Outer Limits 4x4 Board

Mytqik wrote:don't forget that wind up will only occur when the front & rear wheels rotate at different speeds. Ie travelling around corners etc. If all four wheels are travelling staight on a hard surface, wind up will not occur.

For a straight line reverse up a driveway (while I agree there is a risk, all be it very small), I don't beleive that it would cause any damage.

I agree totally, its just not worth warning people off doing it thats all

mkpatrol wrote:

Mytqik wrote:don't forget that wind up will only occur when the front & rear wheels rotate at different speeds. Ie travelling around corners etc. If all four wheels are travelling staight on a hard surface, wind up will not occur.

For a straight line reverse up a driveway (while I agree there is a risk, all be it very small), I don't beleive that it would cause any damage.

I agree totally, its just not worth warning people off doing it thats all

I am not saying you haveto warn warn people off doeing it, rahter let people know the possible consequences from doing this. remeber when reversing a trailer there could be a number of very sttep turns

IIRC the MQ/MK front axles do not have an unlockable hub in them, meaning as soon as it is put in 4H or 4L you have 4WD wheher you like it or not. The only connection that determines 4WD is the output of the tcase to diff, the hubs are always locked.

Correct me if I am wrong....

GaryInOz wrote:IIRC the MQ/MK front axles do not have an unlockable hub in them, meaning as soon as it is put in 4H or 4L you have 4WD wheher you like it or not. The only connection that determines 4WD is the output of the tcase to diff, the hubs are always locked.

Correct me if I am wrong....

I can't speak for every MQ/K, but the couple of dozen I have seen all had locking hubs.

GaryInOz wrote:IIRC the MQ/MK front axles do not have an unlockable hub in them, meaning as soon as it is put in 4H or 4L you have 4WD wheher you like it or not. The only connection that determines 4WD is the output of the tcase to diff, the hubs are always locked.

Correct me if I am wrong....

I dont know about the IIRC but the MQ/K had three options, no free wheeling hubs (rare), Manual hubs & automatic hubs, most people replaced the auto hubs as they were pretty unreliable & would drop out at the most unopportune moments . Most auto hubs in the 80's were crap.

mkpatrol wrote:

GaryInOz wrote:IIRC the MQ/MK front axles do not have an unlockable hub in them, meaning as soon as it is put in 4H or 4L you have 4WD wheher you like it or not. The only connection that determines 4WD is the output of the tcase to diff, the hubs are always locked.

Correct me if I am wrong....

I dont know about the IIRC but the MQ/K had three options, no free wheeling hubs (rare), Manual hubs & automatic hubs, most people replaced the auto hubs as they were pretty unreliable & would drop out at the most unopportune moments . Most auto hubs in the 80's were crap.

SOME mq/mks had auto hubs but not anywhere near as common as lockable ones...

most mq/mk have locking hubs

screwy

Screwy_ScrewBall wrote:

mkpatrol wrote:

GaryInOz wrote:IIRC the MQ/MK front axles do not have an unlockable hub in them, meaning as soon as it is put in 4H or 4L you have 4WD wheher you like it or not. The only connection that determines 4WD is the output of the tcase to diff, the hubs are always locked.

Correct me if I am wrong....

I dont know about the IIRC but the MQ/K had three options, no free wheeling hubs (rare), Manual hubs & automatic hubs, most people replaced the auto hubs as they were pretty unreliable & would drop out at the most unopportune moments . Most auto hubs in the 80's were crap.

SOME mq/mks had auto hubs but not anywhere near as common as lockable ones...

most mq/mk have locking hubs

screwy

Yep, usually the deluxe models, mine had them but the previous owner had replaced them with AVM hubs whuch I wasnt 100% impressed with because they would sometimes disengage when the wheel bearings needed adjustment. Mind you, I have used differnet types the ones on mine & they were faultless, maybe mine were just faulty.

AVM hubs are not my preferred choise anyway, in the way of hubs, factory nissan locking hubs are the way to go.

screwy

dumbdunce wrote: as long as you disable the centre diff lock interlock (in the case of 80 series, pull one plug off the transfer case) then you have low range, with the centre diff still open, so no transfer windup + low range crawl + good turning circle.

not sure how you'd go with other full-timers (rangie?)

The same idea. Just dont engage the centre difflock and your fine.

Dave.

DaveS3 wrote:

dumbdunce wrote: as long as you disable the centre diff lock interlock (in the case of 80 series, pull one plug off the transfer case) then you have low range, with the centre diff still open, so no transfer windup + low range crawl + good turning circle.

not sure how you'd go with other full-timers (rangie?)

