Outer Limits 4x4 Board

KING OTH I would go as far as 3hrs or more for good track`s

Thanks for all the feed back, Just an Idea at this stage as looking into land and Insurances, I don't think council approval is going to be such a big Issue and I think I can get help from government to actually open one, I will look into further now that I know ppl would be keen to use and pay for something like this, There are no Parks that I am aware of close to sydney and the few that are in NSW do not cater for the hardcore 4wd's.

thanks

Byron

Bazz107 wrote:... and the few that are in NSW do not cater for the hardcore 4wd's

If your only going to cater for hard core 4wds your business venture will fail... 95% of 4wds would be more interested in just getting offroad with a few basic challenging tracks.

Samuel wrote:Well what else do you do apart from sit your fat ass in front of a computer 24/7?.

I go 4bing, camping, fishing, do photography for people,

If you actually did anything else, I could give you sh*t about it

you need to learn to finish sentences...or at least learn to make sense....

Heres a fence for you to run down while your thinking.
http://jja.image.pbase.com/u/gtaylor57/ ... .Fence.jpg

I mean to cater for everybody, The first time offroader to the hardcore drivers, providing Facilitaes, and several camping grounds, some with noise restrictions and so on, others without, so that I can provid for the party ppl and the quite family.

Bazz107 wrote:I mean to cater for everybody, The first time offroader to the hardcore drivers, providing Facilitaes, and several camping grounds, some with noise restrictions and so on, others without, so that I can provid for the party ppl and the quite family.

You will do well then..

Also offer to clubs for driver training, that gets people in the place to see how good it is.. then return business.

What size land you lookin at and where abouts?

I don't think council approval is going to be such a big Issue

Think again.... Give em a ring and inform them of the idea.

Its bullsh1t like "What are the long term effects from the increased traffic", and "Can the existing roads utilise this traffic"..

I am not bagging the idea, I am trying to do a similar project myself, it pays to do some reserch and you will find that council are the issue.

Insurance is easy, not cheap but easy.

Bazz107 wrote:I mean to cater for everybody, The first time offroader to the hardcore drivers, providing Facilitaes, .

To be really successful you need to run training by pro/comp/qualified instructor for new/young 4x4 owners, and strike a deal with an insurance company that will give a better deal on premiums if they have complerted the course "making the roads safer for ALL road users" etc etc - can i have job in your marketing dept?

Too far to go...I live in Brisbane and can go to LCMP, Manar, Levuka, Black Duck Valley, or even Rover Park!!!!

Begbie wrote:

Bazz107 wrote:I mean to cater for everybody, The first time offroader to the hardcore drivers, providing Facilitaes, .

To be really successful you need to run training by pro/comp/qualified instructor for new/young 4x4 owners, and strike a deal with an insurance company that will give a better deal on premiums if they have complerted the course "making the roads safer for ALL road users" etc etc - can i have job in your marketing dept?

To make this compulsory would lose customers. Who wants to pay for courses when many clubs run them for free (like the one I am in). By all means offer the training for those who want it (and I know a few who need it ) but instead of making it a condition of entry, how about a condition of access to certain areas? Or you could offer discount for those who have completed training with either a club or other organisation/busienss.

Bazz107 wrote:the few that are in NSW do not cater for the hardcore 4wd's.

thanks

Byron

wot about rover park ??? its in NSW not QLD like POS said

hypolux wrote:

Bazz107 wrote:the few that are in NSW do not cater for the hardcore 4wd's.

thanks

Byron

wot about rover park ??? its in NSW not QLD like POS said

He said he can go there. Not that is actually in Qld. Much closer to Brissy than Sydney.

hypolux wrote:

Bazz107 wrote:the few that are in NSW do not cater for the hardcore 4wd's.

thanks

Byron

wot about rover park ??? its in NSW not QLD like POS said

so is Levuka and Emu Creek but much closer to Brisbane. they are all a crappy length drive from sydney.

dumbdunce wrote:so is Levuka and Emu Creek but much closer to Brisbane. they are all a crappy length drive from sydney.

From memory Emu Creek was 3 hours from Bris and Levuka a bit closer.
So I would imagine they are a fair bit closer to Brisbane.

Utemad wrote:

dumbdunce wrote:so is Levuka and Emu Creek but much closer to Brisbane. they are all a crappy length drive from sydney.

From memory Emu Creek was 3 hours from Bris and Levuka a bit closer.
So I would imagine they are a fair bit closer to Brisbane.

when I drove to Levuka early this year it took about 7 hours of road time and 3 hours of snooze time. too long to just shrug off but too short to invest a whole day in as part of the trip. and I was pretty disappointed when all they have there is mud, mud and more mud...

dumbdunce wrote:

Utemad wrote:

dumbdunce wrote:so is Levuka and Emu Creek but much closer to Brisbane. they are all a crappy length drive from sydney.

From memory Emu Creek was 3 hours from Bris and Levuka a bit closer.
So I would imagine they are a fair bit closer to Brisbane.

when I drove to Levuka early this year it took about 7 hours of road time and 3 hours of snooze time. too long to just shrug off but too short to invest a whole day in as part of the trip. and I was pretty disappointed when all they have there is mud, mud and more mud...

I haven't been to either of those parks but have been in the area visiting friends. A friend of mine took his Sierra to Levuka though and said it was mud, mud, mud. However that is what he likes so he was happy.

Utemad wrote:

dumbdunce wrote:

Utemad wrote:

dumbdunce wrote:so is Levuka and Emu Creek but much closer to Brisbane. they are all a crappy length drive from sydney.

