New Warn 6hp gets HOT! URGENT troubleshooting help needed.

[BabyGodzillaGTi-R]

Hi there i am in the market for either the above winch to replace my "Ding Dong Ching Chong 12000lb" winch.
It will be installed on my Daihatsu Rocky.

However i can't decide if i should run the 9.5XP or the M8274.
Let's just compare stock to stock and let's not talking about modding the winch.
I just want a reliable working winch that can pull me through miles of mud in the Malaysian jungles and i plan to do more recreational offroading that competing.
I know all the good points about the M8274 but i'm trying to convince myself to consider the 9.5XP simply because it's lighter, its a low mount (hence i don't need to modify the current winch plate) and cheaper.

Plus when you compare it on paper as we all know that the 9.5XP apparently pulls faster under load as compared to the M8274.

However my main question is how would both winches rate in the real world. Can the 9.5XP be a dependable winch and really pull faster and harder than the ancient but proven 8274 when the going gets tough?
Just want to know everyone thoughts before i bite the bullet and buy a new winch.
Love to hear more reviews from XP owners..

However if i do go M8274 i don't really know what it takes to fit one on to my truck. I'm pretty hopeless when it comes to fabricating stuff.
Would this winch fit to my truck and it's worth every $ and the extra dead weight over the 9.5XP?

Noticed this forum doesn't have a polling thingy.
How much does the above winches cost at retail down in OZ btw?

Thanks in advance guys.

My front looks like this. Might need ideas how to fit the high mount if i go all out. However i wonder if i need to lower the winch mounting further to fit the M8274. Also noticed i might need to chop away the bar where the lights are mounted.

[GUtripper]

I have a XP9.5 with rope on a GU (lots of bar work and extra weight) .
I also previously ran a mildly modded (rope/bracing etc, but stock motor) highmount on a 2500kg wagon.

On a light rig like yours, a stock highmount would be a touch slower than the 9.5 under load, but I dont think there would be that much in it. Additionally, I dont think the extra bar work to make a highmount fit would be worth it. Having the motor higher would be the only advantage I could think of.

Go the lowmount. If you are going to be winching in mud lots (by the sounds of it) make sure its well sealed, and fit some external breathers.

[BabyGodzillaGTi-R]

I have a XP9.5 with rope on a GU (lots of bar work and extra weight) .
I also previously ran a mildly modded (rope/bracing etc, but stock motor) highmount on a 2500kg wagon.
On a light rig like yours, a stock highmount would be a touch slower than the 9.5 under load, but I dont think there would be that much in it. Additionally, I dont think the extra bar work to make a highmount fit would be worth it. Having the motor higher would be the only advantage I could think of.
Go the lowmount. If you are going to be winching in mud lots (by the sounds of it) make sure its well sealed, and fit some external breathers.

Thanks for the reply.
So 1 vote for the 9.5XP low mount for now.
My dad is also against the idea of a highmount on my truck as he deems it will make the truck too nose heavy, too fast and dangerous for me.

So you personally think its not worth the trouble for me re fabricate the bars to fit the M8274?
In a worst case scenario i could ditch the current factory "bull bar" as the current winch mount is seperated from it (mine is mounted direct to the chassis).

Btw i dont get it what do u mean by "I have a XP9.5 with rope on a GU (lots of bar work and extra weight)"
U mean u had to do lots of fabrication to fit the winch or you are saying you have lots of dead weight (bull bar, armour this and that) on your truck.

Are the M8274 and the 9.5XP sealed from the factory or i need to pull our the motor housing to silicon it? Breathers? They have stock breathers or you need to tap/drill one for it?

I tried to search on the forum but couldnt find much info. How should i fabricate the M8274 winch bracket/cradle mounts (the shop doesn't supply them). You guys have any dimension for them? How thick should the steel be? Also is it ok if i just make an "L" if viewed from the side or i better make a "Triangle" or gusset them for strength.
As for the bottom mounting for the winch bracket/cradle would it be ok if i bolt them using the existing Mounting Bolt Pattern: 10.0" x 4.5" (254mm x 114.3mm).

Thanks in advance and excuse the clueless questions of mine.
Cheers.

[CRUZAAMAD]

make it out of 6mm, like a C two folds, if you wont use the existing bar, i put another 3mm sheet in front and welded it out, just modified the bar a little.
yes use the existing bolt holes.

[BabyGodzillaGTi-R]

Dont understand this bit: "like a C two folds, if you wont use the existing bar, i put another 3mm sheet in front and welded it out"
Appreciate if you could elaborate abit further.
Hope it's not to much to ask but would be great if you guys can post up some pics if any.
Will try to post up better pics of my winch plate in due course.
cheers.

[Mosko111]

I think he measns extra barwork like exo cage, sliders, rear bar??

Either way you go make sure you run large size cables from winch to battery and maybe upgrade your alternator? As pulling through mud would drain battery life pretty quickly I would presume,

So- Larger cables, good quality battery, an alternator that is able to supply good co stant power to the battery, and run a breather hose from winch motor to somewhere up
high in the engine bay, (being a new winch they could possibly have the breather hose and fitting on winch,

[BabyGodzillaGTi-R]

Just curious what cables did u upgrade to?
Would 400amp welding cables do the job?

