6.5 Chevy in Cruiser

[Moonshine]

Gday everyone, Im finally moving onto bigger and better things (79 Series cruiser from SS ute) and was wondering how much engineering certs cost for swapping out engines as im looking at dropping a 6.5L chevy in the cruiser once i get rid of my SS after xmas.

Any info on this would be awesome thx

[crankycruiser]

Pull the motor out of ur SS and put it in the cruiser, will be 10X's the motor and cost less to do!

Seriously tho, there are better alternatives than the dirty ol junk box 6.5. they are heavy slow and WAY overrated.

[Moonshine]

yeah i was thinking that but with an upgraded turbo (possibly a GT3788R-1) it would be able to pull some serious HP and Torque, also i dont need something that does a million miles an hour cause that gets me in trouble so id rather load of torque

[crankycruiser]

yeah i was thinking that but with an upgraded turbo (possibly a GT3788R-1) it would be able to pull some serious HP and Torque, also i dont need something that does a million miles an hour cause that gets me in trouble so id rather load of torque

Even turbo'ed they arent much of a motor, quiet a few people have problems with them, do a bit of a search on this site, u will find a load of info

[Moonshine]

ok cool thanks mate

[dogbreath_48]

What motor is currently in the cruiser? A decent turbo on a 1hz will be better than the chev, a stock 1hd-fte is already better than a chev!

[Wambat]

the problem with the chev that i have learned so far is that the head is susceptible to heat spots, and once you turbo it it makes it worse. like the guys said, turbo the standard diesel. or if you got the coin, go a duramax,

[thrashlux]

1hdfte for win
would be easier to fit
more reliable
more power
use less fuel than any 1hz turbo or not
cost less over all
if you want to go crazy get a 100 series version itercool it properly put on a 3 inch then you can toast the new toyota v8

[Moonshine]

ok cool as, thanks for the feed back fella's

is it possible to get the conversion kits for the duramax engines? Also my CPL said if your going to run loads of torque the toyota 5 spd wont handle it and should put a patrol box in it. any thoughts on this?

also just looked on ebay at 1HD-FTE engines...they asking $6500 for a remanufactured engine

[thrashlux]

ok cool as, thanks for the feed back fella's

is it possible to get the conversion kits for the duramax engines? Also my CPL said if your going to run loads of torque the toyota 5 spd wont handle it and should put a patrol box in it. any thoughts on this?

ok well you wont be running a 5 speed with the duramax best to run the alison 6 speed auto
do you know how much a duramax cost?
they are not cheap we are talking almost 18k for motor box and wiring with no installation or anything most conversions with dura max will cost upward of 28k fitted
you dont need a patrol box (its all wrong) just a h150 series box insted of the little one you have now

[Moonshine]

ok cool as, thanks for the feed back fella's

is it possible to get the conversion kits for the duramax engines? Also my CPL said if your going to run loads of torque the toyota 5 spd wont handle it and should put a patrol box in it. any thoughts on this?

ok well you wont be running a 5 speed with the duramax best to run the alison 6 speed auto
do you know how much a duramax cost?
they are not cheap we are talking almost 18k for motor box and wiring with no installation or anything most conversions with dura max will cost upward of 28k fitted
you dont need a patrol box (its all wrong) just a h150 series box insted of the little one you have now

duramax - 6.6L Duramax LMM Complete 2007 TO 2009 cost $8,700 plus delivery to australia so add another grand. Also ive almost finished my diesel mechanics apprenticeship so should be right with all the installation etc and you can pick up the ECM for them from the states fairly cheap. Its just the conversion kit that is the hard part i reckon

[thrashlux]

ok cool as, thanks for the feed back fella's

is it possible to get the conversion kits for the duramax engines? Also my CPL said if your going to run loads of torque the toyota 5 spd wont handle it and should put a patrol box in it. any thoughts on this?

ok well you wont be running a 5 speed with the duramax best to run the alison 6 speed auto
do you know how much a duramax cost?
they are not cheap we are talking almost 18k for motor box and wiring with no installation or anything most conversions with dura max will cost upward of 28k fitted
you dont need a patrol box (its all wrong) just a h150 series box insted of the little one you have now

duramax - 6.6L Duramax LMM Complete 2007 TO 2009 cost $8,700 plus delivery to australia so add another grand. Also ive almost finished my diesel mechanics apprenticeship so should be right with all the installation etc and you can pick up the ECM for them from the states fairly cheap. Its just the conversion kit that is the hard part i reckon

yeah i looked into man thats just the donk no box no accerories remember you have duties and taxes on top
there are a bout 4 diferent variants of the LMM depending on the truck they came from there is 100 hp diff
ecm wiring loom and is the problem getting all the modules and all matched from the same kind
cheapest delivered with all the stuff was 16 g
i am planning this conversion into my own truck instead of running toyo transfer i am going to flip my front diff
there is no "kit as such" the 5 speed wont handel the torque thats why nobody does one
patrol included the alison is the way to go so bingo thats why it costs 16 g

[Moonshine]

ah ok, well sounds like a real pain in the ass to do a duramax atm as they are fairly new conversion idea.

