Lightforce 240 Blitz to HID conversion

[bushy555]

G'day All... or G'day to anybody who may actually read this post.

Have made up a conversion kit so that if you've got Lightforce 240 Blitz's on ya vehicle, you can convert these into HID babies. HID being the newer fancier technology of running 23,000 volts at startup to run the HID bulbs.
(HID stands for High Intensity Discharge.)

I have just sucessfully converted four lights, and am pretty much just posting this to see if anyone else would be interested in doing this conversion to theirs. If this idea flops, it flops. Who really cares...


Advantages of going to HID?

* Nicer white/blue-ish light, rather than yellow.
* 35 watts per light of current draw instead of 100 or 130 watts.
* Longer bulb life - up to 2500 hours, instead of 1000 hours for halogen.
* Bugger all heat output. When compared to Halogen bulbs, more energy in a HID bulb is converted into light.
* Awesome light output.


Coupla pics of the differences:
On the left are four Lightforce 240 Blitz's, all running 100 watt bulbs. All four are dialed in as spread.

On the right is two Lightforce 240 Blitz's with two HID bulbs, all dialed in as spot, which still gives an ok spread.

Two pics - one is a real pic taken without a flash on digi camera. The other pic is with the shutter open for about 500 milliseconds, showing a more grander piccy.

so basic question is, is anyone interested, or is this a dumb idea?


cheers,
dave

djmaunder@rockdale.com.au

[antt]

i think the most important question is, 'how much can you convert them for compared to just buying the off the shelf lightforce HID's?'

[AJ]

Will they fit other brands of lights (like my Hella 4000s)?
And the all important - how many $$$$

[AJ]

There are plenty of HID conversion kits on eBay but Ive heard bad reports on the quality of them.

[bogged]

how much, and whats involved? is it reversable - eg if it doesnt work or dont like it can you change it back to stock?

[Big Red Toy]

i'm currently looking into this as i have the next few months off work, i have xgt's, they don't run a standard style globe so you'd have to work out a way for globe mounting and then it would be easy, you would also need to get the spacing right to avoid "black spot" from the globe / lens not aligning properly. I'm very intereseted to hear about this

[GRIMACE]

why didnt you use the same dialing (spread/spot) to sample the lights

[Big Red Toy]

well....... where shall i start
I can get HID onversion kits for just under $200 each how many should i order Its easy just email the chinese companies yourself they are actually great to deal with and quick replies too

Going to work what i'm ordering then i'll be getting em for sure

[bushy555]

> i think the most important question is, 'how much can you convert
> them for compared to just buying the off the shelf lightforce HID's?'

I was looking at around the $350 to $400 mark, on your door step, to do two lights. Probably way too much to those peeps who know all about the HID kits on ebay.
Have already designed and cut the mount that fits into the early versions
of Light Force 140, Light Force 170 and Light Force 240's. And these babies appear to work very well. Was even all designed and drawn up in fancy Autocad 2006, then cut out with plasma. (Laser cost too much)

I have yet to look at the newer style of mounting system that Lightforce now has in their lights. But I reckon that the design of the mount that I've got is sweet-as.


> Will they fit other brands of lights (like my Hella 4000s)?
> And the all important - how many $$$$

What bulb type does the Hella 4000 use?

Hella 1000 = H2 (There is no such thing as a H2 HID bulb!)
Hella 2000 = H1 bulb
Hella 4000 = ???
Hella Comet 155 = H3
Hella Comet 550 = H3

IPF 900 = H3
IPF 800 = H3

Cibie super (slim) = H2
Cibie Oscar = H4

Bull lights = H3

Night Stalker = H3



> There are plenty of HID conversion kits on eBay but Ive heard bad
> reports on the quality of them.

Reports are going around - sure. But I'm just wondering how many of them are bad rumors, without fact. I've given my four kits a real workout in the past two months. Haven't stuffed anything yet.
They're gone under water, ballasts been covered in mud. And they appear to want more. Maybe they break if you've recently wrapped ya-self around a power pole or something...



> how much, and whats involved? is it reversable - eg if it doesnt work or dont like it can you change it back to stock?
As above. No confirmed price yet. Am half thinking about setting up shop at Tuff Truck next year... that is if noone beats me to it. Which they probably will....