[Mosko111]

Just curious what cables did u upgrade to?
Would 400amp welding cables do the job?

I'm not sure what amperage, but pretty sure it's 75grade if that helps,

[CRUZAAMAD]

you mention a L.
that would be a bad idea.
u need to fold it like a U.

when i modified my bullbar i just laminated the section where the winch was put into the bar.
ill get a photo up for you...just give me a couple of days.

only the area where the winch is mounted needs bracing to the bullbar plates that mount the bullbar to the vehicle chassis.

[gudge]

400 amp welding cable will do just fine, but the bigger the better. And I think u refering to 70mm2 mosko. Also another vote for the lowmount, less parts to fail, the 6hp motor on the xp9500 has a greater duty cycle and will pull a smaller car like urs all day. The highmount really only wins with it's no load line speed, and is suited to competitions and is usually highly modified.

[BabyGodzillaGTi-R]

Ok 9.5xp 3 votes
M8274 0 votes

When u guys mean higher duty cycle means i've more winching time than the M8274?
I'm surprised... I would have thought the M8274 is a proven and reliable design compared to the 9.5XP.
I was half expecting everyone would recommend me to go for the highmount especially after i've ditched the ding dong ching chong winch 120lb winch.

What really makes me like the 9.5 XP is down to packaging and its far cheaper than the highmount.
It's just me trying to convince myself if the highmount is justifiable.

Just curious does the M8274 still uses the old school solenoid or they have moved on to the Albright style solenoid.
Coz i was looking at the owners manual and i noticed on page 8 it looks like an Albright style solenoid.
http://www.warn.com/truck/winches/src/i ... 2D6_RS.pdf

The typical 4x4 tracks in Malaysia...
My regular 4x4 buddies
http://www.4x4earth.com.au/watch-4wdtv/?e=216

[tas80]

Another vote for the XP, I have one that I used to run on my 105 series and now have on my Patrol, will keep the mounting so much simpler sticking with a lowmount.

And a pic of the winch bar I used to run on my old Rocky.

[turbo gu]

My vote is a high mount with a 6hp motor!! It bolts straight on and pulls harder than a teenage boy
It will pull alot harder than a XP.
I have a high mount on my GU ute with a 6 hp and compared to a mates GQ ute with a XP I would take a high mount any day!! they both run Albright solenoids and good cable
As mention make sure you have good cables to the motor and a really good battery.

[Petes]

I had 9.5xp's front and rear to start with. After about 3 months, I sold the front one and fitted an 8274-50.

A bit later on I swapped the motors around.

Personally I would go the 8274. Mine has now been on for a good few years, never even been looked at, and always works perfectly.

IMO the xp is the best standard off the shelf low level winch out there, but the 8274 is a better winch overall.

[GUtripper]

Sorry, to clarify:
I was saying the GU has lots of extra bar work and weight on it- front/rear ABR bars, sliders, drawers, batteries, LR tanks etc etc. Was trying to say the 9.5XP handles this no worries. The winch is stock, but with rope. However, i did get Mal Leslie to paint it internally with marine/anti-corrosive paint (Mal is a Melbourne based winch guru with excellent reputation for winch work). The 9.5 slotted stright into the ARB front bar with no modifications needed to mount it.

Re the duty cycle comment, as far as I understand, a 6hp really wont make a 8274 highmount any faster, but a 6Hp motor has a greater duty cycle over the standard 4.6hp (or the older 2.5hp that highmounts originally came with).

As said, I'd go the 9.5XP.

[BabyGodzillaGTi-R]

Thanks appreciated it GUtripper
Recently a friend of mine offered a M8274 for sale.
Looking at the pics can anyone give a wild guess which model is this my looking at the winch motor (is it a 2.5 or a 4hp motor?) and the clutch free spool thingy switch (the knob looks circular instead of a "T" shape knob)


Was offered equivalent of AUD900K for it. Reasonable price back in OZ?

If only the stupid hilux has a proper PTO output. Love to have this installed on to my truck hehe.


But i wont coz i'm not competing and i dont wanna kill myself coz it has no brakes or kill my clutch.


On a side note, i posted this in the auto electric forum but no response. Hope someone can answer this question of mine:

Hey guys quick question as i'm quite clueless about electrics.

Say if i have an 80 amp factory alternator. Is it really necessary or an option to fit a fuse inbetween the alternator and your typical 3 post Warn Isolator (mine looks ancient, squarish and goldish with lots of heat sinks).
If so what fuse size do i need?
I realise the mech fitted a 30amp fuse recently.
Is that adequate or plain unnecessary.
Or should i just run direct?
Btw anyone have an idea how much amps could my Warn Isolator take? Taking a wild guss 90amps?

