Outer Limits 4x4 Board

if you want economy and a chunk more power and a simple conversion. 1.6 efi baleno. and butt load cheaper. boost is not always the answer

tanshi wrote:if you want economy and a chunk more power and a simple conversion. 1.6 efi baleno. and butt load cheaper. boost is not always the answer

thanks mate its on the cards.
my friend has told me the turbo is a r33 series 2 turbo and it spools up quicker and is smaller than you guys think.

zookieboi wrote:

lay80n wrote:

zookieboi wrote:

drakan69 wrote:your weber will not be able to handle positive boost pressure, therefore you motor will run lean, and you may blow the seals on your carby.
You could get your weber rebuilt for boost, that could cost you upwards of $600.
MSD boost timing masters are around $350 and allow you to retard the timing up to 3

when me and my mate were playing around with his skyline's psi ( its meant for 8 psi ) it didnt start missing untill 11-12 psi.

You are aware that a RB25DET has fuel injection and a much better ignition system than a zook. Research is your friend. There is much more to a good reliable turbo system than you are looking at so far. Drakan's list should give you an idea. Why not fit a 4A-GZE motor, more power, factory reliability (motor build for boost).

Layto....

well mainly i know turbo is the wrong way about it but i still want to retain some fuel economy. and also i think with just a turbo the drive line may stand a chance if i dont thrash it everywhere which i wont. with a hotted up toyota engine itll be a full driveline upgrade too

The biggest thing to do with driveline breakage is your right foot.
Remember that your using a turbo that spools up quick on a 2.5L motor on something half the size (1.3L).
Dont get me wrong, i say go for it if you want, i am considering doing a turbo at some stage soon myself, but remember what your getting yourself into. The fuel economy will not improve with a 1.3L turbo Vs say a baleno etc (both being installed//tuned correctly).

Layto....

lay80n wrote:

zookieboi wrote:

lay80n wrote:

zookieboi wrote:

drakan69 wrote:your weber will not be able to handle positive boost pressure, therefore you motor will run lean, and you may blow the seals on your carby.
You could get your weber rebuilt for boost, that could cost you upwards of $600.
MSD boost timing masters are around $350 and allow you to retard the timing up to 3

when me and my mate were playing around with his skyline's psi ( its meant for 8 psi ) it didnt start missing untill 11-12 psi.

You are aware that a RB25DET has fuel injection and a much better ignition system than a zook. Research is your friend. There is much more to a good reliable turbo system than you are looking at so far. Drakan's list should give you an idea. Why not fit a 4A-GZE motor, more power, factory reliability (motor build for boost).

Layto....

well mainly i know turbo is the wrong way about it but i still want to retain some fuel economy. and also i think with just a turbo the drive line may stand a chance if i dont thrash it everywhere which i wont. with a hotted up toyota engine itll be a full driveline upgrade too

The biggest thing to do with driveline breakage is your right foot.
Remember that your using a turbo that spools up quick on a 2.5L motor on something half the size (1.3L).
Dont get me wrong, i say go for it if you want, i am considering doing a turbo at some stage soon myself, but remember what your getting yourself into. The fuel economy will not improve with a 1.3L turbo Vs say a baleno etc (both being installed//tuned correctly).

Layto....

but its more fun =P and yeah i know what im getting myself into ill have everything prepared first. my family is very mechanically minded. dad designs and builds ultralights and uncle races honda's on track

zookieboi wrote:

drakan69 wrote:

zookieboi wrote: yeah there is alot of problems with adding power to a zook. although the total increase with weber + the turbo and exaust wouldnt be more than say. 50%, so you think this power increase will open pandoras box on my driveshaft?

what kind of weber are you going to be using, and where did you get it from? keeping in mind it has to be boost referenced to handle air pressure not just volume. Also what are you going to be using to control timing of your spark?

Not wanting to pick holes in your dreams, just interested in how much research you've done on this mod.
Speaking of mods, you know if you do this conversion you wont be able to drive it on anything under an open license, and no-one will cover you (3rd party) until your 25, unless your older already?

i havnt even begun to research timing issues etc. right now it looks like a lot of work. and i am 18 on my p's dont buy insurance. saves money =P
and cops wont suspect a lil zook having a turbo under the hood lol ill jsut put a fairing over it haha

its not goign to be something i drive every day either though.
i have a jacked up shorty vitara =)

Are you saying you DONT have insurance......you ShortyIQ idiot!