Involvment at the moment isn't real flash, which is gonna turn people off. And I realise this. The flippin plugs on these kits are supposed to come off the high-voltage wires, but since they dont, at the moment it
requires drilling a 3/4" hole in the rear of the LF light.
Step 1. Take off lens.
Step 2. Take out the old xenon bulb.
Step 3. Unscrew side lugs on housing mount.
step 4. cut any wire connectors that may be on the end of the wires.
Step 5. Take out the old mount, and pull the wires thru. Can be used again (reversable)
Step 6. Drill hole in rear.
Step 7. Screw the bulb to the mount,
Step 8. Thread plugs thru hole
step 9. insert the mount.
Step 10. Put lens on.

At the moment:
if drilled a 3/4 inch hole it will require silicon sealant to seal the hole.
If drilled with a 22mm hole, can use the enclosed rubber grommet. And possibly add some silicon.

Mount the light back on to ya bull bar, light bar, nudge bar, roof rack... and walla.



>i'm currently looking into this as i have the next few months off work, i
> have xgt's, they don't run a standard style globe so you'd have to work
> out a way for globe mounting and then it would be easy, you would
> also need to get the spacing right to avoid "black spot" from the globe /
> lens not aligning properly. I'm very intereseted to hear about this

All XGT's that I have seen use the newer LF mount, as well as all newer 140's, 170's, and 240's. As I said above, I have yet to get my hands on any of these to look at this new mounting system. It may be identical, but what looks like some sort of an aluminium mount.

As far as I know my design of the HID bulb mount will only fit the older style of LF. I have also got the spacing dead set. No black spots at all - looks real sweet to me.

Anyway, as I originally said, this was just a post to see if anyone was really interested.


Might email sales dude at Lightforce who said to me "NO - you can not upgrade a 240 Blitz to HID. It can't be done".
My reply; "yep it can"





> why didnt you use the same dialing (spread/spot) to sample the lights

Yeah, pretty slack eh. Dunno really. Can easily get a spread shot of the 'upgraded' HID inserts but.



> well....... where shall i start
>I can get HID onversion kits for just under $200 each how many should i >order
>Its easy just email the chinese companies yourself they are actually great to deal with and quick replies too
>
>Going to work what i'm ordering then i'll be getting em for sure
>

heh! you supply the kits (H3 HID bulb), I'll supply the mount for them...

[Big Red Toy]

well done some more reseach
hella 4000's are a H1 globe
light purchase approx $350 - ebay
H1 hid conversion kit dlivered for one is about $250
so for $600 i could have hid halla rallye 4000's which is really only $100 more than my lightforce xgt's not a bad way to go

The resaon's i'd go hid:
* I do allot of nightdrives

* Allot of my nightdrive seem to involve high speed booting around the bush

*HID are brighter

* better vibration resistance etc....

*less load on alternator

* Less chance of being stuck with dead batteries during night missions involving lotsa winching etc.....

so hopefully in the not to distant future i'm going to order some kits

I'm going to get the dual HID for my standard lights as my truck isn't a daily driver so the being able to flash people (hid's can't) isn't such a big deal

will let you know how i go

[Big Red Toy]

oh yeah
lighforce blitz HID's are cool

http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthr ... ge=4&pp=30

[nicbeer]

Hi

Does this mean i could convert my hella 181's and also my NANE 7700's as they all use h3 globes?

cheers

[Big Red Toy]

yep anylights with a replaceable globe can be converted

[AJ]

well done some more reseach
hella 4000's are a H1 globe
light purchase approx $350 - ebay
H1 hid conversion kit dlivered for one is about $250
so for $600 i could have hid halla rallye 4000's which is really only $100 more than my lightforce xgt's not a bad way to go

The Hella 4000 body is the same as for Hella Predator HIDs (Not sure about the reflector but the lens appears the same)

Given that Predators sell for about $2500 a pair your idea has some merit.

[Suspension Stuff]

Just a note that could help some readers of this thread.
If I can get an order for 5 or more sets of lightforce spotties, I can sell them for $330 a pair. I will have to check but I think I can deliver them for free as well.

So just let me know if you are interested and we will see what happens.

Shane on 0409 593 414
4WD STUFF

[bogged]

Just a note that could help some readers of this thread.
If I can get an order for 5 or more sets of lightforce spotties, I can sell them for $330 a pair.

which model lforces?

