Outer Limits 4x4 Board

i myself is in the market for a fringe, my girlfriend and me spent last saturday looking at them, i personally am going with the engel, my dad has his 4 21 years , never once had a drama, the waeco is very light duty you get what you pay 4 in this case.

[quote="adamant"]i myself is in the market for a fringe,

good luck mate i hope you get the hair cut you want

I know i should probly say this as of thread a little but hear go's.
Both the above are great products...........

EVA KOOL fridge freezers are also a good choice- and yes they have donated money to our group shirts recently but whether they had or not i would still be writing this.. i will only support and look for support from reputable companies with good products or services.

I have personal experience with girlefriends 60l and have ordered one for myself just recently.........

The good being a fridge freezer that is an icebox aswell meaning fridge doesnt have to work as hard! or simply a dual purpose setup
Danfoss moter seems to be very reliable.

All mymates eskies and fridge freezers have been bought as second factory direct and with a bit of sweet talking and some cash a good arrangement is always met......

strong and durable and no dramas to date....

thats my 5c worth
Bingham

Bingham wrote:Danfoss moter seems to be very reliable.


thats my 5c worth
Bingham

Danfoss make some of the best refrigeration components on the market! I've yet to find a better refrigeration compressor!

most 12v fridges use the danfoss compressor. The engel uses its own design swing motor compressor. Both are very good compressors. But the danfoss draws a lot of current. The engel is unique, all the others are the same, just slightly different

Have owned both EvaKool and Waeco units. Found both to be very unreliable. Warranty back up on Evakool is very good and it was repaired free of charge on all 6 occasions. Have a three year old and a 23 year old Engel as well. Don't waste your money buy the best if you are concerned about reliability......buy an Engel.

well i own a waeco and have done for some time (50l) and it has been very good just make sure you buy the one with the danfos moter not the cheap made in china one because danfos moters are in both waeco and engle fridges but all it will come down to is price .

Mytqik wrote:Go & talk to to a coldroom manufacturer. My mate had one custom made, about 80L for under 1k. The best part it was manufactured from 100mm coldroom insulation, so it doubles as an esky. The compressor doesn't work that hard as the insulation does a great job. The only downside is the weight of the thing, but his is permantly mounted to the tray of his 75.

The compressor was a marine one, designed for built-in fridge/freezers in luxury yachts. It is 12VDC / 240VAC, & has been put through years of abuse out hunting & camping.

Has anyone else had a fridge/freezer custom built? How does/did it go and what was the price like?

danfos moters are in both waeco and engle fridges but all it will come down to is price .

Danfoss compressors are NOT in engel fridges!!! They are in most other 12 volt fridges though, but not engels.

Has anyone else had a fridge/freezer custom built? How does/did it go and what was the price like?

I made my own. I used a Danfoss compressor. Unless you need something custom made your better off buying an engel. If you want to go down the custom made path my suggestion is to buy a secondhand engel and then get a custom made box (3 inch polyurethane insulation) and swap over the workings from the engel cabinet to the new cabinet. The size of the insulation in the engels is the only drawback. But low amp draw, reliability and durability is unmatched.

Had a 45l waeco for the last 4 years goes on camping trips and hard wheeling days and never missed a beat.

waeco=plastic crap
engel = super tough
my engel is 20 years old and has been to hell and back numerous times, it even fell off the back of my tray at 60kph once, it runs in all weather conditions and has sat out in pouring rain numerous times, it now looks pretty rough but still works like a new one, i wouldnt even consider buying anything else

hi-luxmadness wrote:waeco=plastic crap
engel = super tough
my engel is 20 years old and has been to hell and back numerous times, it even fell off the back of my tray at 60kph once, it runs in all weather conditions and has sat out in pouring rain numerous times, it now looks pretty rough but still works like a new one, i wouldnt even consider buying anything else

based on what just because you have an Engel doesn't mean the Waeco is plastic crap.

I have had a Waeco for a few years and has performed flawlessly. prior to that I used my parents Engel it also performed flawlessly. The only difference I gathered between the two was that the Waeco was substantially cheaper. I suppose if I was to carry a fridge in the back of a ute exposed to the elements more I would go for the Engel but then i wouldn't want to expose either to the elements much anyway

based on steel is stronger than plastic? i would of thought that was obvious, mine does ride out in the elements and has copped some hard knocks, i dont think a plastic waeco would still be in one piece, by the way im an appliance tech, who opperates a business that repairs fridges and other whitegoods, i reckon the engel compressor/ motor is a superior design, less moving parts= better reliability

just because it is plastic doesn't make it crap. Alot of times a plastic case will actually better handle blunt force from getting knocked around than a steel case and vice versa.

