Outer Limits 4x4 Board

Posted: **Tue Dec 06, 2005 8:09 pm**

Anything with a bent chassis is history, let alone any of the other stuff.....

Posted: **Wed Dec 07, 2005 8:11 am**

Timmy wrote:
muddymav wrote:ATT: bogged

the problem i have is that it is a major defect,meaning i have to get a rwc report befor taking it to them.i have cut quarters, stuffed seats, no rear seats, bent chassis (at the front) -OXY FIX,no sway bars,body lift ,3" suspension lift,leaking injection pump (fuel),door hinges worn,smokey exhaust.str8 through exhaust. ya recon im gunna pass with flying colours?
and people wonder why they have crack downs on 4x4's, thanks for your contribution to the sport

I agree with Timmy here.

With all these things wrong I don't think you have anything to bitch about with the defect notice. Also with the legal side of things, if you have a accident your farked.

Posted: **Wed Dec 07, 2005 8:23 am**

gu4800 wrote:
grimbo wrote:
gu4800 wrote:
Chucky wrote: It just sh!*'s me that you go to alot of trouble to do the right thing and still get f***ed around by those who hold a position of power yet have no idea what is going on.
Sorry to hi-jack the thread .....

Only dickhead coppers think it is a position of POWER! Most decent coppers will realise the job for what it is - a position of AUTHORITY.

You were just unlucky enough to strike a dickhead!

Glad to see you got it sorted.
Why was the cop being a dckhead. he gave a defect notice for the obvious things and asked for a RWC to get the stuff he didn't know. All vehicles should be road worthy so there shouldn't be a problem. It is a PITA I agree but we know the risk when you modify a car things like this can happen unless you do all 100% legal from the start
I know this car (Chucky) and it is by no means a standout in terms of visual modifications. Reasonable height, tyres don't stick out, etc, etc. It is a very capable touring truck and not over the top - it's his family car.

I also know Chucky and he is a level headed bloke and I doubt he would have been a smartarse about the issue.

So, back to your question - why was he being a dickhead? Well, it would appear that he pulled Chucky over becuase he thought he was on a mobile phone, but when he realised he was on a UHF (this is legal mind you), rather than admit he got it wrong and let Chucky be on his way, he obviously figured he would make the most of it and be a DICKHEAD!

As I said above, the vehcile in question looks like a lot of other 4WD's on the road and didn't deserve the attention. Mine looks just like it in terms of lift, and mine is fully legal - I would not appreciate being pulled over by an overzealous copper.

Now, had the copper pulled over a hughly modified 4WD, with massive lift or wheels sticking out then he would not have been a DICKHEAD bu he would have been doing his job.

Grimbo - don't take it personally, I just know the vehicle in question and didn't think the attention (or the hour long lecture) was particularly warranted.

On a side note, a mate of mine runs a mechanical business and there was a coppers car down there - V8 Falcon - getting some work done. Big exhaust, very loud and I am sure by no means even close to legal!

orif
I was talking about the original poster, didn't even read Chucky's original post. I was responding to his comment which i thought referred to the first post (if that makes sense)

As to the fact the original posters car sounds like a complete POS then no wonder they pulled him over and only wrote a couple of things down and relied on the RWC to sort the rest out. This is why 4wd owners get such a hard time. By all means mod the car but do it safely and more importantly subtlely

Posted: **Wed Dec 07, 2005 10:51 am**

muddymav wrote:ATT: bogged

the problem i have is that it is a major defect,meaning i have to get a rwc report befor taking it to them.i have cut quarters, stuffed seats, no rear seats, bent chassis (at the front) -OXY FIX,no sway bars,body lift ,3" suspension lift,leaking injection pump (fuel),door hinges worn,smokey exhaust.str8 through exhaust. ya recon im gunna pass with flying colours?

I would like to buy them cops a beer for gettin this hunk of shit off the road...
I'll give ya a grand for it.

Posted: **Wed Dec 07, 2005 1:04 pm**

Just some friendly advice.

Cars are being pulled over every day for minor and major defects.

