Outer Limits 4x4 Board

BowTieGQ wrote:Good point Yom. Also Shane, why aren't there flexy coils for the front? Wouldn't they be a good match for the flex arm? Or am I jumping the gun and you have things in the pipeline?

its like the people with +5" lifts who just go and do beachwork.

im pretty sure flex is like lift. apparently the more you have the cooler you must be, even if it doesn't make it go any better.

Yom wrote:

BowTieGQ wrote:Good point Yom. Also Shane, why aren't there flexy coils for the front? Wouldn't they be a good match for the flex arm? Or am I jumping the gun and you have things in the pipeline?

its like the people with +5" lifts who just go and do beachwork.

im pretty sure flex is like lift. apparently the more you have the cooler you must be, even if it doesn't make it go any better.

Hmmm very interesting quote about flex !!! I am not sure but I always thought if you could keep the wheels on the ground you would get more traction and keep the vehicle more stable but I could be wrong. But here are a couple of pics of the guys I was wheeling with. The red 60 series nearly went over this is the same place the gu flexed through . the other one is a gq two inch lift front wheel in air no traction ??? But please correct me if i am wrong if the increased flex is just to look cool.

Just putting the pics together

hay *cruiser* is that out at landcruiser park. it looks really familiar cus i almost rolled my lux on it aswell.. and ur right about the more flex u hav makes the car more stable and more capable and on top of that it also looks awesome so in my eyes flex is always a good thing.

by the sounds of it not many people like dobinsons or efs coils ino i wouldnt if u need 2 put spacers in them 2 even it out thats pretty bad.thx i will definately b goin flexy coils cus there has only been 2 people complain about them over the other 500 that like them so i think ino wat im gunna pick.

*cruiser* wrote:
Hmmm very interesting quote about flex !!! I am not sure but I always thought if you could keep the wheels on the ground you would get more traction and keep the vehicle more stable

It depends on the situation. I ran dropout cones on my first Safari so I could run long shocks, but could get no further than I could with shorter shocks. As soon as I was at the point where the coil was moving away from the chassis, there was no downward pressure on that wheel, so having the extra travel did SFA apart from look impressive. Of course, it didn't look quite as good when you still couldn't drive though anyway and it felt less stable on sidlings.
Of course, the flex coils should still provide some downward pressure, so will have to look at a set when we are over on holiday next.
May go heavier duty though so I can get the flex arms working at their best.

KIWI wrote:
It depends on the situation. I ran dropout cones on my first Safari so I could run long shocks, but could get no further than I could with shorter shocks. As soon as I was at the point where the coil was moving away from the chassis, there was no downward pressure on that wheel, so having the extra travel did SFA apart from look impressive. Of course, it didn't look quite as good when you still couldn't drive though anyway and it felt less stable on sidlings.
Of course, the flex coils should still provide some downward pressure, so will have to look at a set when we are over on holiday next.
May go heavier duty though so I can get the flex arms working at their best.

Took the words straight out of my keyboard.

As soon as your coils leave the chassis the articulation isn't doing you any major favours.

heaps of downtravel is also useless if you have no uptravel.

GQ's lift front wheels because the suspension doesnt work unless there's weight on it. Going uphill even slightly under acceleration = weight shift to the rear meaning front wheels go airborne.

Yom wrote:

KIWI wrote:
It depends on the situation. I ran dropout cones on my first Safari so I could run long shocks, but could get no further than I could with shorter shocks. As soon as I was at the point where the coil was moving away from the chassis, there was no downward pressure on that wheel, so having the extra travel did SFA apart from look impressive. Of course, it didn't look quite as good when you still couldn't drive though anyway and it felt less stable on sidlings.
Of course, the flex coils should still provide some downward pressure, so will have to look at a set when we are over on holiday next.
May go heavier duty though so I can get the flex arms working at their best.

Took the words straight out of my keyboard.

As soon as your coils leave the chassis the articulation isn't doing you any major favours.

heaps of downtravel is also useless if you have no uptravel.

GQ's lift front wheels because the suspension doesnt work unless there's weight on it. Going uphill even slightly under acceleration = weight shift to the rear meaning front wheels go airborne.

Kiwi, For sure have a look at the coils when you are over next. Give Shane from suspension stuff a call he is very helpful !!!

Yom ,the reason for drop out cones is so you can run the longer shocks to unsure you get max travel even if it is just an inch or two with downward pressure. This combination works great in my GU so I am very happy with it. I beleive it still does not effect up travel as the pic shows.