2nd point.
Is it a good idea besides running a battery isolator setup, i run a direct wire connecting battery a and battery b and inbetween this line an electric key/ cut off swith so that in a worse case scenario where say a flatten battery a from winching i can connect both battery a and b in an emergency.
Good or bad idea?

Thanks in advance guys.
Cheers.

[GUtripper]

IIRC its a early 2.5hp. The 4.6hp has a larger bump on the end of the motor (to house a bearing, the 2.5 has a small bush?)
I'll stand corerected if wrong, but i think thats it.

My/Tonkas old highmount was a 2.5, and it also had the freespool round knob, rather than the T handle fitted to later highmounts.
If its complete and running, its a good get at $900aud. You would pay $1200 + here.

[BabyGodzillaGTi-R]

Thanks for the tips GUTripper.
Will let u know the final outcome when i've come to my senses.
A new M8274 is going around AUD2100 over here. How much is it down under?
Been going gaga over the classifieds.
Another interesting Highmount and Lowmount from Mr. Toyoda.








Hope i dont open another can of worms with the above.

[turps]

Most off the shelve PTO winches have no need for a designated brake. As most have the PTO shaft driving a worm gear, which then turns the drum. This in its design works as a brake. As there is no way for the drum to turn the worm drive.

Those hispeed PTO's ran over your way. Actually have the PTO shaft run in to something like a Datto 1600 diff. With the Drum mounted on I think the pinion gear shaft. And they lock one of the out puts of the diff to drive the pinion.

A plus for the Hi-mount is they dont tend to jam the cable as much when it bunches to one side. Which happens when your anchor is directly infront.

[turps]

The last toyota himount I seen. Pulled well, but fark it was slow.

[GUtripper]

That looks like a Yota spec motor and solonoid box?

[BabyGodzillaGTi-R]

Back here they normally use a 7.5 inch IFS diff from the Toyota Prado for the God Winches.
I'm sure you can search on you tube to see how they perform during competition.
They then choose their ratios for high speed, super high speed and warp speed before competing.

Yup the above are Toyota winches, one high and the other a low mount.

Yes the another anoying thing with low mounts is that when it bunches to one side it breaks the rod that holds the winch drum together.

[gudge]

A new 8247 highmount retails for around $2600au. I would love to hear more about these pto " god winches"

[BabyGodzillaGTi-R]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EUJixkHQVeE
Well if you wanna see and hear one in action this is how it goes.

[CRUZAAMAD]

yeah the extra wire from a dual battery is good if one day you get stuck, with a dead main battery.
i used 6mm internal diameter wire and an anderson plug around the 50mm in size nothing massive!!, didnt work once, only found out later the dual battery was on its way out and didnt have the GRUNT to start a 2H diesel on the central coast in winter, under the carport..

[turps]

A new 8247 highmount retails for around $2600au. I would love to hear more about these pto " god winches"

The trick is getting a good reliable auto brake setup to work. Sounds like a Kiwi team has that sorted. As sounded like it had a ratchet style brake.

[MADSHORT]

8247-50 love it in stock form all ok little mods to make it even better
drags my 73 series up every thing when needed
cheers
Gordon

[bazzle]

For a Daihatsu get the low mount. You wont need any more power and it wont tip the 4 bee on its nose.

Bazzle

[BabyGodzillaGTi-R]

Hey GUtripper
Thanks for identifying the high mount below.

I'm quite curious if you have any idea would this particular version of the M8274 would be able to run a newer 6hp motor?
I read somewhere where someone mentioned that apparently a component of some sort needs to be modified if they are the older model winch before fitting a 6hp motor. Any idea what component needs to be modified or replace to get a bigger motor running?

Do you think this applies to this particular M8274 based on its old school round knob clutch thingy? I can't identify which version it is as i haven got the chance to find out its serial number and if the solenoid box is a plastic cap or a metal cover.

I thought this is an interesting link i stumbled on :
http://www.warn.com/blog/2011/03/02/the ... inch.shtml

I'm half sold on this M8274 shown in the picture because of the price offered but the only thing is i'm worried how old is old since this winch been around for almost 40 years.

For a Daihatsu get the low mount. You wont need any more power and it wont tip the 4 bee on its nose.

Bazzle

Ultimately what will hold me back from the M8274 is the cost to acquire one and more importantly the cost to fabricate the mounts and bar to fit one. I dont wanna ditch my axuliary lights just to fit one silly highmount lol.
If you have seen above i've ran a "Chinese Ding Dong Ching Chong" 12000 winch before but the reliability of the chinese winch is still questionable.

Talking about low mounts i'm quite surprised that a M8000 aparently pulls faster/ harder under heavier loads (6000-8000lbs) compared to a M9000 and a M8274 according to the Warn brouchers. Believable?
I'm really surprised.

[turps]

The new motors will bolt on. You will most likely need to buy a pinion gear though. As the newer motors use a splined pinion gear and the older ones used a Key-way.
mine is an older model and the new 6hp fitted no issues once the pinion gear turned up.
From memory the pinion gear is only about $30.

The pulling power of my M8274 was very disappointing compared to my old 8000lb PTO.