SPOA SWB MQ Patrol

Post by **matsmad** » Sat Jun 18, 2005 7:29 pm

Want to do a spring over on my SWB Mq patrol. Want to use stock springs n shocks, and dont want to spend much. Any tips?

Post by **mickyd555** » Sat Jun 18, 2005 9:52 pm

i think it was screwy who said if he had his chance again that he wouldnt do a spring over, but i cant remember his reason for it. it could also have been markX4.

Post by **Patroler** » Sat Jun 18, 2005 11:27 pm

dont know how you'd go using stock shocks, that'd mean that you would only get stock travel, or maybe a touch more until the shocks top out.
If you want to keep the stock shocks and springs why not just stay sprung under and go for a 3" body lift and fit big tyres that way? if you can fit 31's standard then i reckon you ought to be able to squeeze 36's with a body lift and maybe a bit of cutting? cheep cheep

Unless you can do most of the spring over work yourself i couldn't see it being very cheap, unless you bought all the bits 2nd hand (diff housings etc)

Post by **Big Red Toy** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 9:47 am

i run 36 tsl with 3" bodylift & no trimming

& no rubby rubby

My thread :
http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... hp?t=23184

there are a couple of pics of the tsl's under full compression, tucked up inside the guards, so i can get away with this lift by not having real fat tyres either

pic http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... hp?id=4136[/url]

Post by **MARKx4** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 1:17 pm

There is nothing wrong with a spring over. They are great for more flex if you want a top offroader with out going out of control. If you want a good comp truck you will set out diffrent then just a standard spring over. Using stock springs is the best thing to do, dont run any body lift, get a dissconectable sway bar set up if you are going to do a fair bit of street travel aswell. If you are going a spring over DONT use standard shocks, you will waste the extra travel you will gain. If you want a cheap lift and run big tyres like 35's, just run 2"springs and 3" body lift and you will enough room for your tyres.

Post by **rOd** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 2:07 pm

MARKx4 wrote: If you want a cheap lift and run big tyres like 35's, just run 2"springs and 3" body lift and you will enough room for your tyres.

I am by no means an expert on this subject.

But considering the QLD rules are tougher on SOA, then maybe what Mark suggests here aint so bad.

Post by **adam.s** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 2:15 pm

rOd wrote:
MARKx4 wrote: If you want a cheap lift and run big tyres like 35's, just run 2"springs and 3" body lift and you will enough room for your tyres.
I am by no means an expert on this subject.

But considering the QLD rules are tougher on SOA, then maybe what Mark suggests here aint so bad.

Except they are tough on 3" body lifts too, not sure if you can get a bigger lift engineered though.

Post by **MARKx4** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 3:55 pm

foad wrote:
rOd wrote:
MARKx4 wrote: If you want a cheap lift and run big tyres like 35's, just run 2"springs and 3" body lift and you will enough room for your tyres.
I am by no means an expert on this subject.

But considering the QLD rules are tougher on SOA, then maybe what Mark suggests here aint so bad.
Except they are tough on 3" body lifts too, not sure if you can get a bigger lift engineered though.

I didnt relise he was from QLD. In that case from what i hear, throw the soa idea out the window. Go the spring lift and body lift, talk to a engineer about the 3" body lift. If he says no go a 2" body lift. You may get some rubbing with 35s, if you do you will have to trim a little not much or just run 33s and it should be sweet.

Post by **mickyd555** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 3:59 pm

im preety sure his old mav was registered in NSW, as he lives on the tweed. so i assume its the same with the MQ........

Post by **MARKx4** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 4:20 pm

mickyd555 wrote:im preety sure his old mav was registered in NSW, as he lives on the tweed. so i assume its the same with the MQ........

If thats true, he has a few options now

Post by **adam.s** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 4:26 pm

This thread needs more pics of spoa MQ's

mark: I fucking rate your rig. I think it's cause it's the same baby shit brown colour as my MQ but with some decent mods under her belt.

Post by **Beastmavster** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 5:44 pm

2" body lift max in QLD - no SPOA mods allowed.

If it still has NSW rego (and I would If I was down there) then do it and get it NSW modplated so the QLD cops cant grab you.