I did a bulk buy few yrs back on 240s got them for $330ish(cant remember), and arrnaged delivery..

good on ya for helpin dudes to save a few $

[grazza]

What are the best temperature bulbs to use?
I dont really like the blue look - I am looking for something like sunlight.

[Suspension Stuff]

which model lforces?

That's the RMDL240's
XGT's would be about $420 a pair. I would have to confim this but.

Shane

[bazzle]

What are the best temperature bulbs to use?
I dont really like the blue look - I am looking for something like sunlight.

Best HID temp if you want to see where you are going is 4300k or up to max 5000k.

All the rest just look pretty and dont work on earth colourd tracks or in the rain on black bitumen.

Bazzle

[grazza]

Thanks Bazzle - thats very interesting. Seems most people are selling the bling blue.

[Big Red Toy]

I have HID's well they are on the way

I bought a H4 conversion kit for hi & low for $355 i've ordered them in the 4500k colour temp as the higher ones as far as my research tells me is that they are just bluer which isn't required, i want brightness

Will do some comparisons when they are installed

[bushy555]

Apologies all. Am terribly slack (read as busy doing other crap)



>So just let me know if you are interested and we will see what happens.
>Shane on 0409 593 414
>4WD STUFF

ring ya on Monday if that is ok. About to go for a six hour drive to Sydney.


>which model lforces?

The small amount of research that I have done is that these mounts that I have on my lounge room floor fit all early version Lightforce 140, 170 and 240 blitz's. The early version utilises what looks like a bit of bent 0.6mm tin and has two rivets next to where the original xenon H2 bulb mounts in.

The newer later versions has one rivet nio the side in between the threads of where the lens screws on. The actual mount is a 3 or 4mm chunk of aluminium to distribute the heat (one chuck of heat sink coming at ya). I have yet to get my hands on one of these and dril the rivet out. I am sure that the internal dimensinos are identical however have yet to verify.

There is no need for a heatsink with HID bulbs!
They produce bugger all heat --- there is a little bit, but after 5 minutes of one of thes ebulbs being on, it is possible to touch with your finger the tip of the glass bulb - and wont burn your hand to smithereens. Obviously clean the bulb afterwards!



>What are the best temperature bulbs to use?
>I dont really like the blue look - I am looking for something like sunlight.

>Best HID temp if you want to see where you are going is 4300k or up to >max 5000k.

>All the rest just look pretty and dont work on earth colourd tracks or in >the rain on black bitumen.

5000k is pure white. This is what you are after.
6000k is what is in the pics.

10000k and up is dark blue to purple. Dudes buy these just to be cool. And to attract the police.


> I bought a H4 conversion kit for hi & low for $355 i've ordered them in >the 4500k colour temp as the higher ones as far as my research tells >me is that they are just bluer which isn't required, i want brightness

Guess that 4500k frmo one mob might not be the same 4500k from another mob. You'd prolly need some fancy techy equipment to compare a so called 4500k or 5000k HID bulb to a true colour temp.



> http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?
> t=43203&page=4&pp=30

interesting. He is using a DS2 bulb. These are roughly 28 to 30mm in the base. Maybe I chose the wrong bulb to go with.
The only reason why I chose the H3 bulb, was that if anyone ever wanted to get rid of the LF's, could pull the H3's out, and put them into any standard spot light.


Done up a bit of a web site. I whacked on some pricing, but don't believe it. I havent had the chance to pull it off yet. It is wrong.


http://www.hid.isclever.com

Might just start selling the H3 mounts to anyone who want them - then whoeevr can go off to ebay and bid for HID kits themselves.

Might also invest in a H1 bulb kit, and try to make a mount for it for the Lightforce lights as well.




Anyone else wanna comment? good, bad or other?


cheers all,
silly dave.
www.bushy.looksool.com www.bushy.ismad.com
www.subey.lookscool.com www.hid.isclever.com

[Big Red Toy]

yep, not a bad idea

Orders are now being taken for Lightforce 240 Blitz conversion to HID. Due around Oct/Nov 2005.
At this stage will be approximately au$475.00 for a complete kit to do two 240's. FREE postage to anywhere in Australia!!
Unfortunately it looks like converting LF XGT's are out of the question at this stage.

the price is fair enough seeming it includes the hid kit, lightforce's are great lights so by having hid mod kits for them available, you could make a killing, how much for just the adaptors without the hid kit??? as the hid kits can be bought of ebay commonly rather cheaply, also what sort of globe will the be made to accept??? h1/h3???

