Hi Guys, just curious to find out if the story on Warfs on the supercharged build for the feroza was ever finished and succesful??
Cheers
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Supercharged article
Moderator: Tiny
All to true......
It actually ran on the engine dyno a few times, at the 120kW mark ( made more but reliability suggested this was a good compromize ) but then had an opportunity to get a VERY VERY rare Mazda BPD turbo engine AND a matching bellhousing to fit it to my auto.
The BPD is a works engine ( used in the Familia WRC rally cars ) with forged pistons, rod, crank, full crank girdle etc etc - a VERY cool 1.8 DOHC turbo engine. I looooove good engines and so the supercharged Hatsu engine stopped dead in its tracks. 200kW in a Feroza - much more "interesting".
The sudden revision of plans was all possible as I fluked a bellhousing to match the BPD to the AW4 auto and my driveline isn't stock ( no standard bits at all..... ) - and was designed to handle bags of extra torque from day one ( custom axles, reduction gears, torque converter, lockers , 4 wheel disks etc etc )
However any of the BP series engines ( normally aspirated or turbo ) would make a fantastic Feroza engine - if you can get the required bits. They are a truly magic engine. Variants of the BP are/were used in the MX5
156 kW stock - makes over 200kW with a bit more boost. Legally and practically however its an interesting question that i'm still pondering as other toys seem to be getting all the attention ATM
I'm in no rush - engineering takes time and lots of "pondering", f@#$ups happen quickly.
I've got another new blower system under my bench at the moment ( sold the prototype awhile ago ) , so if anyones interested in parts you just can't buy and is prepared to do the work then.......
But keep in mind that everything we are discussing isn't cheap - you don't start modifying ANY 4wd unless you clearly understand that in commercial terms it isn't going to make lots of sense. For example a rebuilt auto costs a couple of grand - more than some Feroza's are worth on the market, yet using an unknown second hand one risks having it all play up.
Do it once - do it properly IF you choose to head down that path.
It actually ran on the engine dyno a few times, at the 120kW mark ( made more but reliability suggested this was a good compromize ) but then had an opportunity to get a VERY VERY rare Mazda BPD turbo engine AND a matching bellhousing to fit it to my auto.
The BPD is a works engine ( used in the Familia WRC rally cars ) with forged pistons, rod, crank, full crank girdle etc etc - a VERY cool 1.8 DOHC turbo engine. I looooove good engines and so the supercharged Hatsu engine stopped dead in its tracks. 200kW in a Feroza - much more "interesting".
The sudden revision of plans was all possible as I fluked a bellhousing to match the BPD to the AW4 auto and my driveline isn't stock ( no standard bits at all..... ) - and was designed to handle bags of extra torque from day one ( custom axles, reduction gears, torque converter, lockers , 4 wheel disks etc etc )
However any of the BP series engines ( normally aspirated or turbo ) would make a fantastic Feroza engine - if you can get the required bits. They are a truly magic engine. Variants of the BP are/were used in the MX5
156 kW stock - makes over 200kW with a bit more boost. Legally and practically however its an interesting question that i'm still pondering as other toys seem to be getting all the attention ATM
I'm in no rush - engineering takes time and lots of "pondering", f@#$ups happen quickly.
I've got another new blower system under my bench at the moment ( sold the prototype awhile ago ) , so if anyones interested in parts you just can't buy and is prepared to do the work then.......
But keep in mind that everything we are discussing isn't cheap - you don't start modifying ANY 4wd unless you clearly understand that in commercial terms it isn't going to make lots of sense. For example a rebuilt auto costs a couple of grand - more than some Feroza's are worth on the market, yet using an unknown second hand one risks having it all play up.
Do it once - do it properly IF you choose to head down that path.
( usual disclaimers )
It seemed like a much better idea when I started it than it does now.
It seemed like a much better idea when I started it than it does now.
I am not looking for a huge increase just give it a bit more bottom end and the supercharged idea looked good, i also like how you made it look like a stock install which makes for more pleasing under bonnet asthetics, I have the equipment and skill to do the Job i just didnt want to re invent the wheel if some one had allready done so, so any info/ideas would be great!
Cheers
Cheers
Ok - step one.... fix the traditional Feroza overheating / detonation issue.