The same idea. Just dont engage the centre difflock and your fine.

Dave.

yep just wasn't sure if low range with centre unlocked is an option on other trucks.

IMO the newer transfers with chain drive may suffer here a bit, they dont seem as robust as the gear drive. This is only a problem if you can't unlock your front hubs. Still not enough reason not to do it if you can't unlock front drive, you will be well aware of any strains you are creating by listerning to the vehicle load up and by how much struggle you have disengaging low range.
J Top

J Top wrote:IMO the newer transfers with chain drive may suffer here a bit, they dont seem as robust as the gear drive. This is only a problem if you can't unlock your front hubs. Still not enough reason not to do it if you can't unlock front drive, you will be well aware of any strains you are creating by listerning to the vehicle load up and by how much struggle you have disengaging low range.
J Top

Everyone seems to say that about chain drives, but has anyone ever actually seen one break??? I've ony heard of one (Kia Sportage) and that was not the chains fault, it was an internal bolt that worked itself out of the tcase shell and abraded the side of the rivets on the chain away until the chain fell apart.

I have personally worked on 3 broken/stretched chains and heard of more. 1 was a low mileage GQ
J Top

dumbdunce wrote:

Tiny wrote:this is a vehicle with free wheeling hubs, this means the front diff is totally disconmected from drive. I would not suggest using low range for the same purpose in a full time 4wd

as long as you disable the centre diff lock interlock (in the case of 80 series, pull one plug off the transfer case) then you have low range, with the centre diff still open, so no transfer windup + low range crawl + good turning circle.

not sure how you'd go with other full-timers (rangie?)

In the case of Land Rover/Range Rover you just put it into low range and leave the centre diff in the unlocked position. Then you have low range with NO CHANCE of wind-up. It is just like normal driving - only slower.

Quite a good feature, and I have personally used it many times on extremely steep driveways on building sites.

In the case of the MK, all available power will be sent to the rear diff if the front hubs are not engaged, so be carefull doing this. It would be wise to limit the throttle input as any sharp stomps on the go button could see your rear diff meet its maker .

Micka.

I once drove 30km to work with my landrover (series - part-time 4x4) in 4x4 high range. I had put it in 4hi to work on it and hadn't noticed when I jumped in to drive to work - only noticed when I was parking at work because of the steering feedback. The whole trip was on ditumen, including some highway driving. That was about 7 years ago and the T-case is still going strong.

And before anyone asks, my landie doesn't have FWH.

GaryInOz wrote:

J Top wrote:IMO the newer transfers with chain drive may suffer here a bit, they dont seem as robust as the gear drive. This is only a problem if you can't unlock your front hubs. Still not enough reason not to do it if you can't unlock front drive, you will be well aware of any strains you are creating by listerning to the vehicle load up and by how much struggle you have disengaging low range.
J Top

Everyone seems to say that about chain drives, but has anyone ever actually seen one break??? I've ony heard of one (Kia Sportage) and that was not the chains fault, it was an internal bolt that worked itself out of the tcase shell and abraded the side of the rivets on the chain away until the chain fell apart.

Yep bought my GQ ute with 135k on the clock, was an ex Epic Energy vehicle and transfer chain was stuffed, vehicle looked like it had done most kays off bitumen on tracks along gas pipe lines, so I'm guessing it was left in 4wd quite a bit

Shadow wrote:

mkpatrol wrote: THERE IS NO RISK

according to toyota, nissan, holden, ford, rover, and the rest of the world, there is a risk you could dammage your drive train.

Just because you believe the risk is minimal and the likelihood of dammage is small, doesnt mean you can say THERE IS NO RISK.

Out of interest i looked in the owners manual for my GQ & it says: "never drive on hard surface roads in 4-wheel drive." Fair enough but here is the reason: "Driving on dry hard surfaces in"4H" or "4L" may cause unnecessary noise and tyre wear. We recommend driving in the "2H" position in these conditions".

There is no mention of damage to the divetrain.

My old Shorty mentioned damage may result if the vehicle is driven for long periods of time on hard surfaces but it also stated when returning to 2h to reverse the vehicle to remove all axle wind up (all this was printed on the sun visor).

This will be my last post regarding this subject so you wont have to listen to my ramblings any more

mkpatrol wrote:

Shadow wrote:

mkpatrol wrote: THERE IS NO RISK

according to toyota, nissan, holden, ford, rover, and the rest of the world, there is a risk you could dammage your drive train.