As to your other point that's interestimg as you hear all these statements that they use the same compressors etc

Engel all the way for my preference in the Mav. This decision was based on the track record of the Engel, going right back to the 'A' Series fridge. The Waeco just doesn't have the years behind it to back up its reliability. Both have their merits - steel versus plastic case etc - however with these and other differences in mind, it makes it easier to make a decision based on the two, depending on your individual requirement criteria.

Although I'm thinking of a Waeco for the lux tray, due to size of the model fridge - 26L. It will be under a canopy out of the UV and direct dust.

ummmmmmm MINES BETTER THAN YOURS

This seems to be the theme. The same as any x vs y argument

Looks like Engel's the preferred one though.

There's a couple of Aussie made ones in the 4wd monthly. Gonna have to check these out too. One of them seems to be on the same theme as what Tojo built himself.

up2nogood wrote:Looks like Engel's the preferred one though.

There's a couple of Aussie made ones in the 4wd monthly. Gonna have to check these out too. One of them seems to be on the same theme as what Tojo built himself.

I have an engel, but wanted a larger unit (planning some long trips) and something to cope better with higher average temps and humidity.

I looked around and decided on the trailblaza made by norcoast refrig in Caloundra Qld.

Advantages as I see it:

Extra thick insulation reduces compressor running time.
2mm aluminium construction of inner and outer shell is very strong.
Bottom and 4 sides of the aluminium inner shell is used for the evaporator.
4 sides of the aluminium shell is used for the condensor.
Can be used as a freezer, fridge or both.

Disadvantages:

The thick insulation (125mm on mine) makes the overall size larger and increases the weight.
Danfoss compressor draws more current than engel when starting/running.

i have a waceo 50ltr and had it for about 4yrs and never had a problem with it.

DR Frankenstine wrote:I sell both and allways recommend engel over waeco.
The engel has the swing motor which has no real moving parts and take hardly any power to start up. The waeco has a piston compressor and takes a lot of power to start up and uses way more on regular running esspesially during cycling on and off

kewl.....guess whose looking for one

shoot up some prices dudes !

looking for around a 30 - 40 lit job

Kingy

I've got a anniversary model 40ltr, s/s finish with the built in thermometer and updated latch.
Works a treat and the power consumption is very low
One good thing is the built in 240 Volt converter so it's handy when having a BBQ under the pergola

I went shopping just after christmas and picked up a 40L Engel Anniversary with the bag for $1000 even. Campmart had to get rid of their 'old stock' before all the 'new' supercheap auto stuff arrived. All i can say about the price is HOLY SHIT

BTW, has anyone had any issues with their Engels getting slightly wet from rain etc? Just wondering in case i get caught out when camping...

I took a look yesterday at the Waceo & Engel range at the local dealers and came away very much better informed...... I also brought home a fridge unit and a cooler in the same sizes/capacity for "testing"....the local dealer is keen to sell me something hey !

There are "fridges" and there are "coolers"

The fridges will take the contents down to what a normal fridge can do and the coolers work on a temp drop of 10, 20, 30degrees below than ambient temp outside, depending on which model one buys.

The Weaco cooler that impressed me ( I forget the model # ) held 30 cans and operates at 30degrees below the ambient temp, it comes with a 240V adaptor in the price of $329 !!!
Most of the other units required the additional cost of a 240V adaptor ( $50 and up in price !! )
So basically this thing will "cool" 30 cans to 10degrees on a 40degree day...that's good enough for what I want.

It also has the ability to "warm" and warms to 30 degrees above the ambient temp...... so 40degree pies on a cold winters day ( usually 8degrees down here ! ) when wheelin out in the heart of the Otways sounds very inviting to me....as for cold drinks then well it will be coffee for me but the cans wont be much warmer than 10 degrees any way if left sitting in an ordinary "esky" anyway.
The fridges wont warm at all.



I don't think that the argument of steel V's plastic really comes into it unless there are issues as to the actual storage location in/on the vehicle. in either case a secure mounting would be desired for both placements whether is on a tray or inside the rig.
After all I wouldn't want either unit wandering around the inside of the rig during a flop for example !
I also don't think it would be wise to have either unit sliding around a tray while driving a bloody rough section...common sense says it should be securely restrained.