This will require a larger radiator, thermostat relocation and either an electric water pump or a properly built mechanical one ( the stock mechanical pump is rubbish and its a desigh issue - poor shape and crap clearances - spends most of its life cavitating......). You'll also need to do some reworking of the water passages in the head, the water flow around the combusion chambers is patchy causing local overheating and detonation )
If you can't run bags of advance ( say 5 deg more than stock on a 35 C day off road ) on your motor without it pinging then stay away from forced aspiration.
its not wasted time, even if you don't charge it - solving this HD engine issue willl make your Feroza ownership experience MUCH more acceptable.
This will require a larger radiator, thermostat relocation and either an electric water pump or a properly built mechanical one ( the stock mechanical pump is rubbish and its a desigh issue - poor shape and crap clearances - spends most of its life cavitating......). You'll also need to do some reworking of the water passages in the head, the water flow around the combusion chambers is patchy causing local overheating and detonation )
If you can't run bags of advance ( say 5 deg more than stock on a 35 C day off road ) on your motor without it pinging then stay away from forced aspiration.
its not wasted time, even if you don't charge it - solving this HD engine issue willl make your Feroza ownership experience MUCH more acceptable.
( usual disclaimers )
It seemed like a much better idea when I started it than it does now.
It seemed like a much better idea when I started it than it does now.
The Mazda BP engines were also fitted to KF and KH Ford Laser TX3's (both in turbo and NA configs.)
I owned a 1990 KF Laser 4WD turbo the turbo variant fitted. An electronic boost controller, ECU mods, turbo mods and a decent exhaust system gave 124kW at the wheels running 14PSI. That was in the days of only having 95 octane fuel too.
I owned a 1990 KF Laser 4WD turbo the turbo variant fitted. An electronic boost controller, ECU mods, turbo mods and a decent exhaust system gave 124kW at the wheels running 14PSI. That was in the days of only having 95 octane fuel too.
David
Ok MM what have you got under your bench exactly?? any pics and pricing would be appreciated PM if you wish.MightyMouse wrote:I've got another new blower system under my bench at the moment ( sold the prototype awhile ago ) , so if anyones interested in parts you just can't buy and is prepared to do the work then.......
Cheers
Had a look - and was a "bit" surprised myself.....
There's :
Blower drive crank pulley extension
Clutched SC14 Supercharger
Drive belt
Supercharger lower mount ( Uses the AC mounts so ....... )
Supercharger upper mount / tensioner
Supercharger discharge pipe
Supercharger intake manifold and 75mm throttle body
Throttle body 90Deg air intake hat,
Intake manifold ( with backward facing inlet - opposite to Feroza )
Intake manifold to pipe adapter
PWR air/water intercooler ( fits to blower discharge )
Intercooler water pump
intercooler mount / silicone tubes / clamps etc etc.
There's also
an ignition pickup - goes in where the Feroza dissy was but generates timing pulses for an aftermarket ECU - ie distributorless.
a holddown bracket for 4 coil on plug ignition coils - ie no distributor or leads...
fuel rail etc etc......
actually "rather" a lot of stuff
There's :
Blower drive crank pulley extension
Clutched SC14 Supercharger
Drive belt
Supercharger lower mount ( Uses the AC mounts so ....... )
Supercharger upper mount / tensioner
Supercharger discharge pipe
Supercharger intake manifold and 75mm throttle body
Throttle body 90Deg air intake hat,
Intake manifold ( with backward facing inlet - opposite to Feroza )
Intake manifold to pipe adapter
PWR air/water intercooler ( fits to blower discharge )
Intercooler water pump
intercooler mount / silicone tubes / clamps etc etc.
There's also
an ignition pickup - goes in where the Feroza dissy was but generates timing pulses for an aftermarket ECU - ie distributorless.
a holddown bracket for 4 coil on plug ignition coils - ie no distributor or leads...
fuel rail etc etc......
actually "rather" a lot of stuff
( usual disclaimers )
It seemed like a much better idea when I started it than it does now.
It seemed like a much better idea when I started it than it does now.
Yep they are very good engine family IMO, even normally aspirated thy make good power and drive very well. The production turbo variants were impressive and the "D" rally motor is even more of a good thing.murcod wrote:The Mazda BP engines were also fitted to KF and KH Ford Laser TX3's (both in turbo and NA configs.)
I owned a 1990 KF Laser 4WD turbo the turbo variant fitted. An electronic boost controller, ECU mods, turbo mods and a decent exhaust system gave 124kW at the wheels running 14PSI. That was in the days of only having 95 octane fuel too.