[bushy555]

> how much for just the adaptors without the hid kit???

yep.
Think that this is the way to go, rather than selling a 'complete solution'
Dollar wise, probably about $40.00 for two H3 bulb mounts on a doorstep. With full instructions on the complete process from bidding or buying a HID kit off ebay, to installing it in to a LF light.

How does that sound?


> also what sort of globe will the be made to accept??? h1/h3???

h3 bulb at this stage.
Am just starting to look into making a design for the h1 as well.

Need to make more time availble to play with all of this.....

[rockrover]

I have a set of ralley 4000 and was wondering wat was involved and how much it would cost to convert from halogen to hid.......thnx

[turps]

I have a set of ralley 4000 and was wondering wat was involved and how much it would cost to convert from halogen to hid.......thnx

since these take a H3 globe. You should be able to buy one of the hid kits of ebay. I assume the globe will in stall the same way a normal H3 globe does.
Not sure how much lead you get back tothe ballast. As I think you would be wanting to place it under the bonnent somewhere. Maybe just behind the grill.
Would be interested to see before and after picks of an install in some thing like the ralley4000 or 900series (round) IPFs. Or any of the other driving lights in this size. 170 to 240mm dia.

[flylux]

I do a heap of night Mountainbiking, and I've got a Niterider HID helmet light. It bloody rocks!
HIDs are the sh!t

[derelict_frog]

Can u convert hella 181's at all they looks very simlilar to the hella 550's (i think thats the one on your site) but i might be missing something.

So can any light with a halogen globe be converted? like even the $100 elcheapo plastic casing ones.. or what stops them not being able to be converted?

[bushy555]

>>I have a set of ralley 4000 and was wondering wat was involved and
>>how much it would cost to convert from halogen to hid.......thnx


>since these take a H3 globe. You should be able to buy one of the hid kits
> of ebay. I assume the globe will in stall the same way a normal H3 globe
> does.
>Not sure how much lead you get back tothe ballast. As I think you would
>be wanting to place it under the bonnent somewhere. Maybe just behind
>the grill.
>Would be interested to see before and after picks of an install in some
>thing like the ralley4000 or 900series (round) IPFs. Or any of the other
>driving lights in this size. 170 to 240mm dia.


Ralley 4000's use the H1 bulb, same as the Ralley 2000.
Ralley 1000's use the H2 bulb, with wings for heat disapation.
IPF 800 (rectangle), IPF 900 (round) use the more common H3 bulb.

Have only just bought a H1 kit, and within the week will have time to do a photo slide show of converting Ralley 2000's.
Have a photo slide show document thingo of swapping over HID bulbs in IPF 900's already - need to drill some holes.
Pics before and after of IPF 900's are at me dopey little site as mentioned in one of my postings above.
IPF 800's and Bull lights are still yet to come. Need more hours in the day and in the night.


A HID H3 bulb will fit into the physical space of the H1 cut out mount on the back of a Rallye 2000, however, coz the arc of the HID bulb is a good 10 to 12mm back from the optimum position, the light output is pathetic.
I ran with these for two nights before taking them off. You definately need the correct positioning of the arc of a bulb.

> Can u convert hella 181's at all they looks very simlilar to the hella
>550's
> (i think thats the one on your site) but i might be missing something.

They're pretty much an identical light and housing. I've never put the two together to take a good look at the differences but having had both, off the top of my head the only difference is the plastic housing
- it being slightly a fancier design, and the name change. The 181 were the originals, whilst the 550 comets are their replacements. Maybe the reflector has been updated a fraction.

I have yet to put a H3 bulb into one of these lights. However am pretty sure that a standard HID H3 bulb will fit - need to verify this though.


>So can any light with a halogen globe be converted? like even the $100
>elcheapo plastic casing ones.. or what stops them not being able to be
>converted?
I'd say yes. The $25.00 super cheap lights can't coz the HID bulb just wont physically fit (too long).
I'd actually go as far to say that you could use any supercheap / autozone / K-mart cheapie H3 light that can physically hold the longer HID bulb.

Maybe the only factor is the mental barrier of the $200 - $300 for a HID kit.




Sway's LF240 converted to HID with a D2S bulb:

[bushy555]

try again