Outer Limits 4x4 Board

ok, we have finally found the weak link on these cv's!!!










and it is??????




















the nissan stuff bolted to them!!!!!


i have done a bit of testing in the off season with mick from superior in his GQ comp ute, and we have absolutely destroyed 2 locking hubs!! they explode like squashing a mandarine!!! they split into 6 even pieces.
The aluminuim outer casing is terribly weak, they are quite brittle and the internal "spline" design is pathetic from an engineering perspective. it is the worst way you could ever design something that is meant to take sooo much load, and honestly i cant understand how nissans dont blow them all the time - dont they drive them hard enough or have the nissan cv's always been the fuseable link!!!

i think we might have to use toyota hubs to get some strength back in it, as the nissan ones are just crap!!! at least they might be a lot closer to the AMAZING strength of the CAL-OFFROAD cv's.

(eg: when we blew the 2nd one we were backing up a 5ft 70deg ledge at full lock!! insane stuff )


ps. pull a hub apart and have a real look and think about them!! they use round bar as the "spline" which is just wrong!! as the "pressure angle" on the drive contact face decreases as the outer casing deforms and acts like a little ramp or wedge which produces more pressure to expand the casing and produce a failure!!!

sounds good to me i'd rather change a hub out then a CV or a axel or a cw&p

Hoonz wrote:sounds good to me i'd rather change a hub out then a CV or a axel or a cw&p

Yes takes a whole 2-4 min to change a hub and your back on the track.
Way better than snapping standard or welded cv's.
We did some testing prior to these cv's with the welded items and just snapped the end of the cv's not to mention the lack of turning circle from welded units .
So i still stand buy my opinion that these are Awesome Cv's and worth their weight in gold.
Talking to cal he is bringing in a limited number of GU cv's so we will get a pair into Robbie Marshall's Comp truck ,that will test them, as he has broken 5 PAIRS of GU cv's and countless rear axles in less than a few months .( but he hasnt broken hubs ?? )
My guess will be a lot of broken hubs and still good Cal cv's
I'll keep you posted .

Alternative to Nissan factory hubs are splined hub flanges. Means the "hub" is always locked, so if you break a CV and can't stop and replace it immediately, it will probably chew out the inside of the knuckle.

1MadEngineer wrote:ok, we have finally found the weak link on these cv's!!!

and it is??????

the nissan stuff bolted to them!!!!!


i have done a bit of testing in the off season with mick from superior in his GQ comp ute, and we have absolutely destroyed 2 locking hubs!! they explode like squashing a mandarine!!! they split into 6 even pieces.

About time They are a shit design, but for some reason they seem to be reasonably strong given said shit design. Must be full of fairy dust or something.

Do the broken bits fall away from the CV stub without trashing the spline?

A simple Cr-Mo drive slug will be the go to replace the f/w hub.

Wendle wrote:

1MadEngineer wrote:ok, we have finally found the weak link on these cv's!!!

and it is??????

the nissan stuff bolted to them!!!!!


i have done a bit of testing in the off season with mick from superior in his GQ comp ute, and we have absolutely destroyed 2 locking hubs!! they explode like squashing a mandarine!!! they split into 6 even pieces.

About time They are a shit design, but for some reason they seem to be reasonably strong given said shit design. Must be full of fairy dust or something.

Do the broken bits fall away from the CV stub without trashing the spline?

A simple Cr-Mo drive slug will be the go to replace the f/w hub.

Didn't somebody somewhere sometime make fusible hubs so that they popped instead of ur CV?
Sounds like an easily repairable weakest link is a good thing.
Easier to carry half a dozen hubs than half a dozen CV's and axles AND quicker to replace.

Yes the times that we have broken hubs they have not damaged the cv's at all ,the hubs tend to smash outwards slightly, this is why you cannot compare nissan hubs to toyota as the toyota's almost always damage the spline.

this is why you cannot compare nissan hubs to toyota as the toyota's almost always damage the spline.

This is why you get the hub gears when ordering longfeilds.(No spline damage)

Wendle wrote:

1MadEngineer wrote:ok, we have finally found the weak link on these cv's!!!

and it is??????

the nissan stuff bolted to them!!!!!


i have done a bit of testing in the off season with mick from superior in his GQ comp ute, and we have absolutely destroyed 2 locking hubs!! they explode like squashing a mandarine!!! they split into 6 even pieces.

About time They are a shit design, but for some reason they seem to be reasonably strong given said shit design. Must be full of fairy dust or something.

Do the broken bits fall away from the CV stub without trashing the spline?

A simple Cr-Mo drive slug will be the go to replace the f/w hub.

you are right! i think it is time for some drive slugs. (no prob now it has a twin stick Tcase) but we still might look at fitting an ASAIN style hub as the longfield chromo hub gear is mega strong and the outer locking collar is at least on a square-cut spline section.
Then i spose it will just destroy H233 centers.






Can you get H260 front!

As I said back on the 18th. August in this post -

"I'd rather pack half a dozen free wheeling hubs and change them out in the field than CVs or axles." (or diffs)

This to me would be the 'designed' weak point. You have to have a weak point to protect the rest of your drivetrain. If it is something that is cheap, easily replaced, requires very few tools, doesn't damage other components when it fails, and takes up bugger all room in your spares kit, then great. I've already starting to collect a few sets.

How do the AVM free wheeling hubs compare?? Anyone ?

Peter K.

they are a good weak link, crap design n would normally break before standard C.V's

nastytroll wrote:they are a good weak link, crap design n would normally break before standard C.V's

I've seen quite a few genuine Nissan FWHs explode when reversing up an rock ledge or similar - when the full weight of the vehicle is on them. They let go before the CVs. They seem to hold up OK under shock load where the CVs fail - but not under gradually applied heavy load.

