Formula Suzuki Brainstorm

[redzook]

- Base vehicle SWB
- 1.3L carby only
- Sierra axles only
- Rockhoppers acceptable
- 33" tyres max
- 5.12:1 R&P max
- All lockers okay
- Leaf suspension only
- SPOA okay
- 3/4 elliptical okay
- Standard steering box only
- High steer okay
- 6 pt roll cage
- No winching?
- bodylift allowed

More ideas?

[redzook]

why is every 1 against the bodylifts?

every second zook has got a body lift
and i dont think they will want to take it out for the comp

so if ya want more ppl involed id say allow bodylifts

[N*A*M]

it's just me who is against it really
and yes i do have a 2" solid steel body lift

[greg]

I still say bone stock sierras with no changes except for tyre tread (still stock size) and safety equipment.

[RB zook]

i think this is a great idea,
standard zooks with max tyre size of say 33.
it would be cheap and would really test drivers.

now im getting excited

[redzook]

I still say bone stock sierras with no changes except for tyre tread (still stock size) and safety equipment.

who has got money to go out an buy another zuk?
stock sucks

[droopypete]

I still say bone stock sierras with no changes except for tyre tread (still stock size) and safety equipment.

Stock would make a level playing field,
very boring but level.
I think Nam's first list was very close to the mark.

Peter.

[RB zook]

would this allow coily sierras?

[zookjedi]

stock sierra with 33's , will it be all down hill

NAMs first list but allowing 2"max body lifts for those not wanting spoa but wanting larger tyres with out chopping bits off , and there cheap and as redzook said a hell of a lot of zookers have em .

rego only no engineers certificates except maybe for roll cages, if some one has a spoa with a z bar and it breaks cause they carn't weld i think its best it breaks competing driving slow other than on the road

no winches would make for a better drive , but what if the winch is on the vehicle could it still enter (just no usage) due mainly that people would use these said cars on the weekend else where needing a winch.

[bigsteve]

If you are saying that "Formula Suzuki" as in Formula V which only run VW Engines Gearbox and chassis so why all the talk such restricted mods????

Why not just restrict things to "Suzuki"
i.e.
As long as all your mods are made for a Sierra or carry a Suzuki part # its ok.

This rules out the monsters on hilux diffs but still serves as an event for modded zooks, if I want to go see a standard sierra doing crazy shit I go on a club trip with a certain yellow 1.0.

I would't go to (Or pay to watch) an event full of standard-ish vehicles, however I would go to watch the like of Gregs, Grimbo's & Critta go head to head.

I say make the mods free as long as they are left Suzuki with perhaps a tyre size restriction of 36 inch.

My two cents.

Steve

[markil]

i think LWB sierra's that are stock apart from 31's should be allowed too

[droopypete]

if some one has a spoa with a z bar and it breaks cause they carn't weld i think its best it breaks competing driving slow other than on the road

Better for them, bad for organisers, someone gets hurt on the road you have TAC, someone gets hurt in a competion, you have LITIGATION.
Peter.

[N*A*M]

i believe a 1 class comp with very tight rules would be better steve. it allows people to enter cheaply and with the confidence that it will be mostly quite fair. let's call it Formula SJ then. i envision a very close to stock truck with some easily achievable mods doing some wicked obstacles and terrain.

i don't see it as a spectator event but rather one for the serious drivers and builders. i would happily rule out spectators to begin with in order to get it off the ground.

there is nothing stopping this from materialising. the obvious hurdles still to be jumped are the rules, the insurance, the venue and the safety. as a member of scouts australia, there might be some coverage there as the manibobar navtrac was run by a rover crew.

[bigsteve]

i believe a 1 class comp with very tight rules would be better steve. it allows people to enter cheaply and with the confidence that it will be mostly quite fair. let's call it Formula SJ then. i envision a very close to stock truck with some easily achievable mods doing some wicked obstacles and terrain.

i don't see it as a spectator event but rather one for the serious drivers and builders. i would happily rule out spectators to begin with in order to get it off the ground.

there is nothing stopping this from materialising. the obvious hurdles still to be jumped are the rules, the insurance, the venue and the safety. as a member of scouts australia, there might be some coverage there as the manibobar navtrac was run by a rover crew.

Fair point, I was only really stating what I wanted to see, in hindsight I'd much rather watch those 3 cars out drive toyotas & nissans anyways.

