Outer Limits 4x4 Board

Ray185 is a stickler for "detail" or "politically correctness" or just wants to get it "right" or "accurate".

I use inverted commas in the hope that he doesn't pick on me now for not saying it correctly. We all agree with you though Ray, just an observation on this and other threads today.

richardsc wrote:ill email u some pics ray,not sure how to put em up here

Start a photobucket account, upload the pics there. Then copy and paste the image code into your post.



Layto....

Suspension Stuff wrote:Ray185 is a stickler for "detail" or "politically correctness" or just wants to get it "right" or "accurate".

I use inverted commas in the hope that he doesn't pick on me now for not saying it correctly. We all agree with you though Ray, just an observation on this and other threads today.

LOL, yes you're right, but mostly (other threads you may have read today apart from this one) they are in jest.

In this case I just think some of the comments people make about mechanics are a little over the top and undeserved. Again, just my opinion. I got the pics and as I had figured, the springs are way too short eye to eye and one is inverting all on its own on full droop and the other is very close to it. Not something a mechanic could cause but certainly something a mechanic should have noticed, on a test drive at least. My point was - careless, yes. Shonky, not in my opinion. If that makes me a stickler then guilty as charged. You're in the game just as I am and I'm sure you've experienced a customer holding you responsible for something beyond your control.

I'll post the pics if the OP wants me to.

I agree on all accounts and a lot like you in how I think about it.

The 60 Series is often a problem vehicle. I have often come accross this problem.

RAY185 wrote: In this case I just think some of the comments people make about mechanics are a little over the top and undeserved. Again, just my opinion. I got the pics and as I had figured, the springs are way too short eye to eye and one is inverting all on its own on full droop and the other is very close to it. Not something a mechanic could cause but certainly something a mechanic should have noticed, on a test drive at least. My point was - careless, yes. Shonky, not in my opinion. If that makes me a stickler then guilty as charged. You're in the game just as I am and I'm sure you've experienced a customer holding you responsible for something beyond your control.

I'll post the pics if the OP wants me to.

Careless and shonky are pretty damn close descriptions when it comes to performing mechanical work.

shakes wrote:Careless and shonky are pretty damn close descriptions when it comes to performing mechanical work.

Opinion noted.

thanks ray,and yep,feel free to post the pics

Static Height:



Inverted - Static Height as it was picked up:



Drivers Side Full Droop:



Passenger Side Full Droop:

I read that bricks have a tendancy to crumble. Just in case everyone was full of it, I tested it out myself and yes they do crumble.

Don't mean to go around in circles, well maybe I do.

But I appreciate that there are some good trustworthy mechanics out there, so don't wish to tar everyone with the same brush.

Still think not setting the clutch pedal play is wrong though.


BTW, I am no expert on leafs, but those ones look rooted.

What leafs are they? Stock? Looks like they have wayyy to much arch and are also super short!

yep id say stockers ,pretty sure old owner said they were reset,does sit a tad higher than other 60,s it has parked next to in the past,but wouldnt say its overly lifted,my hj 60 was higher,but thats on an ome 2 inch lift so understandandable,ill swap that gear over when i find the time,one of its front springs is stuffed so ill need new fronts anyways

when they reset old springs too high they get shorter eye - eye.

Lifting it up with the hoist taking all the weight off it then coming back down allowed the shackle to go too far over center and it rolled up against the chassis.

No biggie, jack it up and force it back. Drive around till it settles or get another set.

As for your clutch, im not surprised. Im afraid most mechanics think when you change a clutch thats it, its fixed... But its far from it. Every clutch's slightly different so free play should always be adjusted.

A Hydraulic clutch should not need adjusting unless the owner has tried to adjust it themselves to try and get a bit more life out of it. They were designed as a set and forget thing at the factory and should only need adjusting if the hydraulics are replaced.

mutilated wrote:A Hydraulic clutch should not need adjusting unless the owner has tried to adjust it themselves to try and get a bit more life out of it. They were designed as a set and forget thing at the factory and should only need adjusting if the hydraulics are replaced.

Or if the piston is allowed to come out of the slave cylinder when it is disconnected to allow removal of the transmission.

If your stupid enough to let the piston fall out, it still wont affect the adjustment of the clutch in any way. If you adjust the pushrod on the pedal it will and some have adjustable pushrods on the slave but you shouldn't need to touch them.

if its not bled correctly, the travel to full release will increase...

No no no, I mean if you let the piston fall out the clutch may still operate just, even without a bleed, or with a bad bleed, but pedal height will be all wrong.

If a vehicle goes into a mechanics shop to get a clutch done it is not the mechanics job to check over the whole vehicle or to "check " the shackles have not inverted!
If a customer expects a mechanic to do safety check they need to advise the workshop that is what they would like, obviously if a mechanic was to note a problem it is their duty of care to notify the customer of the safety issue and then follow up with a recommended coarse of action.

I am not sticking up for anyone here but there must be common sense used and some post here are rubbish.

You must ask yourself could it be too much set in the springs , yes, the reason being because you have not had it off road so driving it on the road is not going to invert the springs unless you were to lift the weight of the vehicle like on a hoist, maybe the mechanic did hit a obstacle or maybe even drove over a gutter ??
Maybe you have heavy rated springs without your accessorys fitted anymore and they are not holding to much set, their are many factors here that few bothered to ask without assuming a mechanic is in the wrong.

I recommend always talking to the workshop first before getting opinions from forums, forums are great and have endless knowledge but you can be misled on information as well.

Some off the shelf spring like 40 series "" brand""" are ready to invert straight from the distributor! they are a shit design but the so called experts wont listen that the mains and wraps need to be longer.

As far as lifting a vehicle from the chassis , if that was innapropriate maybe they should stop selling 2 post hoists

Like i said i am not on anyones side and i dont have a clue who the mechanic is or the customer is just giving my opinion because i am in the industry.
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I don't think there is anything wrong with lifting the vehicle by the chassis, also if it caused the inversion that's not the mech's fault.

If he didn't even realise that it may have been caused by the lift, that's good too, why should he expect that.

But a clutch pedal that does not begin to take up pressure on the clutch until almost on the floor is not something any mechanic should simply ignore.


So I guess the OP needs to tell us if the clutch pedal operated sooner befor the clutch swap.

I guess my position is a bit like if the mech accidently knocked over a drink the owner left inside the vehicle, it is not the mechs fault the owner left the drink in a silly spot, but I feel the mech should do his best to clean it up.
Same as the springs being to short .. the mech is not at fault for the spring being to short, bu the mech dropped the truck and inverted a leaf .. least he could do would be jack it up (ie what 4 maybe 5 seconds with a hoist) and pry the shackle back where it should be another 60 seconds to grab a pry bar and another 20 perhaps to lower it back to the ground slowly .. Not a real big imposition in my opinion especially for a professional workshop that should have picked up on the whacky handleing during the test drive of a vehicle after fitting the clutch ...

Some people dont know much about hydraulics do they!