83-MUD-LUX, yeah mate all this was up at Landcruiser Park on the labour day weekend. Some of the pics are at the big holes at the bottom of Telecom hill, and the 60 series was from memory somewhere along test track ?? The reason I went 4 inch flexys was for the rock step ups like cruiser canyon just for the extra bit of clearance.

uptravel is only changed if you lengthen your bump stop or your shock is so long that it acts as the bumpstop so if you haven't done anything there then uptravel should remain standard.

Don't doubt the drop out cones don't work - they have a purpose and they do as intended. Definately not questioning the performance of the flexy coils either, as they obviously do as intended as well.

I'm simply questioning whether that extra wheel travel you're getting with the coil flopping around on the dropout cone is really worth it. There is really only one way to test this and that is to limit axle travel with some straps right before the extending coil starts to come away from the chassis and see if you can still drive where you were driving beforehand. This is the sort of dopey thing I'd do on a weekend if it were my vehicle just to experiment - I can understand if you can't be bothered.

The usual 3" lift flexy coil kits are running 750mm rear shocks, no drop out cones are used or 790 or at a push as some have done 830mm.

For the 4" lift rear flexy coils we can use 790mm rear shocks with no drop out cones or 830mm with drop out cones.

For the 5" lift rear flexy coils we use 830mm shocks with no drop out cones.

I think you would want to move shock mounts to use 900mm or 1050mm shocks.

With all the kits I have found that increasing the bump stops have not reduced flex but just kept tyres of guards so it hasn't been an issue.

p.s. 2" lift flexy coils just use the 3" lift rear shocks at 700mm extended which is the EFS 4" lift shock.

Shane

For those who have good quality flex photos and you have our flexy coils can you please email them to me because I am putting an ad in 4WD Custom Mag (and 4WD Action Mag) and they need some photos as of yesterday. I will cover any number plates.

Cheers
Shane

I have plenty mate, what's you email addy?
Just send me a pm but I think I have sent you some pics in the past....

Yom wrote:uptravel is only changed if you lengthen your bump stop or your shock is so long that it acts as the bumpstop so if you haven't done anything there then uptravel should remain standard.

Don't doubt the drop out cones don't work - they have a purpose and they do as intended. Definately not questioning the performance of the flexy coils either, as they obviously do as intended as well.

I'm simply questioning whether that extra wheel travel you're getting with the coil flopping around on the dropout cone is really worth it. There is really only one way to test this and that is to limit axle travel with some straps right before the extending coil starts to come away from the chassis and see if you can still drive where you were driving beforehand. This is the sort of dopey thing I'd do on a weekend if it were my vehicle just to experiment - I can understand if you can't be bothered.

As Shane has shown above is the shock lengths he uses for his coils. I run the 830mm with drop out cones. The coils dont drop out a long way,they only just drop out. I do run longer bump stops so i dont bottom the shocks. I mean I could go try limit straps to see but I cant really see the point as am getting great articulation and driving some very difficult tracks without switching on the lockers. All the pics are without the lockers !! But if I get the time I will try it and give you some feedback, after all I do understand where you are coming from and it would be a good test.

What are the flexi coils like with towing heavyish loads, like car trailers, motorbikes and camping gear etc. How do they handle on the road? I guessin you still run swaybars but with quick disconnects, but what bout the ppl with the superior super flex front arm?

Does everyone know that allowing a coil to leave its seat or top hat at full droop is illegal regardless of cones? Not something that will get noticed pulled over on the side of the road though, unless inspectors start carrying ramps with them lol.

Someone was telling me that dobinsons werent that good and most of the time you ended up with a 4b with different heights at all four corners requiring coil spacers to even things up. What are your thoughts on this?[quote]Well their coils are as good as most and cheaper than most. Only complaint I had was about a set of coils to return an SS Commodore to legal height and got sent wrong coils 3 times in a row. 1st two sets were still too low, 3rd set it looked like a lifted 4by lol.

SilverBulletBM wrote:What are the flexi coils like with towing heavyish loads, like car trailers, motorbikes and camping gear etc. How do they handle on the road? I guessin you still run swaybars but with quick disconnects, but what bout the ppl with the superior super flex front arm?

The heavy duty rear flexy coils are designed to carry 200kg +. The load carrying ability is usually the same as normal coils for most flexy coils but sometimes I do make a flexy coils slightly softer.

For the 3" lift coils I would say you need heavy duty flexy coils at about the 140kg of constant load mark. If you every now and then put 400kg on your normal duty coils, your flexy coils might drop slighly further then a linear coil.

Whatever the brand of your coil and no matter the design, the best way to kill your coils is to overload them. In this situation Dobinsons coils do last longer then the other brands but not forever.

Shane

Would the flexy coils be ok if you mainly used your 4wd for 4wding but occasionally esp in summer months tow a boat, roughly 1300kg on tandem trailer?

macey wrote:Would the flexy coils be ok if you mainly used your 4wd for 4wding but occasionally esp in summer months tow a boat, roughly 1300kg on tandem trailer?