Just because you believe the risk is minimal and the likelihood of dammage is small, doesnt mean you can say THERE IS NO RISK.

Out of interest i looked in the owners manual for my GQ & it says: "never drive on hard surface roads in 4-wheel drive." Fair enough but here is the reason: "Driving on dry hard surfaces in"4H" or "4L" may cause unnecessary noise and tyre wear. We recommend driving in the "2H" position in these conditions".

There is no mention of damage to the divetrain.

My old Shorty mentioned damage may result if the vehicle is driven for long periods of time on hard surfaces but it also stated when returning to 2h to reverse the vehicle to remove all axle wind up (all this was printed on the sun visor).

This will be my last post regarding this subject so you wont have to listen to my ramblings any more

yeah but on high grip surfaces there is that low chance of the weakest ling between the transfer and the tyres that "MAY" let go. As you have previously said, and I have agreed with the chance is low, and in the case of most vehicles these days the drive train should be able to handle it. presumably sandstone etc would put a lot of stress on the drive train due to high grip, but as long as you drive like me and get enough wheel spin she'll be right

Man this has spun me out how far this thread has gone
The MK use to have the auto hubs but now has manual hubs, so does this mean that I wont have a prob
Or is all this problem stuff to do about 80 series tojoys, seeing ppl are saying 80 series???

Mere

MereMale wrote:Man this has spun me out how far this thread has gone
The MK use to have the auto hubs but now has manual hubs, so does this mean that I wont have a prob
Or is all this problem stuff to do about 80 series tojoys, seeing ppl are saying 80 series???

Mere

as long as you have free wheeling hubs and they are unlocker there is no chance of damage to the drive train if it is full time 4wd, there is contention as to what is ok and not

Tiny wrote:

MereMale wrote:Man this has spun me out how far this thread has gone
The MK use to have the auto hubs but now has manual hubs, so does this mean that I wont have a prob
Or is all this problem stuff to do about 80 series tojoys, seeing ppl are saying 80 series???

Mere

as long as you have free wheeling hubs and they are unlocker there is no chance of damage to the drive train if it is full time 4wd, there is contention as to what is ok and not

Very diplomatic tiny

mkpatrol wrote:

Tiny wrote:

MereMale wrote:Man this has spun me out how far this thread has gone
The MK use to have the auto hubs but now has manual hubs, so does this mean that I wont have a prob
Or is all this problem stuff to do about 80 series tojoys, seeing ppl are saying 80 series???

Mere

as long as you have free wheeling hubs and they are unlocker there is no chance of damage to the drive train if it is full time 4wd, there is contention as to what is ok and not

Very diplomatic tiny

life is about diplomacy, no point trying to prove a point

MereMale wrote:Man this has spun me out how far this thread has gone
The MK use to have the auto hubs but now has manual hubs, so does this mean that I wont have a prob
Or is all this problem stuff to do about 80 series tojoys, seeing ppl are saying 80 series???

Mere

This isn't about you anymore, Mere.

Let the grown ups talk and go reverse your boat, or whatever the hell it was that started all of this, up your driveway. Then go and buy a house on a flat bit of land - or buy a Rangie

We have done well to not really answer the question for you, though

Micka

Tiny wrote:
life is about diplomacy, no point trying to prove a point

you're wrong, and I'm going to prove it!

dumbdunce wrote:

Tiny wrote:
life is about diplomacy, no point trying to prove a point

you're wrong, and I'm going to prove it!

I will PM you my address and you can reserve your decision till you see me

Tiny wrote:

dumbdunce wrote:

Tiny wrote:
life is about diplomacy, no point trying to prove a point

you're wrong, and I'm going to prove it!

I will PM you my address and you can reserve your decision till you see me

you'll still be wrong even if I am squashed

dumbdunce wrote:

Tiny wrote:

dumbdunce wrote:

Tiny wrote:
life is about diplomacy, no point trying to prove a point

you're wrong, and I'm going to prove it!

I will PM you my address and you can reserve your decision till you see me

you'll still be wrong even if I am squashed

your ooooon

Tiny wrote:

dumbdunce wrote:

Tiny wrote:

dumbdunce wrote:

Tiny wrote:
life is about diplomacy, no point trying to prove a point

you're wrong, and I'm going to prove it!

I will PM you my address and you can reserve your decision till you see me

you'll still be wrong even if I am squashed

your ooooon

ok but after lunch, I am gettin a bit hungry. might go and try out that B&E roll on forge st...

no worreis, just picked up a burger

Tiny wrote:no worreis, just picked up a burger

where's mine, bitch?? could have saved me a trip!