help with costing of EXO cages....

Post by **SiKiD_01** » Sun Mar 20, 2005 12:21 am

been thinking about a cage of some sort a lot lately. either a standard internal one, half cage, or a half exo cage.

i dont have access to a pipe/tube bender, and i'm not crash hot at welding either.

i guess the cost depends on how much tube you need, but for a shop to do it, would it be worth it?

i was thinking about a cage like MARKYB's from the uk but definately not the part where his exo become a into the cab cage too!

i will make up sliders for the cage to mount to as well as a rear bar. so i'm guessing theres a lot of work in it. and design too. *sigh*

thanks for any help and advice.
Steve

PS, is there anyone in darwin that can help me out on this?

Post by **antt** » Sun Mar 20, 2005 8:11 am

mine has about $250 worth of steel in it alone. i'd say you'd be look at $1500 easy to get a shop to do it, cause they are a pain in the ass to make, and very time consuming.......i wouldn't want to make mine again

Post by **Gonzo** » Sun Mar 20, 2005 6:09 pm

Sam @ Overkill Engineering gave me a price of $1k

Post by **alien** » Sun Mar 20, 2005 6:18 pm

also depends on waht your after strength wise...

cheaper one prolly save it once and youll need to ditch it... or you can go as far as a CAMS approved one which would be practially bulletproof but cost a fortune... but when it comes to saving possibly your life as well as your zuk i'd say its worth it =)

do you really need one though? i mean i'd love to have a roll bar n stuff cos they look so cool - but i really dont need one hehe

Post by **SiKiD_01** » Sun Mar 20, 2005 6:38 pm

the reason why i'm looking at getting one is cos no one want to go wheeling in my vit with me.

and when they do come with me, the insist heavily on getting out and walking up/down the hill by themselves.

maybe this needs a few pics to explain. oh well.

1 - 1.5k is a lot. i just need someone who knows how to bend up some tube properly, and i can get the steel a bit cheaper.

oh yeah, and a good welder.

Post by **Rotazuk** » Sun Mar 20, 2005 7:46 pm

If its a tricky build , duno cos I can't see the pic's still grrr , get the steel , hire a bender and start bending . Do all the grunt work like bending and notching the tube together etc . Tack weld it in place then take it or the hole thing to a welder to zap together good and proper for you . A couple of hours of a welders time can't be $1000 and you get it just the way you want it .

Cheers

Chris

Post by **ZOOK60** » Sun Mar 20, 2005 10:16 pm

your plobly looking at 2-300 bucks in tube alone

Post by **alien** » Mon Mar 21, 2005 1:03 am

depends on whether you go mild steel, hi-ten or crmo.... crmo is best bust VERY expensive... hi-ten snaps/cracks, and mild bends easy... crmo is much more rigid - twice the strength of mild steel, but doesnt crack as easy because of its alloys.

id go crmo. otherwise, if i was being cheapo i'd go mild steel - at least it will save you once and cushion the fall at the same time =)

Post by **Gonzo** » Mon Mar 21, 2005 1:25 am

Or just go to a building site, knock off their scaffolding and get you booty fab hat on :cool:

Post by **OldGold** » Mon Mar 21, 2005 3:59 am

CAMS approved Exos? WTF? I know wheeling is motorsport but do CAMS have anything to do with it?

I have never heard of crmo being used in roll cages, I was under the impression cold drawn high tensile was the go, at least in CAMS eyes. What did you use in yours Antt?
Interesting to see lots of gusseting in the cage above, never noticed it before on any of the other exos I've looked at

Post by **antt** » Mon Mar 21, 2005 8:51 am

mine is made from 32nb mild steel (the same stuff that most of the tube buggies here in aus are made out of), which has an OD of 42.3 or something like that and a wall thickness of 3.2mm. Mines been on its side twice and hasn't bent or deformed, except for the sliders. Mild steel is plenty strong enough for an exo, they're not designed to save you in a 150km/ph multiple roll on the road like a v8 supercar cage, they're designed to rub on trees and rocks and save panels and glass during rolls offroad.

Post by **alien** » Mon Mar 21, 2005 9:54 am

CAMS do for all the rally style racing etc... and use crmo and specific rules and regulations when building a cage. generally though, id say they are designed for hitting a tree at 60+ km/hr, not slow rollovers or scrubbing =)

Post by **Jwreck** » Tue Mar 22, 2005 12:05 pm

Hey Antt..

The exo on your ride is shet hot.. I've been using it as a basis for my designs. And to show the wife how much better life will be with pipes all over.

Anyway, I've heard that you can rent pipe benders around Melb. If you were closer to town Sikid, I might have suggested to join up in the project to save $$ and add to ideas.

Good luck with it. Make sure to post progress pix and general "don't do this" notes.. for those yet to travel the exo track.

