Outer Limits 4x4 Board

Excellent, I will message Glen again and see if he can put all the shite together in a kit.

Man I am sick of this thing not bloody idling properly!!

I dont think i saw anything about it on his site, you may need get it direct from B&G, but if you ask on the Oz & NZ forum someone will know if you can get the parts from Jaycar locally.

He has mentioned he can, I am waiting for his response as to whether he can put the whole kit together.

I've just finished building the MegaSquirt! The hardest bit is telling what resistance the resistors are via the colour code. I think I'm blind now!

Mine all works a treat on the MegaStim (another little kit you practice on which you then use to test the construction of the MS and then it acts like your car and you can play with the MS and the PC software without wiring a badly built unit into your car and possibly frying some components).

About the flyback board. My understanding is that V8 RR don't need one as we already have a resistor pack which is mounted under the airflow metre. So don't worry about it.

The latest kits, DO have ignition control, so I'm told. If Glens Garage is selling V2.2 it should have the software and hardware to do the ignition built in. If he's not selling V2.2. I'd tell him to get V2.2. It's the latest. I got my kit off the Aust forum bulk buy. Ask them when the next buy is on. There is also an American, Rodney Sparks, who sell completely built kits. Look him up in the MS forums.

You can add the ignition ability to older kits, the software is readily available, but I believe there is some minor mods required to the board. I don't know what they are but you should be able to find them on the MS forums.

This is the address for the forums index.
http://www.msefi.com/

Happy hunting.

PS. I've now got to get a 02 sensor fitted and then install the unit in the car.
PSS. FridgeFrezzer, do you have a map I could use to save me having to start from scratch with the MegaTuning?

ytt105 wrote:PS. I've now got to get a 02 sensor fitted and then install the unit in the car.

Just a question ytt105 where are you going to install the o2 sensor (how far down ?) and which one did you go with ? Did you just grab one off a commodore wreck or did you get a new one.

What sort of $$ did you get the kit for and how long did it take you solder up ?

Thanks
Tom

I just got a quote from AutoPro for a generic 3 wire, O2 sensor for $108.

Hell No!

Anyone know where I can get one cheaper.

I'm going to install it in the crossover, near the left header pipe.

I paid $240 for the MegaSquirt and MegaStim, all delivered, via the Aust forum group buy.

It took me probably 6 hours to solder up, but that was over a couple of days.
Included a couple of trips to Dick Smith to get bits I thought I needed, eg 9pin computer cable, some diodes I thought I blew up but didn't, etc.

ytt105 wrote:I just got a quote from AutoPro for a generic 3 wire, O2 sensor for $108.

Hell No!

Anyone know where I can get one cheaper.

I'm going to install it in the crossover, near the left header pipe.

I paid $240 for the MegaSquirt and MegaStim, all delivered, via the Aust forum group buy.

It took me probably 6 hours to solder up, but that was over a couple of days.
Included a couple of trips to Dick Smith to get bits I thought I needed, eg 9pin computer cable, some diodes I thought I blew up but didn't, etc.

A VL commodore or a Similar year Skyline has a 3wire 02 Sensor.

Just got the latest word on the revision of the MS PC board.

The word is:
"Bruce and Al are making a minor revision to it to make the component lead spacing more consistent with the current parts list, and to add a jumper position or two to make it easier to add a flyback board, and possibly some MegaSquirt II compatibility features. MS II will install in any MS PCB; the coming revision will just make it a little easier."

I guess that I will be waiting a little longer and good 'ol carby clean has me idling again. Can't stop that crazy 2200 RPM rev up on cold start though........

UpToNoGood, don't wait for the revisions. After just soldering mine on the weekend I can assure you the changes are purely cosmetic.
Order one now and go for it.

