means finding a difficult to find tank (coil) AND a vitara tank for the pickup/pump assembly.

Note, only the SWB EFI vit (and x-90... see they are good for something) tanks are suitable. LWB tanks are too big to go behind the rear axle.

Steve.

[BlueSuzy]

mmm, my options are leaning towards the coil tank and a vitara pump...but a tank will be hard to find, let alone expensive...Even a straight sierra tank is a hard find! Now im confused in the fuel section and i will need a wiring diagram for the plugs and stuff. All is fun and games

[nicbeer]

u can run a primer (carby style pump ) in front of the vl style pump ok. this is what i run on my 1.6. witout the small pump it starved easily.

i used a facet pump feeding the vl pump inline to the engine and filters.

[11_evl]

im planning on mounting a surge tank under the bonnet and using the stock mechanical pump to fill it and a normal EFI pump 4 the injectors.
using the same setup as the above fuel system layout but not under the car

[BlueSuzy]

ok the electric carbie then the electric vl pump seems to be the cheaper option and is very interesting, how did you go up bumpy hills etc, all kept up fine? Was the wiring for the pumps both connected to the fuel wires? what wiring diagram would be suitable for the coilpack 1.6? cant find any....

[nicbeer]

yep on fuel wires. goes fine on mine so far.

dunno on wiring. gutless may know.

[muz_ook]

u can run a primer (carby style pump ) in front of the vl style pump ok. this is what i run on my 1.6. witout the small pump it starved easily.

i used a facet pump feeding the vl pump inline to the engine and filters.

i run the same setup as this,and it never starves itself and offroad its fine no probs at all.

you will love the power going from 1.3 to baleno 1.6.

[BlueSuzy]

Im hoping I will love the power from a carbie dying 1.3 to a 2000mod 1.6 injected woo hoo. Ok...I have many friends they say surge tank for the fuel, but i mite just try the carbie pump then injected pump. im still confused. I have my engine and wiring now. New clutch,New seals,And a new timing belt. So much farkin wiring i might go mental.....but its still early days.

Question

* Is the 2000 baleno meant to have a airflow meter(like a box thing with wiring near an airbox) or is in in the throttle? Also an air temp? i mite be missing them.....

*Any1 wanna help lol. or can show me 1 in a car going, I will travel to see it! Im around Penrith Nsw.

[nicbeer]

try find some pics of a baleno underbonnet for comparison.

also dunno about ur dealer but mine here doesnt mind me poking my nose in there manuals/books for parts etc.

[Gutless]

Im hoping I will love the power from a carbie dying 1.3 to a 2000mod 1.6 injected woo hoo. Ok...I have many friends they say surge tank for the fuel, but i mite just try the carbie pump then injected pump. im still confused. I have my engine and wiring now. New clutch,New seals,And a new timing belt. So much farkin wiring i might go mental.....but its still early days.

Question

* Is the 2000 baleno meant to have a airflow meter(like a box thing with wiring near an airbox) or is in in the throttle? Also an air temp? i mite be missing them.....

*Any1 wanna help lol. or can show me 1 in a car going, I will travel to see it! Im around Penrith Nsw.

My suggestion is that if you are going to run the facett pump and then the EFI pump, why not just add the surge tank while you are there? If under load for an extended period your EFI pump wants to move more fuel than the Facett pump can supply, it will start to cavitate. There may only be a very slight difference in performance, but the result over an extended period could be as minor as a stuffed ( burnt out) EFI pump ~ $160; or as major as a stuffed motor ~ $$$$$$

Addig the swirl pot/ surge tank will give you that peice of mind, and the job will have been done right the first time. People will tell you that they run the two pumps without a surge tank with no dramas but without a wide band Air/ fuel ratio meter there is no way they can know that there motor is not leaning out ever so slightly due to restricted fuel supply under load. Also, most EFI pumps will not suck fuel, they only push, so having a 1/2 Litre or more of fuel being gravity fed to the EFI pump all the time means that it will never cavitate, therefore you should never experience piston melting lean outs.

Yes you need to hook both pumps up to the fuel relay, as they both need to be running to ensure fuel lines are charged prior to starting the motor.

Baleno has no AFM, but there is an Air temp sensor in the inlet pipe after the filter. You may get away without this, but it does help the ecu self tune for different ambient temps.

Mine is running but its a little far for you to drive

Pete

[alien]

why not go a vitara 1.8l??? might be a squeeze and hard to find but then you'd have something different for sure =)

[Gutless]

why not go a vitara 1.8l??? might be a squeeze and hard to find but then you'd have something different for sure =)

There is no such thing.

The vit only came out in 1.6 and 2.0. GV's came out in 1.6, 2.0, 2.5, and 2.7.

The Baleno GTX?? came out with the J18A motor which is a different block to vitara making it harder to transplant. The J20A 4 banger from the vit is based on the J18 from the baleno, and is just as hard to fit.