If you feel that you have been unfairly treated, contact the office where the police member is from and discuss the issues with their supervisor, line manager etc. Usualy that person is a sergeant who can usually sort it , either by explaining why the member took this action or investigate if the action taken was correct. I have done this on numerous times and at the end of the day most people just want a fair hearing.

Also when I intercept vehicles I like to explain to the driver why I am taking action and usually the driver's are accepting.

In regards to the original post, the car sounds like it received the appropriate treatment.

Posted: **Wed Dec 07, 2005 1:09 pm**

RoadNazi wrote: at the end of the day most people just want a fair hearing.

reading his added list of issues, I think Simms Metal would turn it down, although Im starting to think its a troll.

Posted: **Wed Dec 07, 2005 1:28 pm**

Muddymav,
Do yourself and us a favour mate and take it off the road , use it as a play toy in the 4x4 parks and buy something safe for the highways. Most of us have families and don't want things like that falling apart in front of us. No offence mate but it's a death trap............Pete!

Posted: **Wed Dec 07, 2005 1:42 pm**

i think you should all get off ya farkin high horses.

How many of you on here have fully road legal rigs. Hell, mines a 2000 model patrol with a very mild lift and 33's and its not even farkin legal. And all ive done is springs shocks and tyres.

ok ok so his cars not in perfect condition. but FARK ME how many POS lasers, mistubishi sigmas, nissan pintaras, ford xd falcons etc etc do you see on the road with rust holes that you could put your head inside, exhaust pipes dragging on the ground, tyres that put racing slicks to shame, missing/hanging/broken front guards, cracked windscreens, broken brake/headlights, oil and fuel leaks and squeals in the fan belts louder than burnout cars at full noise?

If you see as many as I do then you will realise that its just the luck (or the unluck) of the draw. Because I see ALOT of these on the road and i VERY rarely see or hear of them pulled over/defected.

Yes, modifications adds to the attention. Thats why you see the cars above, PLUS some ghetto bling wheels and cut springs getting pulled over and not the normal pieces of utter sh1t on the road.

To have a wheelable rig that you can actually give a hard time offroad legally you virtually have to tow it everywhere. For this you need something big enough to tow it and a trailer to tow it. Then you cant wheel an unregistered rig hardly anywhere, so you gotta pay rego on it, but not drive it on the road. Its all a farkin money makin scheme.

There isnt anything you can do in this farkin country that isnt regulated.

Big Brother is watching.

(thats my weekly whinge out of the way)

Posted: **Wed Dec 07, 2005 1:59 pm**

DEEV8 wrote:i think you should all get off ya farkin high horses.

So what your saying is you have no problems with that truck on the road? You dont see this as possibly why some cops target 4wds, as this cop found out that its easy pickings for his quota? Causing headaches for others...

How many of you on here have fully road legal rigs.

Mine is.

Hell, mines a 2000 model patrol with a very mild lift and 33's and its not even farkin legal. And all ive done is springs shocks and tyres.

Then why not make it legal. As said by others if you have an accident and kill someone, extreme chances that you go to jail dude.

Posted: **Wed Dec 07, 2005 2:46 pm**

[quote="gu4800"]
I know this car (Chucky) and it is by no means a standout in terms of visual modifications. Reasonable height, tyres don't stick out, etc, etc. It is a very capable touring truck and not over the top - it's his family car.

quote]

This makes it worse, I wont let my Missus in an unroadworthy or unregistered car.

Pretty slack attitude to have im afraid & as Bogged said (FAAARk this is gonna hurt) if you kill someone bacuase you vehicle is unroadworthy you will be liable (I feel feint now, I need to lie down).

Posted: **Wed Dec 07, 2005 3:08 pm**

bogged wrote:
DEEV8 wrote:i think you should all get off ya farkin high horses.
So what your saying is you have no problems with that truck on the road? You dont see this as possibly why some cops target 4wds, as this cop found out that its easy pickings for his quota? Causing headaches for others...

How many of you on here have fully road legal rigs.
Mine is.