I got a couple of maps from other RR drivers last night, so I might plug it in before I get the O2 sensor organised just to see how it goes.

he he ... dont wanna put a spanner in the works but for those who are really serious with their fuel and ignition set ups, you cant go past a Haltech e6x and a wide band o2 sensor .. got one on mine and they are brillant, the haltech even controls the thermo fans, as well as the supercharger and intercooler fans ..( soon to be fitted)
it will run everything, and you can log a trip and view it for better tuning ... also has the duel maps, so you can have an economy crusing and your max power cliff climbing maps ...
oncer you have a little play and read the manuel it isnt too hard to get pretty right ... or you can have it properly dynoed
i am sure megasquirt is good for the money you pay .. but like all things if your going to do it .. do it the best you can especially on the RANGEE !!

all the best guys ...
cheers
Rangee

Rangee - the Megasquirt can do pretty much all of what you mentioned for a poofteenth of the cost. What makes it even better is that it can be customised and functions added. With other ecu's like haltech, wolf etc, if you want new features, you have to go buy the next model up.

So consider your spanner returned.

But some of us have tight ( ( )'s !!!!

ytt105 - I can send you my current really rich and not very good 3.9 map if you like, e-mail me.

Rangee: you cant go past a Haltech e6x and a wide band o2 sensor

What, just one WB02 sensor? The MS-II will take one sensor for each bank.


even controls the thermo fans, as well as the supercharger and intercooler fans ..( soon to be fitted)

Yep, MS will do tht.

it will run everything, and you can log a trip and view it for better tuning

Just plug the MS into your laptop and you can log every operating parameter. MSTweak will even read and analyze the log file and suggest better tuning maps.

... also has the duel maps, so you can have an economy crusing and your max power cliff climbing maps ...

MS-II has dual maps for fuel and ignition, plus they've gone up to 12x12 or 16x16 maps, if you really want that complexity. It will also have the normal VE map plus a wideband O2 target map, so with a wideband sensor it will tune towards the best mixture at all load/rpm's.

oncer you have a little play and read the manuel it isnt too hard to get pretty right ... or you can have it properly dynoed

Handily the MS not only has a huge online manual but a forum full of people willing to help, including the guys who design, program, and build it. You can also download from somewhere a bit of softwre that analyzes log files and will calculate your power readings from ignition events / acceleration in a known gear.

The MS-II also adds, or can have added:
Rev limiter (soft sprk cut or hard fuel cut)
Launch control
Overboost protection
Boost control
Boost enrichment
Water injection control
PWM idle for use with variable valves
Nitrous control (min rpm, new timing map or fixed retard, boost enrichment)

And no doubt a few other tricks by the time it's been out for a few days

Can you guys tell me if this thing has a fuel cut function (for awsome engine braking).

Also does it allow fully sequential injection and fully sequential ignition (by coil on plug and using some sort of optical sensor to get cam position )

I have been also looking at getting the haltech e6x as you can get it with a flying lead loom (just attach all sensors and plugs, a warranty incase something f's up too ). The only thing the e6x lacks is fully seqential injection and ignition for a v8 (only a six I think )

Cheers

Well by nature ignition is kinda in sequence with the engine

The current best / easiest system of ignition is to use a ford EDIS-8 or two EDIS-4 modules, which is all supported in MS-II or can be added to current MS. That uses wasted spark double-ended coils, but a lot of the EDIS stuff wil do multiple-spark (the aftermarket guys shout about this ability).

Sequential injection is one that crops up every 5 minutes - there's a FAQ on the MSEFI site somewhere about it. Basically it's a hell of a lot of effort for bugger all gain. That said, if YOU want to program it then MS CAN do it! I think someone may alreay have done it, or maybe MS-II will support it, who knows. Basically, the closer you look the more you'll find that sequential injection makes very little difference on a petrol engine. Even modern stuff is either banked (a-la the Rover V8) or just one or two common injectors on smaller vehicles.

See the FAQ bit here: http://www.megasquirt.info/manual/mfuel.htm#batch

As for fuel cut - well, yeah, you can set zero fuel at any point in the VE map if you really want, but you can also set decelleration fuel cut as one of the constants, most people tune it to provide the best response getting back on the gas and to prevent "shunting" on overrun, but you could be really agressive with this if you want.