Later all, J.

Post by **SiKiD_01** » Tue Mar 22, 2005 12:49 pm

damn! wish i weren't so isolated sometimes.

well, i have a couple of questions.

1.with the pipe/tube bender, is it one of those massive-weigh-a-tonne hydraulic bottle jacks in a cradle? ie, manual bending of tube?

2.i see in some of antt's progress pics, he's got in on its side on the ground, and no doubt its easier to work with, but will the h-jack still work properly?

3. and, how do you mark out the tube to bend with the mentioned tube bender? it would probably look stupid if you couldn't make the bends equal and the same on both sides.

there should be some kind of newb guide, or tube bending for dummies or something like that.

i've had a go at bending tube, but it was like 50mm OD and 1.6mm wall thickness. this was supposed to be for my light bar and in no way was it supposed to save my vit in any situation, and hell that was a bit tricky. didn't look right in the end, and so i gave up. it was supposed to have 5 bends in it, and none of them were exact, and it didnt look too good either.

its hard to explain.

and another thing, if you bend tube 90*, i take it it will be a press bend. i dont really like the look of press bends, seen factory exhausts lately? but i also know you can find mandrel bends in 90* and 45* where you just weld them up on the end of a straight piece of tube. is this a good way to do it? i guess if you use these, then the exo won't 'mould' the the body then.

not sure yet, but when i get a bit more time, i'll have a more serious go at bending up some tube for an exo. maybe when the dry season comes around.

now, gotta make those sliders and rear bar.

Post by **N*A*M** » Tue Mar 22, 2005 1:58 pm

pipe benders work fine horizontally.

to repeat a bend, measure the distance the ram has moved for bend a. pump bend b until you have reached the same ram deflection.

mandrel bends stretch the outside of the bend and are not as strong. you don't need nor want it for a structural cage.

Post by **OldGold** » Tue Mar 22, 2005 5:44 pm

yeah mandrel bends are more about maintaining diameter of the tube rather than it's strength

Perhaps someone who knows their shiz could write up a basic barwork bending/welding faq?

Post by **ZOOK60** » Tue Mar 22, 2005 6:30 pm

thers a good rite up on pirate tells you all you need to know bout bendeing and measuring helpsif yuo draw what you are bending on the floor first then you can get the angles perfect

Post by **superzuki** » Tue Mar 22, 2005 6:35 pm

to stop the tube from crushing you can fill the tube with sand.....you need to weld a cap on one end n fll up the tube and wack it with a hammer fill it up with moore sand and repeat n then weld up the other end and bend it....the tube will not crush as much when bending..... you can bye more expensive dies for the bender which are a tightr fit on the tube (cheaper ones are only a loose fit n let the tube crush more) and wont let it spread out as it is being bent which is beter.

Post by **ZOOK60** » Tue Mar 22, 2005 6:41 pm

superzuki wrote:to stop the tube from crushing you can fill the tube with sand.....you need to weld a cap on one end n fll up the tube and wack it with a hammer fill it up with moore sand and repeat n then weld up the other end and bend it....the tube will not crush as much when bending..... you can bye more expensive dies for the bender which are a tightr fit on the tube (cheaper ones are only a loose fit n let the tube crush more) and wont let it spread out as it is being bent which is beter.

for $120 for the dawn die i would just pull you finger out and buy one
the actual bender caost me $125
this setup doesnt crush the tube at all

Post by **antt** » Tue Mar 22, 2005 7:05 pm

like jake said, just buy a dawn die and get a bender from supercheap. will probably cost $250 all up and it'll work fine for an exo and tube bars etc. the dawn die works good, and if ya put a piece of any iron on the rollers, you wont get any dents

Post by **ZOOK60** » Tue Mar 22, 2005 7:23 pm

antt wrote:like jake said, just buy a dawn die and get a bender from supercheap. will probably cost $250 all up and it'll work fine for an exo and tube bars etc. the dawn die works good, and if ya put a piece of any iron on the rollers, you wont get any dents

touchdown

also if you make jigs up you can use the bender as a press for pressing bushes bearings or making bracketory

Post by **jasonmcc** » Tue Mar 22, 2005 10:09 pm

Hi all.

Im interested in doing some tube work on my suzi as well. I have the MIG so I just need the bender. Where and how much do I get one? Where do you get the better dies?

Hey Sikid, Im in Darwin and I got the welder so If you ever need a hand I wouldnt complain about experimenting with yours first

Cheers

Jason

Post by cj » Wed Mar 23, 2005 5:09 am

jasonmcc wrote: Where do you get the better dies?

http://www.dawntools.com.au/prod04.htm

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help with costing of EXO cages....

help with costing of EXO cages....

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Where do I get the pipe bender.

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