Hell, mines a 2000 model patrol with a very mild lift and 33's and its not even farkin legal. And all ive done is springs shocks and tyres.
Then why not make it legal. As said by others if you have an accident and kill someone, extreme chances that you go to jail dude.

thats great. Good for you. now dont sit there and aks why i shouldn't make it legal. Go have a look in the members thread and tell me how many of the first 20 are fully legal on the road. Not just registered, but legal.

Posted: **Wed Dec 07, 2005 4:35 pm**

mkpatrol wrote:
gu4800 wrote: I know this car (Chucky) and it is by no means a standout in terms of visual modifications. Reasonable height, tyres don't stick out, etc, etc. It is a very capable touring truck and not over the top - it's his family car.

quote]

This makes it worse, I wont let my Missus in an unroadworthy or unregistered car.

Pretty slack attitude to have im afraid & as Bogged said (FAAARk this is gonna hurt) if you kill someone bacuase you vehicle is unroadworthy you will be liable (I feel feint now, I need to lie down).

You quite obviously haven't read the ENTIRE thread - just picked the juicy bits. My comments related to a post by Chucky about HIS car, not the original POST. Chucky's car IS legal, and as I said my comments relate to HIS car.

READ THE ENTIRE THREAD BEFORE YOU POST and maybe your comments will be relevent!

As for the original post - it should be pulled off the road or fixed if possible.

Posted: **Wed Dec 07, 2005 4:49 pm**

mkpatrol wrote:
gu4800 wrote: I know this car (Chucky) and it is by no means a standout in terms of visual modifications. Reasonable height, tyres don't stick out, etc, etc. It is a very capable touring truck and not over the top - it's his family car.

quote]

This makes it worse, I wont let my Missus in an unroadworthy or unregistered car.

Pretty slack attitude to have im afraid & as Bogged said (FAAARk this is gonna hurt) if you kill someone bacuase you vehicle is unroadworthy you will be liable (I feel feint now, I need to lie down).

read the whole thread and realise that that quote is about a fully legal, engineered rig with a couple of inches of lift and 32's... not the "death trap" so check your not pulling facts from your ass before you spout off from your high horse.

Posted: **Wed Dec 07, 2005 4:52 pm**

DEEV8 wrote: with rust holes that you could put your head inside, )

no one has ever told me why panel rust makes a car dangerous to OTHER road users... wouldn't it make it safer, because they crumple more easily, transfering less impact to your structurally sound vehicle... and it's a bit like seatbelts... if you want to take the risk, take the risk. it's not going to affect me.

Posted: **Wed Dec 07, 2005 5:11 pm**

bad_religion_au wrote:
DEEV8 wrote: with rust holes that you could put your head inside, )
no one has ever told me why panel rust makes a car dangerous to OTHER road users... wouldn't it make it safer, because they crumple more easily, transfering less impact to your structurally sound vehicle... and it's a bit like seatbelts... if you want to take the risk, take the risk. it's not going to affect me.

That's a good point...so...XC "Falcons should gain better fuel economy as they get older, .... as they get lighter. Had I kept my rusting '76 5.8 litre GXL, it would be safer now and giving me 35mpg! In fact it is probably getting 35mpg, but as a recycled Hyundai.

Seriously, what about fellow passengers . A rusty heap would compromise their safety too. Also seat belts keep you inside the vehicle. Unrestrained occupants endanger other occupants and also their immediate environment.

Posted: **Wed Dec 07, 2005 5:41 pm**

let me str8ten things out,the tow hook on the front was bent and kinked the nut throught the chassis,pimpiling it about 2mm if that the sway bar link is broken on the right rear and left front on the ball joint,windscreen was cracked on the weekend comming home (that day) cracked headlinght was a stone chip in one,the leaking hub seal has to go bak to the mechanics (their falut) it aint a death trap.its a 2nd car too.

Posted: **Wed Dec 07, 2005 5:43 pm**

RoadNazi wrote:Unrestrained occupants endanger other occupants and also their immediate environment.

Like roadside trees? Now I understand why greenies want those old rustbuckets off the road!