From memory Emu Creek was 3 hours from Bris and Levuka a bit closer.
So I would imagine they are a fair bit closer to Brisbane.

when I drove to Levuka early this year it took about 7 hours of road time and 3 hours of snooze time. too long to just shrug off but too short to invest a whole day in as part of the trip. and I was pretty disappointed when all they have there is mud, mud and more mud...

I haven't been to either of those parks but have been in the area visiting friends. A friend of mine took his Sierra to Levuka though and said it was mud, mud, mud. However that is what he likes so he was happy.

yeah it is all mud but some of the trails are a bit of fun. the camping is spectacular but there's not much else to do.

bogged
Posted: Wed Oct 27, 2004 1:38 pm

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Grantw wrote:
Maybe $1M could be a good start. Even harder if you are borrowing the mula.
I was thinking that too... it wouldnt want to be a short term business plan, EG you wouldnt want to be seeing any profit for a few yrs!

I think you could easily double that for a decent sized park close (2-3hrs) to sydney. You would need a minimum of 300+ acres but 600-700 acres is more realistic. And the further you go from Sydney the bigger and more variety you need to make it worthwhile for people to travel there.

Move to victoria....

I have tracks within 30mins of my home and am around 45mins from the city centre......

If 4x4ing is your main hobby, why not move to a state that has it all

Im sure if you were mad into fishing you wouldnt live in the middle of the desert

berazafi wrote:Move to victoria....

I have tracks within 30mins of my home and am around 45mins from the city centre......

If 4x4ing is your main hobby, why not move to a state that has it all

Im sure if you were mad into fishing you wouldnt live in the middle of the desert

got any good Victorian rockcrawling pics?

possibly, plenty of land up near newcastle hint hint

DIRTY ROCK STAR wrote:possibly, plenty of land up near newcastle hint hint

also expensive.. you want to go where land is worth NOTHING

bogged wrote:

DIRTY ROCK STAR wrote:possibly, plenty of land up near newcastle hint hint

also expensive.. you want to go where land is worth NOTHING

like Melbourne?

dumbdunce wrote:like Melbourne?

which is great! Only a fool would pay top $ when they dont have to.

melbourne is a shithole, mud is what you put on your dick to have homosexual sex so i've heard

Utemad wrote:

dumbdunce wrote:so is Levuka and Emu Creek but much closer to Brisbane. they are all a crappy length drive from sydney.

From memory Emu Creek was 3 hours from Bris and Levuka a bit closer.
So I would imagine they are a fair bit closer to Brisbane.

So there is the problem in a nutshell. Who has the time and money to travel 7 to 10 hours for a day of wheeling. It is like telling the Brissy guys "why don't you just go to Cains each weekend to for a day of wheeling"? Or "your lucky, Cape York is in QLD so you get to do it at least once a month".

To attract people from sydney on a regular basis, draw a radius from Sydney up to Stockton and out to Goulburn and that is about it. It is hard enough trying to get club members go the Canberra (Brindabella) for the weekend where the tracks are free.

What makes the QLD 4x4 parks work (money wise), is that they are all working farms first and 4x4 parks second (although this is changing a bit now some of the 4x4 parks are taking off). Setting up a 4x4 park was just a way for a farmer to make a bit of extra money on the side, and a use for their really hilly/rocky sections of the property that were crap for cattle anyway. To purchase enough land for a decent 4x4 park and then try and recoup costs would be a bit of a gamble. Especially when some of the parks in QLD are paying half their income in insurance fees.

It would be much better to find a farmer with a big property (and lots of suitable terrain) and come to a suitable arrangement to start a 4x4 park - which takes away most of the initial capital cost.

Oh and for those interested in trivia - the oldest 4wd park (on the east coast anyway) is Brooklyn - in NSW (near Levuka), which is 25-30 years old.

And all QLDers should still use the State Forest tracks as well as the 4x4 parks. There are a lot of good tracks out there around QLD (and many closer to Brisbane than the 4x4 parks), and we need to keep them open - so keep sending in permit to traverse forms every year!!!

good Idea Isuzurover, have not thought of asking famers, Know a few so will look into, Finding suitable land large enough is a large problem, Some of the best land is up to 4 hours from liverpool, done near the Brideglla ranges, But still looking at doing something much close like I said about 1.5 - 2 hours. Other land i can get is about 3 hours from windsor on the other side of Singleton, which is also too far to go, Land down the putty is one Idea i had but that land is expensive and hard to get in larger lots, Most blocks that are for sale seem to be under 100 acres no much good for Us, So the search for land continues...

you need an area out of the way of the main area to put the family camping in so that night drives don't bother them. this area should be the nice grassy area beside the creek under shady trees with plenty of toilets and showers and a noise and night drive limit.

If there is an old building around then use this area for another camp site and put in wood fired hand built boilers for the rustic showers block and make up some rustic looking dunnys.

motorbikes make lots of money but should be completely seperate area.

you need easy tracks to all areas then harder tracks branching off.
you need hard to impossible tracks to keep people coming back otherwise once you have done the hardest tracks you don't bother going back.
pricing has to be reasonable and charged per car not per person and per 24 hours or part thereof or clubs will not go there [as a few properties have found]
eg: one place i went to ONCE charged me for 3 days because i arrived there on the friday night at 11.30 pm and left sunday morning at about 9.00 am but that meant i had three dates on the form

There was some land ready setup for sale in the trading post a couple of weeks ago at Turnkey a few weeks ago money the problem I think it was 475 thou. There is still a lot of crown land along the Abercrombie if you look at the State Forest map perhaps you could try a lease some. There have been parks along the Turon and Abercrombie but they mainly went for the fishing and camping market, less problems I suppose.
Regards Charlie