Both of these would be awesome in a sierra, but the 2.0L would be my pick.

[BlueSuzy]

well what a headache...baleno motor is upside down tryed fitting sump and comparing that to the baleno crank sensor, all good will fix up tomorrow. Going to do the surge tank.

A question i have worked out today!

* The baleno pickup has a bigger locating tube end to the sierra,(the tube end where it bolts up) will i need to modify the sierra one to suit the baleno?

[Gutless]

well what a headache...baleno motor is upside down tryed fitting sump and comparing that to the baleno crank sensor, all good will fix up tomorrow. Going to do the surge tank.

A question i have worked out today!

* The baleno pickup has a bigger locating tube end to the sierra,(the tube end where it bolts up) will i need to modify the sierra one to suit the baleno?

This happens to all who change out a G13 for a G16. The sumps are ofcoarse different, and the oil pickup sockets in the block are different. Just cut off the larger end off the baleno pickup and weld/ braise onto the sierra pickup and move the support tag. But remember to change the o-ring for a new one, otherwise you will have weak oil pressure.

Also a tip for when you are welding the sump..... Tack it down to a sheet of steel; 5mm or more; before welding. This should help stop the flange surface from distorting too much.

Peter

[BlueSuzy]

ok excelent! Sounds like your the person to ask bout this lol, thanks, how long have you had yours in for? Might be making the gearbox spacer up friday and the thermo/water piping.....c wat happens....

[BlueSuzy]

Sump modifyed today also the pickup. Tried fitting the parts and all should be all sweet! Now for the spacer plate tomorrow..10mm flatbar welded to form the gearbox/motor shape and holes all worked out.

Questions:

* With the 1.6 i think i will have to redrill the engine mounts to make up for the 10mm spacer, Should i need to?

[MightyMouse]

Just curious re the surge tank under the bonnet idea.

One of the issues with earlier EFI systems was the heat added to the fuel by the continuous circulation of fuel from the tank to the engine and back.

A surge tank under the bonnet with the EFI pump connected would seem to be even more vulnerable.

many modern systems no longer recirculate fuel ( dead end systems ) to avoid heating the fuel.

How do the underbonnet tanks go in really hot weather and under full load ?

[BlueSuzy]

Well the surge tank id try and get it to the drivers side if possible as the zorst is on the otherside. Or would it be alright on the back floor?

Also need a wiring diagram!!! I have searched everywhere an found only one site that i cant download for some reason!!

[Gutless]

Sump modifyed today also the pickup. Tried fitting the parts and all should be all sweet! Now for the spacer plate tomorrow..10mm flatbar welded to form the gearbox/motor shape and holes all worked out.

Questions:

* With the 1.6 i think i will have to redrill the engine mounts to make up for the 10mm spacer, Should i need to?

Use 5 or 6mm. Most commercially available kits are 5mm plate. 10 is just unneccessaru, and may cause issues with spline mating in the clutch to g'box region. Throw out may also be effected.

[Gutless]

Just curious re the surge tank under the bonnet idea.

One of the issues with earlier EFI systems was the heat added to the fuel by the continuous circulation of fuel from the tank to the engine and back.

A surge tank under the bonnet with the EFI pump connected would seem to be even more vulnerable.

many modern systems no longer recirculate fuel ( dead end systems ) to avoid heating the fuel.

How do the underbonnet tanks go in really hot weather and under full load ?

i would think that by the time the fuel got back to a rear mounted surge tank there would be little concern about fuel temps.

And mounting the surge tank under the bonnet is not recommended. Its basically a mini fuel cell....there is a reason why most cars have a motor at one end and the fuel at the other.......

[Gutless]

Well the surge tank id try and get it to the drivers side if possible as the zorst is on the otherside. Or would it be alright on the back floor?

Also need a wiring diagram!!! I have searched everywhere an found only one site that i cant download for some reason!!

You can mount the surge tank in the back if you wish, but mount your pumps under the floor and make a REALLY good gaurd/ cover for the fuel lines and surge tank in the back tub area, so that shifting loads cannot damage the fuel system. Try not to mount the pumps in a small enclosure though, as heat may get the better of them.

[alien]

i've not seen the size of the pump/tank, but theres always the space between the false panels and the body in the back left corner of the tray? This keeps it at the rear, out of harms way, and somewhat cool (except the confined space).

[BlueSuzy]

I have made the 10mm spacer plate. I have now realised i have clutch plate/flywheel issues... Thanks gutless for the simple idea of 5-6mm plate! i thought they were thicker! Anywho, i will mill it down on monday so it will be 5mm. The surge tank i may put it in the rear corner and the pumps under with heavy duty guards i think. Now having dramas with the engine mounts, not to worry. Not hard to work out!