Scott

Posted: **Wed Dec 07, 2005 6:00 pm**

bad_religion_au wrote:and it's a bit like seatbelts... if you want to take the risk, take the risk. it's not going to affect me.

the money to keep your veggie state body alive for 70 yrs costs millions. thats one reason

Posted: **Wed Dec 07, 2005 8:20 pm**

mkpatrol wrote:
gu4800 wrote: I know this car (Chucky) and it is by no means a standout in terms of visual modifications. Reasonable height, tyres don't stick out, etc, etc. It is a very capable touring truck and not over the top - it's his family car.

quote]

This makes it worse, I wont let my Missus in an unroadworthy or unregistered car.

Pretty slack attitude to have im afraid & as Bogged said (FAAARk this is gonna hurt) if you kill someone bacuase you vehicle is unroadworthy you will be liable (I feel feint now, I need to lie down).

I agree 100%. I won't let my family drive or ride in ANY unroadyworthy car.
That is why I only have a 2' lift and only run 32's. I want to go bigger but any higher or bigger is agaist the law so I can't do it. Although I use this 4by for 'quickies' to Ormeau and other fun places, with air locker front and rear and gears the 80 can get though a fair bit, but I also use this 4by for cape trips and desert crossings. My family's life depends on the safety and reliability of this 4by and I won't compromise their safety by having a "She'll be right " attitude to either repairs or mods.

Posted: **Thu Dec 08, 2005 7:33 am**

gu4800 wrote:
mkpatrol wrote:
gu4800 wrote: I know this car (Chucky) and it is by no means a standout in terms of visual modifications. Reasonable height, tyres don't stick out, etc, etc. It is a very capable touring truck and not over the top - it's his family car.

quote]

This makes it worse, I wont let my Missus in an unroadworthy or unregistered car.

Pretty slack attitude to have im afraid & as Bogged said (FAAARk this is gonna hurt) if you kill someone bacuase you vehicle is unroadworthy you will be liable (I feel feint now, I need to lie down).
You quite obviously haven't read the ENTIRE thread - just picked the juicy bits. My comments related to a post by Chucky about HIS car, not the original POST. Chucky's car IS legal, and as I said my comments relate to HIS car.

READ THE ENTIRE THREAD BEFORE YOU POST and maybe your comments will be relevent!

As for the original post - it should be pulled off the road or fixed if possible.

I actually did read all of the thread and you missed my point & I can see how after I re-read it. My point was so many people put their familys lives at risk by driving around in an unroadworthy vehicle. Just because a vehicle has an engineers certificate which has been accepted by a registration authority does not mean it is road worthy, it just means it has met the minimum requirements of the law which innthe tru sense is not the same thing. I have seen quite a few vehicles with engineering certificates which should not have been anywhere near a public road.

As for Chuckys winge about being hassled by the Police, live with it & dont winge because its not the Police officers fault YOU modified your vehicle (I am not trying to be nasty here, just trying to state a fact). Its the age old thing, they have to enforce the laws & the people who modify their cars are the first off rank as they attract the most attention, thats life & you have to expect it.

Now Chucky did the right thing by disagreeing with the police officer as the officer was probably expecting to see a smart arse with no approval for his mods but he obviously changed his mind when he realised everything is legit.

A badly modified vehicle is far more dangerous than a standard car with a couple bald tyres and blowing smoke, just look of the pics of Patrols with no swaybars fitted lifting a front wheel as they corner.

I have no sympathy for people who get defects as it is your responsibility to keep your vehicle roadworthy, and its not hard.

GU4800, maybe next time you can ask why instead of just jumping on me because you dont understand

Posted: **Thu Dec 08, 2005 7:35 am**

Chucky wrote:
mkpatrol wrote:
gu4800 wrote: I know this car (Chucky) and it is by no means a standout in terms of visual modifications. Reasonable height, tyres don't stick out, etc, etc. It is a very capable touring truck and not over the top - it's his family car.

quote]

This makes it worse, I wont let my Missus in an unroadworthy or unregistered car.