Going up to denco diesel in wagga as they the garrett dealer and they goin to let me know the turbo's that you can run on the 6.5L chevys and ill see what advantages that will have and post back the stats so everyone can see them.

[Tiny]

I have a 6.2 N\A in my 73, i love the sound and has loads of torque and more than enough HP for my needs. I bought it with it allready done though and if I were to have the thing sitting here with the OE 3.3 I wouldnt do tihe 6.2/5 personally a duramax if you wanted to stick with chev would be the go as alleady mentioned but a 4bt or 6bt are options as are a few others, isuzu included. I would like to make a detroit series 92 9l or 12l fit into something ffor the hell of it, big diesel rat rod of some description lol

[Moonshine]

yeah, but i dont just wanna make a comp truck, i want something i can go on adventures and make my own paths but also need enough grunt and torque to economically pull a large boat. That why i was looking at the 6.5L cause Explore OZ were saying it does good fuel economy towing stuff so yeah.

Also mate if you going a detroit 2 stroke go the 6V53T with a TX100 3 speed behind it (allison i think) cause that what the ASLAV and old M113 have in them

[Moonshine]

I have a 6.2 N\A in my 73, i love the sound and has loads of torque and more than enough HP for my needs. I bought it with it allready done though and if I were to have the thing sitting here with the OE 3.3 I wouldnt do tihe 6.2/5 personally a duramax if you wanted to stick with chev would be the go as alleady mentioned but a 4bt or 6bt are options as are a few others, isuzu included. I would like to make a detroit series 92 9l or 12l fit into something ffor the hell of it, big diesel rat rod of some description lol

is it possible to get conversion kits for the 6bt (5.9L cummin's straight 6) to fit either a cruiser or patrol?

[thrashlux]

they have been fitted b4 but....
The 4bt is more realistic to fit they are really big engines
even so the 4bt puts out about 95 kw revs out to a staggering 2500 rpm probably about 14ltrs per 100
the 6bt about 135kw also revs out to a staggering 2500 rpm probably about 15 or 16 ltrs per 100
1hz (non turbo )96 kw goes to about 4000 rpm on a good day proabaly about 12 or 13 ltrs per hundred
1hdfte stk 100 series 151kw revs to about about 4300 rpm ,about 11-12 ltrs per hundred

what it boils down to is you will be able to to do around 100kph in either of the b series engines but never overtake cause they wont rev high enough you will be lucky to crack 110 kph
you could tow a train with em because they have heaps of torque but they are not very powerful your truck wont go fast

[Moonshine]

yeah but the earlier 6bt engines were used as race engines cause of there simplicity and the only limitation on them is the mechanical fuel pump governor which u can adjust the position of the spring to change it. same set up as the army rovers, very simple but bloody bullet proof (till u put an army driver in it)

but the 6bt can be coupled with a NV4500 5 spd manual and a atlas transfer case from 3.0:1 to 6.5:1 (i think) and then u get the different flags to mate it up and they recommend that box for the cummins and also NV recommend it for short wheel base (in comparison to yank tanks) vehicles liek the land cruiser.

[Moonshine]

they have been fitted b4 but....
The 4bt is more realistic to fit they are really big engines
even so the 4bt puts out about 95 kw revs out to a staggering 2500 rpm probably about 14ltrs per 100
the 6bt about 135kw also revs out to a staggering 2500 rpm probably about 15 or 16 ltrs per 100
1hz (non turbo )96 kw goes to about 4000 rpm on a good day proabaly about 12 or 13 ltrs per hundred
1hdfte stk 100 series 151kw revs to about about 4300 rpm ,about 11-12 ltrs per hundred

what it boils down to is you will be able to to do around 100kph in either of the b series engines but never overtake cause they wont rev high enough you will be lucky to crack 110 kph
you could tow a train with em because they have heaps of torque but they are not very powerful your truck wont go fast

your a 4x4 mate, horsepower and kw are nothing, ya want loads of torque. I was told "Horsepower sells engines..but torque wins races" and if i look at my LS1 its torque curve runs out at 4400rpm of 6500rpm