Spike_Sierra wrote:

zookieboi wrote:

drakan69 wrote:

zookieboi wrote: yeah there is alot of problems with adding power to a zook. although the total increase with weber + the turbo and exaust wouldnt be more than say. 50%, so you think this power increase will open pandoras box on my driveshaft?

what kind of weber are you going to be using, and where did you get it from? keeping in mind it has to be boost referenced to handle air pressure not just volume. Also what are you going to be using to control timing of your spark?

Not wanting to pick holes in your dreams, just interested in how much research you've done on this mod.
Speaking of mods, you know if you do this conversion you wont be able to drive it on anything under an open license, and no-one will cover you (3rd party) until your 25, unless your older already?

i havnt even begun to research timing issues etc. right now it looks like a lot of work. and i am 18 on my p's dont buy insurance. saves money =P
and cops wont suspect a lil zook having a turbo under the hood lol ill jsut put a fairing over it haha

its not goign to be something i drive every day either though.
i have a jacked up shorty vitara =)

Are you saying you DONT have insurance......you ShortyIQ idiot!

yeah im saying that lol i dont want insurance its a rip off. and im not goign to get it either

zookieboi wrote:
yeah im saying that lol i dont want insurance its a rip off. and im not goign to get it either

be interesting if you think that if you are involved in an accident and have to pay to fix someone elses' vehicle get 3rd party at least

grimbo wrote:

zookieboi wrote:
yeah im saying that lol i dont want insurance its a rip off. and im not goign to get it either

be interesting if you think that if you are involved in an accident and have to pay to fix someone elses' vehicle get 3rd party at least

dont you get 3rd party when you register your car?

zookieboi wrote:

grimbo wrote:

zookieboi wrote:
yeah im saying that lol i dont want insurance its a rip off. and im not goign to get it either

be interesting if you think that if you are involved in an accident and have to pay to fix someone elses' vehicle get 3rd party at least

dont you get 3rd party when you register your car?

not to cover you if you crash into another vehicle

CTP Personal Injury Insurance:

* Covers passengers, pedestrians, cyclists and other road users
* Covers injuries to the driver proportionally according to degree of fault - unless driver is entirely at fault
* Provides cover 24 hours a day, Australia-wide
* Provides compensation for reasonable medical and hospital costs and other related expenses
* Provides compensation for lost time at work (greater than seven days)
* May provide a lump sum payment for non-economic loss (eg loss of function; pain and suffering)
* Compensation may be reduced for victims who ignore certain basic road rules
* Does not cover damage to vehicles or other property

thanks for that. so i can get 3rd party insurance on a modified vehicle?

zookieboi wrote:

grimbo wrote:

zookieboi wrote:
yeah im saying that lol i dont want insurance its a rip off. and im not goign to get it either

be interesting if you think that if you are involved in an accident and have to pay to fix someone elses' vehicle get 3rd party at least

dont you get 3rd party when you register your car?

When you register your car (in NSW anyway) you get your green slip, which is 3rd party insurance. This covers your for any injury your cause to another person due to your driving. IT DOES NOT COVER ANY PROPERTY DAMAGE YOUR CAUSE. 3rd party property covers property damage. If you dont want to comprehensive insure your rig fine, but get 3rd party property at least, otherwise if you hit a brand new merc, your paying for it!!!

Layto....

Grimbo was too quick

Yes you can get 3rd party insurance for a modified rig. YOu just have to be up front with the insurance place, otherwise by concealing modifications you are comitting fraud and your insurance is worth nothing. Some places will either charge you more, or wont cover you. Being young, you will have more problems.

Layto....

lay80n wrote:

zookieboi wrote:

grimbo wrote:

zookieboi wrote:
yeah im saying that lol i dont want insurance its a rip off. and im not goign to get it either

be interesting if you think that if you are involved in an accident and have to pay to fix someone elses' vehicle get 3rd party at least

dont you get 3rd party when you register your car?

