Outer Limits 4x4 Board

GRIMACE: have you tried any of the tough dog gear?

Jack S wrote:GRIMACE: have you tried any of the tough dog gear?

Personally, I don't like tough dog shocks. But many out there are running them and are happy with them.

Honestly I don't think you will be dissapointed no matter what lift kit you get.

To me I get the impression you just want to lift your car up a little bit, its not like you need super shocks to control huge amounts of rubber, and its not like you need super duper flex.

Research three or four kits, then haggle for the best price on the two your prefer

yes thats about it, there is no exact reason why i want a lift, basically i just want one!

I will be doing mostly on-road driving and on the odd occasion/weekend ill be doing some 4x4 work!

yet i want a good kit thats going to ride well on-road but still works well off-road aswell. And i would like to fit a 32" tyre (mickey thompson ATZ 4-rib).

Currently the best price i have is for tough dog at $1600, which ive been told is a awesome price! yet now i am just enquireing about some of the american brands that i can get good back up here in australia (looking at a skyjacker kit).

Thats the reason for this thread!!

Jack S,

Whilst there is some very good gear available in the US (at a price) have a look how well respected Australian gear is in the US market - OME is considered absolutely the bees knees in the states.

The fact is, we ask more of our vehicles than the average US user - we travel further on poor quality roads, load our vehicles more and generally tackle harder terrain with more standard vehicles than is common in the US.

Most US industry people are amazed at the terrain we drive and the vehicles we drive it with - it's common to build a heavily modified vehicle in the US to tackle terrain that many of us drive in our daily drivers.

You'll notice something about the US market too - it's "lift kit" dominated. In fact, OME pioneered the idea of a "suspension kit" in the US market - they're just not focussed on ride, handling or wheel travel - it's all about holding the height, which means higher spring rates and stiff shock valving to control them- It's all about the height.

You'll notice that there's never been a US suspension manufacturer that's ever done any good here - Rancho shocks were cool for a while, but since then we've wised up and realised they are a crap product with crap service here in Australia.

So to use skyjacker as your example:

Apparently for US$155 you can get some spacers to provide 2" of lift for the front end

right up to USD$1000 for front coilovers, rear shocks and add-a-leaves - Add a leaves - not even a rear leaf replacement.

There's heaps of options in between, but really, they're really going for the market that wants coil overs in the front end and 3" of lift. Sure, this stuff looks cheap by australian standards, but really, most of this is pretty cheap stuff.

If you want to get a real performance increase, you can look at companies like total chaos fabrication - but my word is that stuff expensive. http://www.chaosfab.com/96504.html

Seriously - You're in australia. We have the most mature off road accessory market int he world. I'd be happy to argue that the best value for money gear is here.

Steve.

Not many 07 Hilux's on sale in USA.

thanks steve, your post was really good and extremely informative, thats the type of post i was looking for!

So what is your opinion of the australain brand, Tough Dog??????

GRIMACE wrote:I love the bilstein shocks, only downfall is the single tube design is easily damaged. Hence my next set will run some rockgards.

Rock guards are a good idea with monotube, the billies have a very solid wall on them, it would take a pretty decent hit to damage them unlike some cheapo twin tubes that have piss weak outer walls.

you will be disapointed with tough dog suspension.

it is not a very comfortable ride in late model strut suspension hilux's.

okay than, so what coponent of the kit causes this? are you talking about the struts/shocks or what??
little bit more info would be nice....

LOCKEE wrote:Not many 07 Hilux's on sale in USA.

Good point. I was kind of hoping that Jack S had done his research and figured that FJ Cruiser gear or Tacoma gear might work.... might not though.

Steve.

Gwagensteve wrote:

LOCKEE wrote:Not many 07 Hilux's on sale in USA.

Good point. I was kind of hoping that Jack S had done his research and figured that FJ Cruiser gear or Tacoma gear might work.... might not though.

Steve.