[thrashlux]

they have been fitted b4 but....
The 4bt is more realistic to fit they are really big engines
even so the 4bt puts out about 95 kw revs out to a staggering 2500 rpm probably about 14ltrs per 100
the 6bt about 135kw also revs out to a staggering 2500 rpm probably about 15 or 16 ltrs per 100
1hz (non turbo )96 kw goes to about 4000 rpm on a good day proabaly about 12 or 13 ltrs per hundred
1hdfte stk 100 series 151kw revs to about about 4300 rpm ,about 11-12 ltrs per hundred

what it boils down to is you will be able to to do around 100kph in either of the b series engines but never overtake cause they wont rev high enough you will be lucky to crack 110 kph
you could tow a train with em because they have heaps of torque but they are not very powerful your truck wont go fast

your a 4x4 mate, horsepower and kw are nothing, ya want loads of torque. I was told "Horsepower sells engines..but torque wins races" and if i look at my LS1 its torque curve runs out at 4400rpm of 6500rpm

well just do it then
i think you will find that the toyota 1hdfte is not too far down on torque over a 6bt its just it has almost double the amount of usable rev range over idle and wil use heaps less fuel u have almost full torque from 1200 rpm all the way to about 3200 very flexable torquey engine = dont need to change gears as much
see how many races you win against a 100 series factory turbo

[badger]

Moonshine, i think you need to sit back and rethink this. You are trying to reinvent the wheel for no real gain at all.

First up turbod 1hz or 1hd Fte will make the same usable level of power more efficiently than either the chev or the cummins.
second the toyota motors are bolt in conversions. neither the chev or the cummins are.
Both american motors are designed to rev out at around the 2500 rpm mark. That is 100km/hr in a cruiser ute with standard gearing, so you would have to find some diff gears around the 3.5 or taller to make use of your low revs properly. Once you do this you will require more torque to push your car around with taller gearing.
Im not sure abut fitment of the chev but i know for sure you will have to do a body lift and lower your front bumpstops just to get a cummins in the engine bay

As cool as both motors sound and as cool as it would be to say to your mates you fitted a big yank diesel it is a total waste of time and money when Toyota factory fits motors to the model of ute you have that far out perform both the chev and the cummins. (ive driven both yank conversions and i own a turbo 1hz 79 series and a fte 80 and a fte 100)
I also think you will find it hard to get such conversions complyed in a 79 series as it would be newer than the motor you are putting in the car.

If you realy want to chev it go a petrol or pony up for the duramax .................. it aint as cheap as you think either

[Moonshine]

ok fair enough, well how much would i be looking at for one of these 1HD-FTE engines? also with the stock cruiser engine out of a 79 series (1HZ i think) are they already turbo'd? how much hp and torque could i get from one of those 2 engines?

[crankycruiser]

ok fair enough, well how much would i be looking at for one of these 1HD-FTE engines? also with the stock cruiser engine out of a 79 series (1HZ i think) are they already turbo'd? how much hp and torque could i get from one of those 2 engines?

Didnt the 78/79's come out with a 1HD-FTE? just non intercooled?

[Moonshine]

im not sure mate, dont know to much about cruiser/patrol engines, yeah if its a LS1 i can tell u about it but not sure about these ones

also i was just having a squiz around the forum and think the 1HD-FTE only come in the 78 troopies & 100 series cruiser (sahara is all i could find them in), but can always find one of them hehe pickles.com.au

[thrashlux]

the 79 series came out with 2 diferent 6 cyliner diesel engines



most common and cheaper 1hz this is non turbo 12 valve mech indirectly injected with no elec control at all this coupled to an r150 5 speed manual (same as hilux)
power out put about 96 kw and 285 nm

a good reliable engine in std form or when fitted with extractors
there are many aftermarket turbo kits for this engine most of these kits will make an extra 30kw or so over na
to do this you have to turn up the fuel on the injector pump

that is all well and good and some people will swear black and blue this is fine BUT............
there is an ever growing group of people due to personal experience (myself included) that this will be the death of the 1hz
this is due to the inherent design of the 1hz its self it is an indirectly injected engine this means their is a chamber that the injector sits in where the combustion actually begins before entering the cylinder its self (precombustion chamber)
the flame front and burning fuel then has to pass thru a small hole (while on fire) into the cylinder then finally finishes combustion and pushes the piston down
so what happens when you put more fuel boost etc into a 1hz well you force more than was ever designed thru that hole causing heaps of heat as it cannot get thru quick enough
problems are
the metal around this area get 2 hot and heat cracks occur first in the precomchambers then due to 2 different types of metals being used in the precomchambers and the head they swell at different rates cracking the head to the point that combuston gas escapes into the water jackets