If you were using MS for ignition too you could concievably be equally agressive with the timing advance, the trouble is the best values for engine braking could potentially end up damaging your engine. That said, Dave Haynes was thinking along the lines of firing the cylinder on the UP stroke to get HUGE engine braking - but I thinkwe can all see why he's not exactly keen to experiment with this, the likelihood of killing your engine is huge if you get it wrong.

The flipside is you can tune the "idle" area of your maps (fuel & ignition) to give very agressive idle stabilisation.

I know that sequential ingnition and injection can be handy for adjusting individual cylinders in high hp conditions (ie one cylinder running to hot -computer adds more fuel, same deal with ignition ie detonation in one cylinder advance timing, or the other way round??). I know the top end computers like the motec m800 and haltech e11v2 and autronics can do this but I'm not sure about this MS-II stuff. The computer would be a replacement for a 97 disco so I'm hesitant to replace it with something I made. I am aiming in the long run to get high hp and torque so I want a good computer.

Interesting stuff. I will look into it more I think.

Stuee - there are people running the MS on drag racers and even a motorbike that holds a land speed record. I think your Disco will be fine. If you read the FAQ link I just posted you'll see that at higher power / RPM sequential injection actually loses what little advantage it had.

Remember - the people selling you these expensive kits are trying to make money and play on your fears. The people making MS are doing it because they didn't want to spend $1000 on a shiny box of tricks. With MS you *learn* what's going on, how it all works, and gain a much better understanding of engines and tuning them. Plus you can easily fix it if it goes wrong, rather than buy a new $1000 box of tricks.

The tuned V8's in racing use over here frequently use either a Weber 500 carb (or hosepipe as it may as well be!) or a "chipped" Lucas kit, which is still batch fire and less than ideal.

To find out who's running MS on what, check the success stories page:
http://www.msefi.com/viewforum.php?f=63
I think you'll have no problem finding people unning a far higher state of tune than you'd ever want to achieve with a Disco V8.

Adjusting indicidual cylinders - hmmm, unless you have a lambda sensor and knock sensor for each cylinder I can't see how they'd achieve any benefits here. Mind you, once they get spark ion sensing sorted out for MS it'll be waaaaay ahead of all those other kits anyway. Yes, they really are working on it.

Sounds good. I'm getting pulled in by advertising, just what I was criticizing in another thread .

Cheers

lol.. you went to all that explenation trouble for me ... thanks ...

even if it was = to a haltech .... could you realy put a megasquirt sticker on your car ..... what will people think you are .... a huge Wa#ker ??

lol... just a thought ....

good luck with them ....
cheers
Rangee

Rangee - I think it looks quite good actually:


Just out of interest how much did you pay for the Haltech?

fridgefreezer wrote:Just out of interest how much did you pay for the Haltech?

Haltech ECU - $2,000
Wide band O2 sensor and display - $740
Being the king of bling - Priceless!!!

i payed 1600 for the haltech

yeah .. i dont really care i wanted what i wanted .... back then i would probably do more damage then good with a megasquirt

looks like a hot wheels logo from when i was a kid with the match box cars .. lol...

and yeah it is a bling mobile ... but no fluffy dice !!!!!

wait till you see what i am going to build next ... he he he ...

cheers
Rangee

Arise, Sir Rangee, King Of Bling!


As long as you're happy with it that's the main thing. You can't do too much damage with fuelling, it's ignition mapping where you can really fuck things up... guess why I haven't done it yet

hey guys any word on a group by for us aussie guys?, im sick of lookin for ecus for my gti motor , plus other crap its missing, and this seems the best way out.

Try asking here.

Bazooked, if you get in quick there is a new gb about to be kicked of, so check the forum in the oz section.

I can't post on their site, I registered and confirmed their email but apparently I don't have 'privileges'?

Bugger!

You have to join the oz group. Check out the sticky thread at the top of the oz forum and this explains how to do it.

crap now i have to wait for moderator approval, can sum 1 put me down for a complete 1?

It only took a couple of hours for my account to be approved.

Patience young grasshopper!!!