Post by **matsmad** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 5:53 pm

Wow! thanks guys. I was intending to do the spoa myself. Ive done plenty of welding and had made up bars etc for the MAv, which was registered in NSW. With a spring lift, i wont get the travel right? so i wanted to use the standard springs, and if the shock mounts are in the same spot in relation to the springs, then it will be good, as it crosses up good now. was indending to run 33's.

Post by **MARKx4** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 7:03 pm

foad wrote:This thread needs more pics of spoa MQ's

mark: I ***** rate your rig. I think it's cause it's the same baby shit brown colour as my MQ but with some decent mods under her belt.

Here is a couple for you. Warning poser shots

Post by **matsmad** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 7:04 pm

Nice pics Mark. Looks tuff. Keen as now.

Post by **MARKx4** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 7:05 pm

foad wrote:This thread needs more pics of spoa MQ's

mark: I ***** rate your rig. I think it's cause it's the same baby shit brown colour as my MQ but with some decent mods under her belt.

Here is a couple for you. Warning poser shots
Its now reversed shackle at front and it works a little better.

Post by **adam.s** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 7:29 pm

That's awesome flex.

I prefer your newer nudge? bar to that one --> the one you made up with the warn mount.

Post by **MARKx4** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 9:00 am

foad wrote:That's awesome flex.

I prefer your newer nudge? bar to that one --> the one you made up with the warn mount.

I havent done that one yet, dont know if you seen it somewhere else. Thats the bar i have been running for the last 18 months. The new bar will get done with the next stage of mods.

Post by **Screwy** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 10:06 am

WE ROCK was cool thanks for asking.

if u want an offroader..... and u dont intend on going further to say heavy comp use...... and u dont mind the complications with registration in QLD.....

SOA may be a good idea.

really its rather simple.

the rear diff all u need to do i make up the 2 perches and weld them ontop with a jack under the pinion to set your rear pinion angle and then just weld them with the pinion angled nicely up where u want it.

rear shocks u will have to make up a coupla new diff shock mounts which is easy as and u will get away with shocks that are prob about 4 inch lifted give or take.... this is from memory of the bad positioning of the top rear MQ mounts.

rear leave packs, personally set up a pack that has 5 leaves either side. the bottom short ones are important. when u remove leaves, take the number of leave u want out from the middle of the pack, leave the TOP 2 and leave the BOTTOM 2.
i run 4 either side which will help with flex issues. i u have a pack with 5, take the middle one out of each.

i dont recomend SOA with stock springs without removing a coupla leaves. the packs themselves are fine, but the thing will just sit far too high and will be floppy. so removing leaves will lower centre of gravity and enable for improved spring movement.

rear driveshaft will either need lengthening or a spacer put in ad it will be too short. rear brake line and diff breather will also need lengthening.

front diff is harder. u will have to rotate the diff up the same as the rear, with the jack under the pinion, u then weld the perches on to get the shaft angle u want. the drivers perch is harder and will need a hole drilled in the flange cast section of the centre for the u bolt to pass through.
once u have it set up, u will then need to cut ur knuckles and swivel the knuckle / hub assembly back to the position they were in before u pulled the pinion up with the perches. so measure the perch angle u have changed and then turn the knuckles back this amount.

this will correct your castor and elliminate the castor slap and bump steer problems u WILL get. it would also pay to change your tie rod ends with new ones cause they tend to fail over a certain amount of months of being SOA with the new forces and geometry.

then u need to make up ur top arm for the highsteer that willl bolt to the top kingpin carrier of the passneger side hub and run either 1 drag link from the pitman arm on the steer box to the new top highsteer arm, or a shorter arm from the std relay rod assembly to the highsteer arm.

u will also find that the gearbox crossmember that the front shaft runs over to meet the transfer case will be in the way of the shaft. if the shaft doesnt rub and hit it at ride hieght, it will on down travel. either notch it out and brace or cut it off and lengthen and move it back and re weld.

then juts just front diff shock mounts and then brake lines diff breathers and then front shocks themselves.

u will confortably be able to run 35s on an SOA mq/mk without and other lifts in it. i dont recomend having any body lift etc in the rig if its SOA, just too tall and thin. Markx4 has removed his body lift and so have i, and we both run flipped rims to get some width.

have fun

screwy

Post by **Screwy** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 10:08 am

ABOVE

on the left stock hieght, kingys SOA with no other lift in it.

mine with 2 inch body lift and then SOA with the body lift, from 31s to 35s.

these pics where taken in January 04'.