Yes i have done my research and i am pretty bloody sure that the Tacoma gear does fit the hilux's......

dat383 wrote:you will be disapointed with tough dog suspension.

it is not a very comfortable ride in late model strut suspension hilux's.

Is there a specific coponent that makes the ride uncomfortable??

Well, there's going to be spring rate or shock valving. Unless you used OME springs, for instance, on Tough dog struts, or ran both struts on a dyno to prove the valving variations, it might be tough to work it out.

for my money, OME engineer their gear pretty well for the $$$.

Steve.

You will not be happy with tough dog.

LudaCris

ludacris wrote:You will not be happy with tough dog.

LudaCris

can i get some more info on why i wont be happy with tough dog??

Quite often there lift kits come up short in height. There shocks deteriorate too fast. They are just not a refined suspension product.

Cris

ludacris wrote:Quite often there lift kits come up short in height. There shocks deteriorate too fast. They are just not a refined suspension product.

Cris

talking about shocks ive actually been considering the blistien shocks, with the rest of the tough dog gear (coils and leafs)..

How does that sound??

Why so keen on tough dog?

Steve.

Nothin wrong with Tough Dog. I had Tough Dog shocks in my old GQ and they were fantastic. My brother now runs them in his 05 dual cab lux and it rides great.

Look at OME, Tough Dog and EFS, I think that all of them will suit your needs fine.

Gwagensteve wrote:Why so keen on tough dog?

Steve.

well ive just been told that tough dog is a pretty good brand and there are quite a few guys that advise it!

4bdan wrote:Nothin wrong with Tough Dog. I had Tough Dog shocks in my old GQ and they were fantastic. My brother now runs them in his 05 dual cab lux and it rides great.

Look at OME, Tough Dog and EFS, I think that all of them will suit your needs fine.

Yes ive looked at OME but been told they are over priced and tough dog are equally as good, ive been quoted a full tough dog kt at $1600 installed and everything. Ive also looked at EFS and was considering but there quote was $2000....

Gwagensteve wrote:Jack S,

Whilst there is some very good gear available in the US (at a price) have a look how well respected Australian gear is in the US market - OME is considered absolutely the bees knees in the states.

The fact is, we ask more of our vehicles than the average US user - we travel further on poor quality roads, load our vehicles more and generally tackle harder terrain with more standard vehicles than is common in the US.

Most US industry people are amazed at the terrain we drive and the vehicles we drive it with - it's common to build a heavily modified vehicle in the US to tackle terrain that many of us drive in our daily drivers.

You'll notice something about the US market too - it's "lift kit" dominated. In fact, OME pioneered the idea of a "suspension kit" in the US market - they're just not focussed on ride, handling or wheel travel - it's all about holding the height, which means higher spring rates and stiff shock valving to control them- It's all about the height.

You'll notice that there's never been a US suspension manufacturer that's ever done any good here - Rancho shocks were cool for a while, but since then we've wised up and realised they are a crap product with crap service here in Australia.

Seriously - You're in australia. We have the most mature off road accessory market int he world. I'd be happy to argue that the best value for money gear is here.

Steve.

Steve,
It's not often that I disagree with you - but in this case I definately do.
OME is well regarded (read promoted) in the US - but far from considered the "beesknees" and if you doubt be feel free to ask on any number of US based boards - starting with POR
I'm also pretty sure that your generalisations about usage in Aust v's USA couldn't be more wrong. We have just as many poser/soccer mums proportionally to the US.
OME definately did NOT pioneer the idea of a "kit" in the US. Plenty of brands were doing kits in the US long before ARB ever considered selling OME to the yanks.
Without commenting on Ranchos qualitys, I think proportionally one could say they still have a fair foothold in the market. But overall the reason American kits are not as popular here is because there aren't as many American vehicles here - and the "local" propaganda machine is so strong here.
As for claiming we have the most "mature" accessory market in the world - Again I couldn't disagree more strongly - if in doubt google SEMA
Best value for money? Nope that probably is products produced from China/India/Thailand and possibly wearing "local" badges

[/u]

Hey Jack. Sounds like you are after a mild lift. I personally would go to the local 4wd shops, have a talk to them and if prices are similar, buy an off the shelf kit from the shop that you feel has the best customer service. A Hilux is a common vehicle, not much point reinventing the wheel.