When you register your car (in NSW anyway) you get your green slip, which is 3rd party insurance. This covers your for any injury your cause to another person due to your driving. IT DOES NOT COVER ANY PROPERTY DAMAGE YOUR CAUSE. 3rd party property covers property damage. If you dont want to comprehensive insure your rig fine, but get 3rd party property at least, otherwise if you hit a brand new merc, your paying for it!!!

Layto....

well im getting that then lol theres alot of lambos and ferraris around gold coast area i might start dreaming while looking at it. @_@

cruising down the road behind some one in a beemer, when they drop their cigarette and stand on the brakes. you hit them in the ass so its your fault and your up for the cost of a new bmw, still think its a rip off?

tanshi wrote:cruising down the road behind some one in a beemer, when they drop their cigarette and stand on the brakes. you hit them in the ass so its your fault and your up for the cost of a new bmw, still think its a rip off?

why would they drop the cigarette on the brakes lol?

but yeah im getting insurance now haha

Ive had a quick read over most posts, Im sure its been said in some other way or another but I think the Turbo and Engine is a miss match and wouldn't work very well. I may be wrong but the Turbo is coming of a Engine that has two more cylinders and a larger capacity which would be able to handle winding the turbo up. Your smaller 1.3 will probably only be able to generate boost late in its rev range which would mean its only giving power for a small period. Using a smaller turbo which comes on boost alot lower in the rev range is what you need especially if your only looking at small amounts of boost such as 4psi or so.

yes you can get it for some modifications but others like oversized tyres may lead to a disallowed claim if they can be attributed to the cause of the accident.

thanks again grimbo

hmm looks like ill go down the path of a smaller turbo charger.
maybe something out or those nissan march turbo's or a charade, has anybody seen or heard of a conversion done with a specific turbo?

There is a link to Rhetts injection & turbo thread in the 6th post in this thread

Have you considered a supercharger, like the SC12 of the Toyota 4A-GZE, check out MART's build thread for his conversion. Also mud4b also had a SC12, there may be some details in there too.

Layto....

another problem you'll encounter is that traction will be a major issue in your ute. I used to own a ute and when we built the rear tray/cage we added extra weight as it was too light in the back and struggled at times to generate enough traction.

hmm ive some thought about it and turbo lag wouldnt be a problem i normally do gear changes at 3,400-4100 rpm. and say if the boost really started to kick in at 3,600 i could choose how i want to drive. conservatively or have some fun

for a family that is possibly into cars and mechanical things. they haven't taught you the basics of ownig a car which is insurance.
I wasn't allowed to drive my car until I rang an insurance company and got a cover note. which would cover me from that moment on and you pay the bill when they mail it to you.

its not only cars that cost money!
you go and run into a traffic signal box and wreck it! they are not cheap.
you hit a telegragh pole that has a transformer on it and you wreck it! they are really not cheap.
around the gold coast you would propably be more likely to hit a transformer that it sitting on the ground in a big green box!

and just because you can get a turbo for free doesn't mean it is a good idea to put it on a 1.3L suzuki

ashley

germo wrote:for a family that is possibly into cars and mechanical things. they haven't taught you the basics of ownig a car which is insurance.
I wasn't allowed to drive my car until I rang an insurance company and got a cover note. which would cover me from that moment on and you pay the bill when they mail it to you.

its not only cars that cost money!
you go and run into a traffic signal box and wreck it! they are not cheap.
you hit a telegragh pole that has a transformer on it and you wreck it! they are really not cheap.
around the gold coast you would propably be more likely to hit a transformer that it sitting on the ground in a big green box!

and just because you can get a turbo for free doesn't mean it is a good idea to put it on a 1.3L suzuki

ashley

thanks mate. i wont go ahead with it now..












jokes lol

my last sierra was turbo'd on 33's with stock gearing( its on ebay right now) and drove pretty good but gearing is better than a turbo for 4wding!! it was on boost from about 1200 rpm. the skyline turbo won't come on boost till about 3 or 4000 at least in the 1.3 so will be crap to drive. i'm doing another turbo sierra right now, going to go a carby set up as i'm short of cash right now.

get a smaller turbo and it will be a lot more drivable if not you'll only be on boost when your flogging the crap (up in the rev's) out of your car.

im not trying to put you off what you want to do. I think it would be interesting to see if it works well!

just for your own sake. get 3rd party property damage, it doesn't cost much.


and really research what you want to do, before you do it or spend a lot of cash.

and remember this is the internet and some people here are in fairy land. just because you read it on here does not mean its right. your mates might know more and considering they may be the ones that help you I would listen to them, rather than say to them, oh but this guy off the net said I should do it this way. is that guy on the net there spinning spanners!

just some food for thought!

ashley

The RB25 T3 turbo is designed for a 2.5L engine. Even with the ceramic exhaust wheel and ball bearings its not a quick spooling turbo. On an RB20 engine they don't spool until around 3000rpm and hit full boost until after 3500rpm, you're not going to be seeing boost on a 1.3L zook until well past 4500rpm.