The other side of the coin is weight, the weaco is slightly lighter being of a plastic construction over the steel Engel, weight is a consideration for me as is that location of that weight within the vehicle....every kilo matters. If steel is so good then why are we seeing more n more plastic" bumperbars, it wont be long and 4x4s will be fitted with plastic bullbars as std.

Current draw between the two makes was similar from what I saw yesterday with the only major difference being in the coolers which drew slightly more, the reason being that they don't switch on & off to maintain the desired temp as the fridges do...the coolers run non-stop yet they still had what I consider a low draw rating....... time for a test to see which one flattened the battery the quickest.....
I took the 2 deep cycle batteries out of my patrol and hooked up a unit to each battery and switched em on, both units had a BBQ tray of meat,couple of apples, 6 cans of coke, and a small carton of milk placed inside for my "test".
So this morning I wandered over to the shed to see how things were going...... heres the results...

The "cooler" was happily running and the contents were at -1 degree
The fridge had cut out, but the thing restarted as soon as I opened the lid to do the temp check. Inside the goodies were at 2degrees.

Ok so there's little difference there and it was rather a cool night here ( around the 15 degree mark )....time to test the batteries....

Down to the local Truck mechanics joint with the batteries for the ultimate draw test.....
Now I'm not interested in how many volts /amps/ or what ever are left in either battery , I want to know will they crank a V8 over and start it without any real problems...simple and straight up question hey.

The batteries were connected up and the man did his current draw test to the point where both batteries wouldn't turn over a brush cutter !...they were flattened completely.
The result was that the battery running the cooler was down further than the one connected to the fridge but would have had enough grunt to crank a V8 for 4 mins non-stop and at the cranking speed required to start the V8. The fridge battery held on for a further 1min & 30 seconds till it too dropped away in its cranking capacity for a V8.

I recon there is SFA difference in which drew the most from the batteries overnight ...perhaps the real difference may show up after a 48 hour period but that's well beyond what I would normally leave it connected for without an engine restart.
Again My circumstances of use will be different to most other users...my batteries are ALWAYS of the "deep cycle" variety and I run duel batteries in my rigs. Even the statey and the commodore run deep cycle batteries although they only run a single battery instead of the duel setup.

Realistically it comes down to the intended use and the frequency of that use as to which unit you purchase, for me it will be a "cooler", largely because I live in a cooler region and icy cold drinks aren't needed during winter but the ability to warm food is a huge plus for me.
Should I live in the hotter states like NT then I would be buying a fridge without hesitation simply because it can deliver a colder level with a slightly less battery draw over the "cooler" type.

Hope this helps those that are still a little confused.

Kingy

Kingy, I think your scientific testing procedure is fundamentally floored simply because you didn't use a "control" there are no graphs, histograms or any other collated data that can be cross referenced.

Just joking dude - very imformative

V8Patrol wrote:So basically this thing will "cool" 30 cans to 10degrees on a 40degree day...that's good enough for what I want.

It also has the ability to "warm" and warms to 30 degrees above the ambient temp...... so 40degree pies on a cold winters day ( usually 8degrees down here ! )

Remember, according to HACCP regulations (food safety authority) cold food (meat, dairy etc) must be kept stored at least at 4 degrees and once above this it must be consumed/used within 2 hrs (after this bacteria growth becomes rapid).

....and hot food must be kept at least 60 degrees hot to prevent bacteria growth etc. At my shops we run our 'warm storage units' at 72 degrees and any/much lower than that the council will shut us down. Same rule applies, product must be used by 2 hrs once removed from warm storage.

V8Patrol wrote:
perhaps the real difference may show up after a 48 hour period but that's well beyond what I would normally leave it connected for without an engine restart.

I havn't used the engel in my car yet but we had it connected up to my mate's 60 series diesel all weekend on our last trip a fortnight ago without dual batteries. The car was left all night friday, then started about lunchtime saturday for a 2-3 hr drive then left all night saturday night and then started and driven for about 45 mins on sunday afternoon then left all night sunday. When we went to leave on monday after lunch, it wouldn't start and i had to jump start him.

The gap from saturday afternoon until monday afternoon with only a 45 min drive in-between on sunday was too much for the battery.

Does anyone else run their engel successfully with just a normal single battery in their car?

Jeeps wrote:Remember, according to HACCP regulations (food safety authority) cold food (meat, dairy etc) must be kept stored at least at 4 degrees and once above this it must be consumed/used within 2 hrs (after this bacteria growth becomes rapid).

....and hot food must be kept at least 60 degrees hot to prevent bacteria growth etc. At my shops we run our 'warm storage units' at 72 degrees and any/much lower than that the council will shut us down. Same rule applies, product must be used by 2 hrs once removed from warm storage.