Yes, obviously it will sit down a bit in the rear while the boat is on the back.

Shane

EMAIL: shop@suspensionstuff.com.au

Yom wrote:I'm simply questioning whether that extra wheel travel you're getting with the coil flopping around on the dropout cone is really worth it. There is really only one way to test this and that is to limit axle travel with some straps right before the extending coil starts to come away from the chassis and see if you can still drive where you were driving beforehand. This is the sort of dopey thing I'd do on a weekend if it were my vehicle just to experiment - I can understand if you can't be bothered.

I have Shanes flexy 3" coils in the normal duty, great spring as long as you dont need to put a load on it, in saying that mine has a 70L fridge and some drawers in it all the time and it still sits higher that the front (only just)

Yom, for those of us that dont have the money for a real locker (arb, its really the best option) then getting the most flex out of your truck is the best way to keep making forward progress, as long as there is 2 back wheels on the ground the LSD will continue to push the truck forward.
Mine has 3" flexy coils and 830mm Procomp shocks in the back and Im super happy with the way it rides, travels, etc.

I fitted drop out cones to the thing when everything was swapped over, but to this day they've been redundant, the flexycoils are that good. Now Ive got to find a way to get the last 3 inches out of my shock as they dont drop out all the way, flexy bushes in trailing arms or long arm kit or something, and then got to get the front to flex!

Dano.

It seems there is a bit of confusion in regards to the flexy coils. I too was a bit confused at first as I thought they were just a soft coil. Wrong !!! The flexy part of the coil is at the top of the coil which allows more down travel. I have taken a pic to show the coil in the front. The great thing about the flexy coils Shane sells is the after sales service, he is always wanting feedback both positive or negative as he is always trying to improve his products !!!

Suspension Stuff wrote:
With all the kits I have found that increasing the bump stops have not reduced flex

Shane

Its a worry when someone in your position makes a statement that is so clearly false.
I know its probably just worded incorrectly, but people on this forum can tend to take advice quite literally, especially from someone in the trade.

steel wrote:

Suspension Stuff wrote:
With all the kits I have found that increasing the bump stops have not reduced flex

Shane

Its a worry when someone in your position makes a statement that is so clearly false.
I know its probably just worded incorrectly, but people on this forum can tend to take advice quite literally, especially from someone in the trade.

I know where you are coming from but I stand by my statement and I do mean it literally because you are only increasing the bump stops to the compressed length of the shock and the longer the shocks you have the more travel you get. (To a point of course)

Also a lot of people run bigger tyres so they were not getting anywhere near the bump stops previously so these guys actually achieve the distance between the extended length of the shocks more travel which is a full 2 inches more travel.

Anyway thanks for the opportunity to clarify myself better.

Shane

Ah, I didn't think there was a front flexy coil.
Any idea on weight of a set of 4" flexy coils/shocks? Over in a few weeks on holiday, so time for more goodies

KIWI wrote:Ah, I didn't think there was a front flexy coil.
Any idea on weight of a set of 4" flexy coils/shocks? Over in a few weeks on holiday, so time for more goodies

For accuracy, do you have a winch? Do you have drawers, LPG, full rear bar or frequently tow heavy weights?

Shane

We have normal and heavy duty flexy coils for 4", 5" and normal for 6". One day I will get around to the fronts for a 3" lift.

Shane

At this stage, I am planning on running a steel winch bar/winch. Rarely carry loads or tow but will eventually run a steel rear bar. Don't mind going slightly heavier on the back to make the front work more.
Just a rough weight will be fine, will then start pricing the cheapest option to get it back.



Cheers

Flexy coils dont only give you good travel without falling out of your truck but they also catch fish, i got me one in the rear drivers side coil on the wknd at glasshouse

lewie wrote:Flexy coils dont only give you good travel without falling out of your truck but they also catch fish, i got me one in the rear drivers side coil on the wknd at glasshouse

Got Pics? I will have to include this as one of the advantages.

pics nah i shredded it into several hundred pieces with the gernie

Suspension Stuff wrote:

grinch2 wrote:

Yom wrote:does that extra flex actually get you any further though?

i mean, your front moves no better than stock. kind of defies the point of upgrading the suspension if you only focus on the rear. may as well get an IFS vehicle and have the same articulation but more comfort.

not trying to offend you just puting it up for discussion

i didn't noticed any extra flex, the only advantage is the coils dont fall out as easy.

Haha, you won't notice any more flex if you don't get longer shocks.

Hi shane, Would +16mm longer rear lower control arms bring my diff back into line in a gu patrol to suit a 4inch lift?????