Pretty slack attitude to have im afraid & as Bogged said (FAAARk this is gonna hurt) if you kill someone bacuase you vehicle is unroadworthy you will be liable (I feel feint now, I need to lie down).
I agree 100%. I won't let my family drive or ride in ANY unroadyworthy car.
That is why I only have a 2' lift and only run 32's. I want to go bigger but any higher or bigger is agaist the law so I can't do it. Although I use this 4by for 'quickies' to Ormeau and other fun places, with air locker front and rear and gears the 80 can get though a fair bit, but I also use this 4by for cape trips and desert crossings. My family's life depends on the safety and reliability of this 4by and I won't compromise their safety by having a "She'll be right " attitude to either repairs or mods.

Thanks Chucky for not jumping on me

Posted: **Thu Dec 08, 2005 7:36 am**

bad_religion_au wrote:
mkpatrol wrote:
gu4800 wrote: I know this car (Chucky) and it is by no means a standout in terms of visual modifications. Reasonable height, tyres don't stick out, etc, etc. It is a very capable touring truck and not over the top - it's his family car.

quote]

This makes it worse, I wont let my Missus in an unroadworthy or unregistered car.

Pretty slack attitude to have im afraid & as Bogged said (FAAARk this is gonna hurt) if you kill someone bacuase you vehicle is unroadworthy you will be liable (I feel feint now, I need to lie down).
read the whole thread and realise that that quote is about a fully legal, engineered rig with a couple of inches of lift and 32's... not the "death trap" so check your not pulling facts from your ass before you spout off from your high horse.

What can I say to that........

Posted: **Thu Dec 08, 2005 9:23 am**

[quote="mkpatrol"]

As for Chuckys winge about being hassled by the Police, live with it & dont winge because its not the Police officers fault YOU modified your vehicle (I am not trying to be nasty here, just trying to state a fact). Its the age old thing, they have to enforce the laws & the people who modify their cars are the first off rank as they attract the most attention, thats life & you have to expect it.

quote]

My winge was that the copper was making deceisions purely on what HE thought was right. If he had a book that had all the standard heights of cars and used it when he put the tape measure agaist my 4by then I would have lived with it because then cruiser would have passed and I would have been on my way. But by him making a deceision that costs me money on what he THINKS is the law is not good enough. Will I be compensated for my time and expenses when it is proven that I was correct and not the copper, I don't think so. I just have to smile, thank the kind police man for the fisting and ask the nice officer if I supply the vasealine, can we use it next time.
If a police officer can issue a defect notice ( and fine) with no actual proof to support his accusation then what comes next, a copper standing on the side of the road and thinks you might be speeding so issues a ticket. Or thinks you might be DIU so books you and sends you to court.
And when you can take your 4by over the pits in the morning and it will pass, yet get the same car inspected in the afternoon and it won't says there is a major flaw in our transport practices.

And, No it isn't the police officers fault I modified my 4wd. But it IS his fault that he didn't know the laws ( and therefore his job) well enough to make deceisions which he has been given the authority to. To me that is negligence of duty.

Posted: **Thu Dec 08, 2005 9:43 am**

Thats why I said you did the right thing by pointing it out to him, he was wrong, thats why he backed down. He would have been looking for the easiest thing to defect on your vehicle & then sent it for a full inspection at the rego station. The thing is with the police they don't know all the ins & outs of the rego system, they are trained to look for obvious items thats why they pick in things like mud flaps, buggered lights & so forth.

Im not saying its right, just the risk anybody takes when they modify their vehicle. I have been through it for years & cannot be bothered with it any more, so my Patrol is now stock except for touring ad ons. Even my CBR has standard pipes & it doesnt attract any attention when I gas it & it still does ridiculuos licence losing speeds in second gear.

Posted: **Thu Dec 08, 2005 9:46 am**

mkpatrol wrote: I actually did read all of the thread and you missed my point & I can see how after I re-read it. My point was so many people put their familys lives at risk by driving around in an unregistered vehicle. Just because a vehicle has an engineers certificate which has been accepted by a registration authority does not mean it is road worthy, it just means it has met the minimum requirements of the law which innthe tru sense is not the same thing. I have seen quite a few vehicles with engineering certificates which should not have been anywhere near a public road.