If the AVMs are a bit stronger (IF ??) it will still provide a weak link but maybe last better than the genuine hub. I might pull a AVM set apart and have a closer look at how they are constructed.

Peter K.

we removed AVM's to fit nissans, you will see why when you strip the hub

yep AMV are shite ... nissan hubs are better


perfect weak link .. the only reason why i busted a nissan hub was from the CV blowing it out ...

Thanks guys - saves me pulling apart a set of AVMs.

Peter K.

This has been really interesting, as myself and probably alot of other people have already laminated there diffs ect it would save alot of time, and money in the lomg run.

I run AVM hubs and have broken CVs and ruined the inner axle without damaging the hubs.

Mario wrote:I run AVM hubs and have broken CVs and ruined the inner axle without damaging the hubs.

yeh so have i ... many many times

it was this one occasion bouncing on a brand new set of CVs and the shaft let go in a big way and blew it to bits

So are AVM's shit or not ?

What the general concencous ?

CWBYUP wrote:So are AVM's shit or not ?

What the general concencous ?

shit i kept stripping them out

AVM crap

Well i know that i said early Jan, and its now nearly March but my new CAL-OFFROAD cv's arrived today will be shaw and let you all know how they go.

And i got a free shirt

Boltaction Billy wrote:Well i know that i said early Jan, and its now nearly March but my new CAL-OFFROAD cv's arrived today will be shaw and let you all know how they go.

And i got a free shirt

Sweet

has any one seen or heard of any one braking these cromo cv's yet , or are they still bulletproof so far?

gqpete wrote:has any one seen or heard of any one braking these cromo cv's yet , or are they still bulletproof so far?

No I dont know of a single CV or axle breaking yet, but could be wrong.

I can tell you that a number of patrol diffed rigs at Tuff Truck on the weekend had them and not one was broken over the whole weekend.

This despite being punished on some of the tuffest tracks that tuff truck had ever built and on vehicles I would think all running 38" + plus tyres.

I also know that a few competitors didnt have them when they got there but had bought them by the end of the weekend, after seeing em in action, they are damn good....

I have beenrunning them for a bit now, 3rd event on them, now im only running 38's, nothing huge, Tuff truck last year saw us blow 4 CV's to bits and one rear axle, this year saw us Twist one rear axel (we pulled them out to check them, and i replaced it, dont think it would have lasted the whole weekend, but i have to say the CAL CV's and AXLEs heald their own,

Bartso, who is also running them, on 44's i believe blew a few hubs but CV's and axles heald up strong, never saw him oull one out,

so i say a big thanks to CAL and evryone who R&D' these, they are awsome,

We are still using the cal cv's in our comp truck with 37 sticky trepadors and turbo petrol motor doing high speed and rockcrawling no problems yet, typical rear axles twisting and we have killed a fare few hubs .
We are currently working on a hub boot that will stop the hub's from blowing apart and we will keep you guys posted on the R&D as we are going to fit them to our truck and bartso's over the next couple of weeks.
37 stickys and 44 swampers will show what the weak link is then, i am guessing the gearset.
Should create a pretty damn strong front end

Okay bit more of a update, in the Superior Pro Truck challenge we run approx 9 stages in Pro truck and 9 stages in outlaw class running 37 trepadors comp spec tyres over 2 days . 8lbs pressure in front and 6lbs in rear.
We now have a rear disconnect on the transfer and twin sticks in the transfer for front digs and rear burns.
The motor is approx 260RWHP without the NOS.
We manufactured what we called a "hub Boot " and that is a Steel Mecavel hollow bar ring approx 25mm thick and the width of the hub. This is press fitted onto the hubs and small plates than welded to the ring with the factory hub bolts go through so there is no chance of the ring ever coming of.
The event had lots of 2nd gear tyre smoke coming from both ends on solid rock, we did almost vertical front digs with most of the weight of the (full bodied truck ) on the cv's at full turning circle as well as rear burns and climbing UNDERCUT ledges. Neither Cv's axles or hubs broke. Prior to the hub rings we were blowing hubs reversing up steep banks all the time.
Apart from a tie rod end breaking all we broke was a rear axle doing a burn on the 18th stage.
The cv's are a little noisy but we have constantly flogged them in many comps over the past 6 months.
We have sold a few sets now mainly to the winch challenge teams and i have not had any reports of any problems apart from hubs.
From the punishment i have given them I would say these are a awesome investment if you are in the competition scene.
If you are one of the guys who are having problems with the hubs blowing you now know how to fix this.
We may start selling the hub boots in a month or 2 but if you need them sooner you'll have to make them yourself

Good work cal
Cal CV's are $1850 a set www.superiorengineering.com.au or cal offroad

1Madeng. your being a little unfair on the GU running gear don't you think?
What type of driving scenarios were the front diff components designed for? Seriously how many people out there are blowing hubs?
260RWHP and NOS, 37"Treps, 6&8 PSI, full lock, reversing up 70Deg.
Get real. What would you expect?
You and Superior are doing great work but don't crap in pockets.

Al.

just to give you an idea on the sort of PUNISHMENT i inflicted on this truck,
During the comp on the weekend, Micks GQ did 20 stages!!! more than most would do in 2 years of comps!! and he gave is F####in what for on some stages!! With the new twin stick in the tcase he was butting the front end into 4ft walls and doing 2wd burnouts while turning the steering, then back it up and rip on the hyd handbrake and smoke up the new maxxis stickys doing a front dig!!!