Asking questions on a forum, you will get a mixed bag of answers as no doubt you have already found. My advice is, do you own (local) research.

yes just after bit more lift to get some clearance because the new luxs are so low to the ground! I ve been looking at the 2" lifts which should bring mine up to about 4" due to it haveing stock suspension now and sagging! plus when i do lift i am hopeing to fit a 32" tyre which will bring it another 1".

Yes i have done many hours research and been on the phone to locals asking them questions and everything else, yet i just wanted to see what others on the forum thought about it from personal use...

My preference at the moment is a full tough dog kit, yet i might get some blistien struts/shocks instead, depending on price difference!

4" might be a bit hopeful. If it's an 07 model surely it hasn't sagged that much?

What kind of loads do you carry in it?

well its got a steel bull bar, steel tray and a steel tow bar, with 2 small steel tool boxes on either side of the tray.

I dont carry any weight on the back except for the odd occasion so generally its un-loaded.
Yet depending on what new job i am getting next year depends on what weight i may carry.
Currently on load!

Well looking at the newer model hilux's there all F'ing close to the ground for a 4wd, yet mine just seems bit lower than others.

Ive been told because i have the bull bar and tray this would of sagged it over time due to the stock suspension more than likely not haveing the right carrying weight.....

bogged wrote:

GRIMACE wrote:

bogged wrote:

GRIMACE wrote:the best way to get the right suspension is by trial and error.

There is no 'best or Better' brand that will guarantee the most orsumest results, as peoples suspension preferences are differing let alone the billions of variables applicapple to each individual car.

Trial and error is your best bet. It may be expensive but you learn a lot more and you get to make your own arseumptions.

Good luck with it.

my god dude... whats going on, did you REALLY manage to clean your female bits last night too?? your making sense out here..

i dont know whats goin on... i don't feel to well. Maybe I should go see a doctor.

3 rovers... that will do it to ya

make him feel unwell, yeah! but definitely doesnt explain why he is making sense.

Grimace at the Dr

Dr (deep voice) 'now when I cup your balls in my hand, cough.'

Grimace 'cough'

Dr 'MY GOD MAN, I SAID COUGH, NOT SPOOF '

Grimace (drops pants and bends over) 'can you take my temp now Doc, Im really coming down with something! Im posting tech on outers and no-one takes me seriously!'

come on guys keep on topic and keep chucking down info for the question!

not what happens when GRIMACE goes to the doctors lol...

Jack S wrote:well its got a steel bull bar, steel tray and a steel tow bar, with 2 small steel tool boxes on either side of the tray.

I dont carry any weight on the back except for the odd occasion so generally its un-loaded.
Yet depending on what new job i am getting next year depends on what weight i may carry.
Currently on load!

Well looking at the newer model hilux's there all F'ing close to the ground for a 4wd, yet mine just seems bit lower than others.

Ive been told because i have the bull bar and tray this would of sagged it over time due to the stock suspension more than likely not haveing the right carrying weight.....

I think the biggest problem your going to have is trying to find the right set-up that will carry heavy loads and still have reasonable flex for off-road.

You really need to be talking to a Suspension shop directly and they will be able to tailor a package that would suit your needs. (Which may consist of mixed brands, etc)

80's_delirious wrote: Dr (deep voice) 'now when I cup your balls in my hand, cough.'

Grimace 'cough'

Dr 'MY GOD MAN, I SAID COUGH, NOT SPOOF '

Grimace (drops pants and bends over) 'can you take my temp now Doc, Im really coming down with something! Im posting tech on outers and no-one takes me seriously!'

I go in for regular prostate exams. They are fun, and every now and then I get a second, third or fourth opinion.