BELOW

here are a couple of other pictures i have of the convesion itself to make the tech more easy to understand

screwy

Post by **Screwy** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 10:12 am

these pics are all of my SOA.

above is the rear diff set up, the jack was under the pinion. and the front crossmember removal lengthen and reinstall.

below is front perch and steer setup.

screwy

Post by **Screwy** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 10:15 am

a couple of pics of it in wat i thought was the finished state end of last year early this year.........
just to give u an idea, its on 38s here with 3 inch body lift and no guard cut so its sitting rather tall

my members thread with all new pics will be posted within the end of the week for the unvailing of the new rig.

screwy

Post by **Screwy** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 10:18 am

Post by **Tiny** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 10:41 am

you were on 14kms of beach and you found the only rock and rolled ramping it

when are you picking up the next MQ? I am keen for a buggy project

Post by **Screwy** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 11:11 am

Tiny wrote:you were on 14kms of beach and you found the only rock and rolled ramping it when are you picking up the next MQ? I am keen for a buggy project

maybe tonight, maybe tomorrow depends on wat i work out and how lazy i feel

Post by **MARKx4** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 11:38 am

Screwy_ScrewBall wrote:
Tiny wrote:you were on 14kms of beach and you found the only rock and rolled ramping it when are you picking up the next MQ? I am keen for a buggy project
maybe tonight, maybe tomorrow depends on wat i work out and how lazy i feel

you have all week, im sure you want to fill in some time.

Post by **Tiny** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 11:46 am

MARKx4 wrote:
Screwy_ScrewBall wrote:
Tiny wrote:you were on 14kms of beach and you found the only rock and rolled ramping it when are you picking up the next MQ? I am keen for a buggy project
maybe tonight, maybe tomorrow depends on wat i work out and how lazy i feel
you have all week, im sure you want to fill in some time.

he has to get over the late night getting out last night and the shocking rum hangover from saturday nights effort.......he so looked like

when I skulled half a bottle fo bundy straight

Post by **Screwy** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 12:12 pm

bwahahahahahahahahahah

loves it

Post by **V8Patrol** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 1:05 pm

Here's the list of ENGINEERS, should you decide to do an SOA
http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... hp?t=33622
Contact them FIRST !

For other General Querrys, have a look here.......
http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... hp?t=22167
http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... hp?t=19476
http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... hp?t=27306
http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... hp?t=27457
http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... hp?t=27201

I did a write up on the "how to " here.....
http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... php?t=7890

Even more SOA & SUA & one system versus another....
http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... hp?t=14293
http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... hp?t=12987
http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... php?t=8798
http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... php?t=6397

Tips:
Contact an Engineer before you start ( otherwise it wont stay regeod for long )

Ask Questions before you phuck up ( others know the pitfalls you WILL encounter )............... ( I repeat "WILL" )

Have a PLAN of attack BEFORE you start.... IE: order the extended brakelines well before you start, If you are changing the shocker styles around for example going from pin/pin to loop / loop the get the parts done before you start. Get hold of some longer tailshafts so that they are ready to be cut n shut once the correct length is known.

Power steering is a bit of a must have with an SOA ............. trust me

so you will need to get hold of a modified pitman arm ( Snake Engineering ) and while your at it order a return to centre steering damper ( also a must have item )

Depending on the condition of your wheel bearings & kingpin bearings be prepared to replace them ASAP ( I strongly recemend you do this when you have the diffs out and being welded up with the new spring pearches )

One decision you will need to make NOW is whether you are going to rotate the front steering knuckles or not to allow for castor correction.
I run 11 degrees and a mate runs 10 degrees, I set Screwys @ 7 degrees.... more reading in my members thread on this.

Final tip .......
When you bleed the brakes with a knuckle twist done, make sure that the bleeding valve is as high as possiable otherwise air WILL remain in the system ( a knuckle twist alters the angle of the brake caliper to a point where bleeding is not a conventinal task

Kingy

Post by **matsmad** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 4:25 pm

thanks heaps guys. Really useful info screwey, and nice pics. Lookin into it a bit more now. Good work

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