If you've got an auto Feroza ( or Vitara actually ) or converted to auto and can get the correct bellhousing to bolt the bits togehter then a very cool Feroza is on the cards....
The turbo's live in a bit of a bad position ( the BPD etc was originally transverse ) so an interesting engine mout has to be fabricated andd the sumps all wrong but........ the possibilitites
( usual disclaimers )
It seemed like a much better idea when I started it than it does now.
It seemed like a much better idea when I started it than it does now.
That nearly sounds like everything you need to get something happening, soooo is it for sale and if so (if you dont mind me asking!) what do you want for it all?? Also what were your thoughts on the standard compression ratio does it need to be lowered to stay on pump fuel with the boost increase??MightyMouse wrote:Had a look - and was a "bit" surprised myself.....
There's :
Blower drive crank pulley extension
Clutched SC14 Supercharger
Drive belt
Supercharger lower mount ( Uses the AC mounts so ....... )
Supercharger upper mount / tensioner
Supercharger discharge pipe
Supercharger intake manifold and 75mm throttle body
Throttle body 90Deg air intake hat,
Intake manifold ( with backward facing inlet - opposite to Feroza )
Intake manifold to pipe adapter
PWR air/water intercooler ( fits to blower discharge )
Intercooler water pump
intercooler mount / silicone tubes / clamps etc etc.
There's also
an ignition pickup - goes in where the Feroza dissy was but generates timing pulses for an aftermarket ECU - ie distributorless.
a holddown bracket for 4 coil on plug ignition coils - ie no distributor or leads...
fuel rail etc etc......
actually "rather" a lot of stuff
Cheers
Yes - its all for sale ( well i don't have an immediate plan for it is more correct ...... )
Its not a kit..... so there's still work to be done, i'll ponder the $$ - nothing listed is junk - or without value so the collection certainly ain't free
Decompression is REQUIRED absolutley, as we all know the damm things ping normally aspirated so boost needs work. The degree of engine modification will control just how low you need to go.
Its not a kit..... so there's still work to be done, i'll ponder the $$ - nothing listed is junk - or without value so the collection certainly ain't free
Decompression is REQUIRED absolutley, as we all know the damm things ping normally aspirated so boost needs work. The degree of engine modification will control just how low you need to go.
( usual disclaimers )
It seemed like a much better idea when I started it than it does now.
It seemed like a much better idea when I started it than it does now.
Definately the way to go if its a sorted package, lots of work required to DIY from scratch
However buying someone else's project might leave you with their problems / compromizes. Turbo Feroza's don't have enough bottom end
torque gain for my liking ( well mine didn't anyway ) without running a overly small exhaust housing which ineviatabley causes other problems.
Also consider the drive line... Feroza's break boxes/transfers stock so with boost ? Once again nothing on mine is standard.
If its was for road use its more acceptable, but mine is a weekend warrior that gets used HARD ( reduction gears / lockers etc etc... ) so supercharged is my preference for torque.
But if its done well ( and the right price of course ) then it would be very attractive.
However buying someone else's project might leave you with their problems / compromizes. Turbo Feroza's don't have enough bottom end
torque gain for my liking ( well mine didn't anyway ) without running a overly small exhaust housing which ineviatabley causes other problems.
Also consider the drive line... Feroza's break boxes/transfers stock so with boost ? Once again nothing on mine is standard.
If its was for road use its more acceptable, but mine is a weekend warrior that gets used HARD ( reduction gears / lockers etc etc... ) so supercharged is my preference for torque.
But if its done well ( and the right price of course ) then it would be very attractive.
( usual disclaimers )
It seemed like a much better idea when I started it than it does now.
It seemed like a much better idea when I started it than it does now.
Just had a look at the build up on WARFS and my supercharger install was very similar, albeit without the flash brackets
I used a S/C off a 1GGZE Toyota motor. It was relatively simple to set up and install, but getting it to run right and become efficient isn't easy especially if using a stock motor. Still made for an improvement, but wasn't left on as it would of become to unreliable on a stock donk.
I used a S/C off a 1GGZE Toyota motor. It was relatively simple to set up and install, but getting it to run right and become efficient isn't easy especially if using a stock motor. Still made for an improvement, but wasn't left on as it would of become to unreliable on a stock donk.
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