Also, they come with a 7psi actuator, you won't be able to get a 4psi one so you'd have to work out another way of reducing the boost.

If you're really set on getting a turbo then the largest you want is a T25 from a CA18DET (about $150) or even better a T2 from a 1.5L Exa.

ps. Twin turboing an RB25DET is a stupid idea when there's single turbos that will do a much better job for much less cost.

So .. on stock gears, with I am guessing a carb etc built for boost, manual timing, the thing will be a pig off boost .. how are you going to get the motor up to the RPM range to get the boost to get you power .. especially in power sapping sand ?

Keep a good supply of cluthes on hand .. sierra ones are not known for their ability to handle lots of power.
I ended up with a custom sintered copper 5 puck jobber to keep the clutch from being chewed up by my 1.6 pulling 32's on clsoe to stock gearing.

love_mud wrote:So .. on stock gears, with I am guessing a carb etc built for boost, manual timing, the thing will be a pig off boost .. how are you going to get the motor up to the RPM range to get the boost to get you power .. especially in power sapping sand ?

Keep a good supply of cluthes on hand .. sierra ones are not known for their ability to handle lots of power.
I ended up with a custom sintered copper 5 puck jobber to keep the clutch from being chewed up by my 1.6 pulling 32's on clsoe to stock gearing.

im thinking of getting SU or weber carbs, sports exaust and a mid cam shaft and see how it goes then, that will probably do me.
also im looking at buying a rear diff locker. none of this weld shit just something i can switch back and fourth when needed.

zookieboi wrote:
im thinking of getting SU or weber carbs, sports exaust and a mid cam shaft and see how it goes then, that will probably do me.
also im looking at buying a rear diff locker. none of this weld shit just something i can switch back and fourth when needed.

Thats alot more reasonable.
The SU's are quite offroad friendly and will give you a pretty good power upgrade the tradeoff is that fuel use will skyrocket (up from your high 8 liters per hundred to as high as 15+ liters per 100Ks)
The weber can be a good upgrade as well, if your willing to spend the $$ to get it right. Power increase will not be as good as the SU's from what I am told but the fuel economy is better and the intake mainfolds are not total custom jobbers.

The intake\cam\exhaust will net you a few more HP. If I was looking at spending the $$ .. I would definately be looking at spending it on EFI, best off-road easy starting etc. Down the track will be more easily adapted to forced induction as well if you decide you still want to go down that path.

For offroad performance, get the locker .. single best mod you can do to improve your performance in the bush.

love_mud wrote:

zookieboi wrote:
im thinking of getting SU or weber carbs, sports exaust and a mid cam shaft and see how it goes then, that will probably do me.
also im looking at buying a rear diff locker. none of this weld shit just something i can switch back and fourth when needed.

Thats alot more reasonable.
The SU's are quite offroad friendly and will give you a pretty good power upgrade the tradeoff is that fuel use will skyrocket (up from your high 8 liters per hundred to as high as 15+ liters per 100Ks)
The weber can be a good upgrade as well, if your willing to spend the $$ to get it right. Power increase will not be as good as the SU's from what I am told but the fuel economy is better and the intake mainfolds are not total custom jobbers.

The intake\cam\exhaust will net you a few more HP. If I was looking at spending the $$ .. I would definately be looking at spending it on EFI, best off-road easy starting etc. Down the track will be more easily adapted to forced induction as well if you decide you still want to go down that path.

For offroad performance, get the locker .. single best mod you can do to improve your performance in the bush.

Locker closley followed by gearing (probably about equal ). Wait till its locked, geared, and possibly injected. Then see if you still want to add a turbo.

Layto....