If I were SELLING food from it then you would be 100% correct.......
I'd also have to use tongs and rubber gloves or hand gel ...... and be certified & registered by the local authority in FSH.....
FSA and the HACCP regs are PITA and do SFA for the Dairy side of things, that is controled here in Vic by the DFSV which also have a great reputation within the dairying industry as doing SFA except collecting fees.

Oh why did I waste so much time doing Food Safety courses ????
Because imigrants didnt know how to use a fridge....thats why

jeeps wrote:I havn't used the engel in my car yet but we had it connected up to my mate's 60 series diesel all weekend on our last trip a fortnight ago without dual batteries. The car was left all night friday, then started about lunchtime saturday for a 2-3 hr drive then left all night saturday night and then started and driven for about 45 mins on sunday afternoon then left all night sunday. When we went to leave on monday after lunch, it wouldn't start and i had to jump start him.

The gap from saturday afternoon until monday afternoon with only a 45 min drive in-between on sunday was too much for the battery.

Does anyone else run their engel successfully with just a normal single battery in their car?

From my little "test" I belive that a day and a half would be the MAXIMUM that I would leave either unit connected for without a good recharge of the battery, again things vary from vehicle to vehicle setup and my rig with its 2 deep cycle batteries and 85amp Alt reached full charge again after the test in around 30 mins of driving, and it was sufficient to jump start the 24Volt diesel patrol which had been flattened the night before ( left the parkers on ).
My commodore and statey both run deep cycle batteries and both have big Alts but I seriously doubt that a startup would happen if the unit was left conected for more than the day and a half.... a full 24 hour period would however be sweet.

Kingy

Bitsamissin wrote:Kingy, I think your scientific testing procedure is fundamentally floored simply because you didn't use a "control" there are no graphs, histograms or any other collated data that can be cross referenced.

Just joking dude - very imformative

i have a waceo CF 50 and i leave it going most of the time. i have left the 4x4 for 4 days before and it was still going i have a good deep cycle (gel type)battery for the 2nd battery on the dual system

OK, having decided on an Engel, the question is which one?

The 37L stainless steel one $1000

OR

The 40L anniversary one $1100

Is there any difference in performance?

Make sure you get the bag if you are going to have any camping gear leaning against it in the back of the car. The 40l anniversary got a nice big 'wear' mark from where a cardboard box rubbed against it on the 2hr bitumen drive to noosa on it's first camping trip...

V8Patrol wrote:

Jeeps wrote:Remember, according to HACCP regulations (food safety authority) cold food (meat, dairy etc) must be kept stored at least at 4 degrees and once above this it must be consumed/used within 2 hrs (after this bacteria growth becomes rapid).

....and hot food must be kept at least 60 degrees hot to prevent bacteria growth etc. At my shops we run our 'warm storage units' at 72 degrees and any/much lower than that the council will shut us down. Same rule applies, product must be used by 2 hrs once removed from warm storage.

If I were SELLING food from it then you would be 100% correct.......
I'd also have to use tongs and rubber gloves or hand gel ...... and be certified & registered by the local authority in FSH.....
FSA and the HACCP regs are PITA and do SFA for the Dairy side of things, that is controled here in Vic by the DFSV which also have a great reputation within the dairying industry as doing SFA except collecting fees.

Oh why did I waste so much time doing Food Safety courses ????
Because imigrants didnt know how to use a fridge....thats why

Things do vary from food place to food place but they (council, dpi, head office ) only state to us is that we need to wash our hands. Even though we handle A LOT of meats (beef, ham, bacon, seafoods etc) we are not required to use gloves, hand gels or tongs. But we do use them anyways, it's good practice.

Anyway, the main point i was getting at is that i wouldn't want to leave any meats in a 'cooler' all day long if i wasn't garanteed of the temperature. The same applies for hot food. If the temp went up and down, up and down all day by 10 degrees or more the food would be really unsafe. If the meat was vacuum sealed it'd last longer but if all you're gonna use it for is a 'few hours' day trip then it'd be perfect.

Checkout this puppy i picked up at an auction late last year:



That's right! My very own portable coldroom for camping! Well, nah, i got it mostly for when i lose power or have coldroom failure at one of my stores but i have only used it at home all summer out the back of the house to keep the beer cold and we used it for the usual christmas parties and my GF's 21's a fortnight ago. Holds from 10 degrees down to -30 degrees all day. Tows real nice too!

I wanna put a window in there so i can sit in there next summer with my beer and look out at the world.