[redzook]

the obvious hurdles still to be jumped are the rules, the insurance, the venue and the safety. as a member of scouts australia, there might be some coverage there as the manibobar navtrac was run by a rover crew.

cant u just run it like a trip?

we dont need insurance when we go for a run with a few people off the board?

i could be way off?

but i will be at the first 1 when it gets off the ground

[N*A*M]

what does everyone think about roll cages?

is 6 points mounted on 6x10x10cms plates on each side of the floor and NOT tied to the cage sufficient?

what about hardtops? do they need a cage? would exo be okay? how should it be mounted?

[antt]

i'd have to agree with greg, keep it as simple as possible. maybe even a tyre restriction?

everyone has to run 31in MTR's. (you could do a deal with a tyre place. maybe even 32in mongrels, might be able to hook up sponsorship with motorway tires???)
then have a limit on gearing (eg, series3 rockhopper, and fixed diff ratios)
free suspension (no 1/4 or 3/4 elliptic, just fiddling with leaf combo's)
bodylift allowed (max 2in)
set exo cage design
no engine mods
no winch

you say that you don't care about having spectators present, so who cares if they're not fully decked out, active suspension rigs?
i reckon a system like this would be awesome, plenty of high revs, quite a few rolls, but as there is no winching, every just has to give it a bootfull and try to drive it.

[Guy]

A 6 point cage is a really good idea .. especially if your competeing as if you tuble off an ledge etc ... it may be some time before you stop ...

Also sghould be certain rules about the restraint of "additional equipment" in the vehicle ie: cargo barriers etc

I belive a passanger\spotter should be allowed as long as they are mouth breathing bi-pedal lifeforms and are suitably restrained once in the vehicle I see no issue with that ..

so 33's .. road registered.. Still has to appear to be a suzuki (no full on ultra lite tube thingy's) so guards can be cut .. but not completely off ...

what sort of mods can you make with suspension ?? does it still have to be Suzuki leaves ?? or can ot be any leaf IE would Micks Shackle reversed hilux leaf sorta setup be allowed ??

[N*A*M]

what sort of mods can you make with suspension ?? does it still have to be Suzuki leaves ?? or can ot be any leaf IE would Micks Shackle reversed hilux leaf sorta setup be allowed ??

don't ask it. voice your opinion!

[N*A*M]

Also sghould be certain rules about the restraint of "additional equipment" in the vehicle ie: cargo barriers etc

with a short course format, there would be no need for equipment beyond some straps, shackles, and a fire extinguisher.

should it be legal for the spotter to pull on straps?

i'd really like to see something like this get off the ground. i'm quite keen so i'll try to find out about venues and liability etc... and see if we can organise a round 0 of sorts.

[Guy]

well in that case .. what about something like what the formula toy has .. spring mount points cannot be moved by more than 50mm from factory (in any direction) ..
This would allow people to adapt what they have at hand to work (ie 2nd hand hilux springs are worth basically nothing so it makes for a real cheap flexy lift for a Zuk with shelling out $180 a corner for Old Man Emu Stuff) plus allows a slightly wider gene pool so to speak to keep the comp fresh ... lets people try different suspension "systems" out including shackle reversals so long as it falls in the 50mm rule

[Guy]

Also sghould be certain rules about the restraint of "additional equipment" in the vehicle ie: cargo barriers etc

with a short course format, there would be no need for equipment beyond some straps, shackles, and a fire extinguisher.

should it be legal for the spotter to pull on straps?

i'd really like to see something like this get off the ground. i'm quite keen so i'll try to find out about venues and liability etc... and see if we can organise a round 0 of sorts.

Iasked about teh additional gear being properlt stowed as i would hazard a guess that serval of these possible entrants may be arriving at the event in the vehicle they will be running as well as hopefully driving home ..

I think alot of other people are interested in seeing this turkey fly as well.. and if you let pete organise the wet T-Shirt part .. we are sure to get plenty of media attantion ... (for the first wet T-Shirt comp won by the women with the hairyest chest .. )

Seriously though .. I would love to compete in a class like this .. as I seriously think you could get into it for $4000 .. (non engineer approved vehicle)
Body lift say about $150, cut guards a few disks for the 4 inch grinder, and longer shocks $70 at the wrecker, 2nd hand 33's $500 (eg 33 BFG Mt's), a 4.16 rockhopper $500 second hand, welded rear $20 for wire and oil .. perhaps another $20 for bearings if needed and a Lokka'd front .. about $500 .. That still leaves over $2000 for cage, shock mounts etc .. hell if your lucky some could even squeeze a base vehicle into that budget ..