also pistons crack
i am sure you will understand all this as you are a diesel mech
basically if you want to do towing or place you truck under load then dont turbo the 1hz
+ your r series gearbox will die as well when loaded

ok phew
the 79series also came out with the 1hdfte it is a 24 valve directly injected turbo charged engine with electronic control and the H150 gearbox ( same as 80 series)
power out put 122 kW with 380 Nm
this engine does not have any of those 1hz problems because the fuel is injected straight into the cylinder also 4 valves gives you better gas flow = power
gearbox is very strong suitable for towing etc


then ontop of that there is the 100 series 1HDFTE
this motor looks the same as the one from the ute but its not
it has many diferent parts to the lesser ute version main power producing ones are --- injector pump , turbo,ecu and an intercooler
this version puts out 151kw and about 430-440 nm but the main difference is how it does it it does this torque from 1200 rpm all the way to 3200
there is no easy way to increase the power of the ute engine as you need to change all those components mentioned to get the power
the ecu in the 100 is mapped to around 18.5 and normal boost is 16.5
the ute version will go thru fuel cut at about 15 psi and normal boost is set about 11.5
there is no way of getting around this "fuel cut"
the 100 series version can easily be made to put out over 180kw and close to 600nm with 3 inch exhaust, bigger cooler and chip

so ultimate for your truck would be a 79 series td box + 100 series engine

[Moonshine]

ok cool, so dont get a N/A engine and turbo it cause the head cant handle it and the indirect injection is crap anyways and a pain in the arse fullstop. Im thinking get a wrecked 100 series and pull the diffs out and engine, gearbox, transfer case etc etc and use what i need and just sell the other stuff off.

What would be better though? 79 Series gearbox or 100 series
Also which diffs are best?

is it common for dyno tuning places to tune cruisers? cause if they tuned them on the dyno like an LS1 they would get the best results

[Moonshine]

so this is what ive come up with so far:
1HD-FTE engine from 100 series
Upgraded Diffs as previously stated
79 Series Gearbox and Transfer Case
35" Pro Comp Xtreme Mud Terrain
Pro Comp Steel Wheels
3" Lift from suspesnionstuff.com
Snorkel
Diff breathers
Customised Aluminium tray - like armygeddon
ARB Bullbar with winch
Towbar
Galvo dip chassis

can you think of anything else i really need that is essential and not just costmetic

[thrashlux]

most 100 series are auto the ones that are manual have full time transfers on them these are longer than the part timer

your diffs are ok you could change the ratios to 4.1 or 3.9 if they are not already and fit airlockers and
longfields to the front

[Swag_Man]

may want to add a lotto win in there as well

i may hi-jack this thread as i am planning a similar build in the future... so sorry in advance

back to the weak r150 gear box, can you bolt a 80 box strait up to replace it, these have their own inherent problems but are also much easier to get hold of..

and over the years lots of people have turbo'd the 1hz so would it not be safe to assume there may be a way to do it. That could work i mean there will be issues but yeah.. i am by no means a mechanic but just thought its a block that has been around a while. and getting hold of a 79 with one is much easier to.. i am all for the engine and gear box swop but i know from experience that it is never really that easy.. even if it just 'bolts' in...

cheers
and sorry for the hi-jack

[thrashlux]

may want to add a lotto win in there as well

i may hi-jack this thread as i am planning a similar build in the future... so sorry in advance

back to the weak r150 gear box, can you bolt a 80 box strait up to replace it, these have their own inherent problems but are also much easier to get hold of..

and over the years lots of people have turbo'd the 1hz so would it not be safe to assume there may be a way to do it. That could work i mean there will be issues but yeah.. i am by no means a mechanic but just thought its a block that has been around a while. and getting hold of a 79 with one is much easier to.. i am all for the engine and gear box swop but i know from experience that it is never really that easy.. even if it just 'bolts' in...

cheers
and sorry for the hi-jack

there are actualy 3 different length 80 series man boxes mainly due to transfer diferences
they are
factory part time = 79 series
full time
full time viscous
so not all 80 series box will fit without mods and the part timer is not super common
but they dont really have many problems

the hz turbo debate will last for eternity while there are people that have had limited experience with any that have done many kms with a load on one first hand
there are more seeing the light as time goes on but other wise i would not do it unless its a weekend warior

i have done heaps of these conversions and they ARE a bolt in and they ARE easy
as long as you get all the stuff you need b4 you start it can be done in a few days