[grimbo]

I reckon a buildup maximum to be similar to Gregs or mine. I'm not saying this because I own it (well I am) but because minus the engines they are basically a cheap setup. SPUA with Old man Emu rear springs all round, 2" BL, guard cutting, 34" tyres, lockers, cages and S3 rockhoppers. All of this could be achieved without too much hassle and maintain a Suzuki only buildup.

I really think to get it off the ground an initial round would have to be done with peoples existing Suzukis to see what sort of enthusiasm is generated. Also to work out format of competition. Cars would be restricted to street driven, registered vehicles with a max tyre size of say 35". Also must be at least 75% Suzuki.

It would be easier and more fun to get out there and do something and build from that than try and nut it all out before hand. i know with Rhino it took until the 6h and final one before we had finally nailed the formula and got it running exactly like we wanted

[greg]

is 6 points mounted on 6x10x10cms plates on each side of the floor and NOT tied to the cage sufficient?

i think you mean tied to the chassis?

[N*A*M]

i was tossing up the idea of not having it tied to the chassis to see what people think

obviously you believe it should be connected to the chassis and i do too; but let's see what other people think?

[greg]

I really think to get it off the ground an initial round would have to be done with peoples existing Suzukis to see what sort of enthusiasm is generated. Also to work out format of competition.

I think this is a good point... I'd be a bit unhappy if i went and bought another car and did it up to compete and the the whole thing fizzled away before it even got started.

[droopypete]

I reckon a buildup maximum to be similar to Gregs or mine. I'm not saying this because I own it (well I am) but because minus the engines they are basically a cheap setup. SPUA with Old man Emu rear springs all round, 2" BL, guard cutting, 34" tyres, lockers, cages and S3 rockhoppers. All of this could be achieved without too much hassle and maintain a Suzuki only buildup.

I really think to get it off the ground an initial round would have to be done with peoples existing Suzukis to see what sort of enthusiasm is generated. Also to work out format of competition. Cars would be restricted to street driven, registered vehicles with a max tyre size of say 35". Also must be at least 75% Suzuki.

It would be easier and more fun to get out there and do something and build from that than try and nut it all out before hand. i know with Rhino it took until the 6h and final one before we had finally nailed the formula and got it running exactly like we wanted

I agree with Graham on some points, like lets get out there with what we got and see what happens, see how much real interest there is (it is easy to get all fired up sitting behind a desk in an airconditioned ofice), it could be as informal as a day at labatoche or similar, a bunch of guys going wheeling together in the interest of good fun, the other side of this coin is the we get to put faces to a lot of names (I am interested to see if Gimbo has hairy palms, and love mud realy is a balding, middle aged, computer nerd) .
We throw in a bunch of tomato stakes and a few witch's hats, find a quiet little corner of the world and have some fun, formula or no formula.
I also agree with the regestered part, but dont even mention road worthy as this is such a can of worms, and I would see trouble enforcing 75% Suzuki, I see what are trying to achive with this Graham, I just think it is hard to regulate.
what I don't agree with is a tyre size much larger than 33 (gregs 34's would have to be my upper limit).
Also Graham, you didn't mention spring overs in your post, where do you stand on this point?
Peter.

[N*A*M]

what about including coily sierras? i don't see why they couldn't participate.

link mounts could be limited to 50mm off the factory position
link lengths could be limited to factory length or maybe 50mm also?

chances are coily sierras would probably be more factory than leafy sierras in the suspension department.

we really should speak to carlton and cal and head up to berridale for a looksee.

[greg]

enough talk about the 34's already

I'm hoping the limit is set at 31 so i have an excuse to buy some boggers (31x12.5)

[droopypete]

what about including coily sierras? i don't see why they couldn't participate.

link mounts could be limited to 50mm off the factory position
link lengths could be limited to factory length or maybe 50mm also?

chances are coily sierras would probably be more factory than leafy sierras in the suspension department.

we really should speak to carlton and cal and head up to berridale for a looksee.

I personaly have no problem with factory coilers, but as this is aimed at low bucks motorsport I would think a coiler would be to expencive as a base.
Peter.