A badly modified vehicle is far more dangerous than a standard car with a couple bald tyres and blowing smoke, just look of the pics of Patrols with no swaybars fitted lifting a front wheel as they corner.

I have no sympathy for people who get defects as it is your responsibility to keep your vehicle roadworthy, and its not hard.

GU4800, maybe next time you can ask why instead of just jumping on me because you dont understand

I don't really like your choice of words, mate. If you are suggesting that modified vehicles which have been passed by engineering authority and comply with state laws are not suitable for the roads then that is rubbish.

If a vehicle is lifting wheels going at reasonable speed around a corner it's hard to see how it has passed the pretty strict laws, and my guess is that the mods are not engineered.

I would personally prefer to be on the road with any modded 4x4 with engineering certificate than a car "with a couple of bald tyres".

We have a system which allows limited mods to vehicles and still able to drive on the road. By bagging this system you really are in the same category as the rest of the anti- 4x4 media.

Remember, this is "outerlimits" after all.

Posted: **Thu Dec 08, 2005 10:22 am**

RoadNazi wrote:! In fact it is probably getting 35mpg, but as a recycled Hyundai.

Seriously, what about fellow passengers . A rusty heap would compromise their safety too. Also seat belts keep you inside the vehicle. Unrestrained occupants endanger other occupants and also their immediate environment.

true the unrestrained passenger bit. i should have said "if your the sole occupant".

as for the rusty heaps, can anyone tell me how rust in the bootlid of a falcon will compromise safety? also it's up to anyone as a passenger to assess the risks of what they are riding in as well

Posted: **Thu Dec 08, 2005 10:23 am**

bogged wrote:
bad_religion_au wrote:and it's a bit like seatbelts... if you want to take the risk, take the risk. it's not going to affect me.
the money to keep your veggie state body alive for 70 yrs costs millions. thats one reason

then lets scrap medical funding for people in vegitative states. if your family can't accept that your never coming back, let them pay for it.

Posted: **Thu Dec 08, 2005 10:45 am**

bad_religion_au wrote:
RoadNazi wrote:! In fact it is probably getting 35mpg, but as a recycled Hyundai.

Seriously, what about fellow passengers . A rusty heap would compromise their safety too. Also seat belts keep you inside the vehicle. Unrestrained occupants endanger other occupants and also their immediate environment.
true the unrestrained passenger bit. i should have said "if your the sole occupant".

as for the rusty heaps, can anyone tell me how rust in the bootlid of a falcon will compromise safety? also it's up to anyone as a passenger to assess the risks of what they are riding in as well

You could get tetanus and this could lead to lock jaw, which means it would be very hard to talk your way out of a ticket when the cop pulls you over for having a rusty boot

Posted: **Thu Dec 08, 2005 11:15 am**

bad_religion_au wrote:
RoadNazi wrote:! In fact it is probably getting 35mpg, but as a recycled Hyundai.

Seriously, what about fellow passengers . A rusty heap would compromise their safety too. Also seat belts keep you inside the vehicle. Unrestrained occupants endanger other occupants and also their immediate environment.
true the unrestrained passenger bit. i should have said "if your the sole occupant".

as for the rusty heaps, can anyone tell me how rust in the bootlid of a falcon will compromise safety? also it's up to anyone as a passenger to assess the risks of what they are riding in as well

There is 3 levels or rust in the code, the last on where there is a hole is not legal,
Bootlid hmm.. maybe exhaust fumes could enter the cabin, you could become sleepy and have a head on.

Eric

Posted: **Thu Dec 08, 2005 11:29 am**

slosh wrote:
mkpatrol wrote: I actually did read all of the thread and you missed my point & I can see how after I re-read it. My point was so many people put their familys lives at risk by driving around in an unroadworthy vehicle. Just because a vehicle has an engineers certificate which has been accepted by a registration authority does not mean it is road worthy, it just means it has met the minimum requirements of the law which innthe tru sense is not the same thing. I have seen quite a few vehicles with engineering certificates which should not have been anywhere near a public road.

A badly modified vehicle is far more dangerous than a standard car with a couple bald tyres and blowing smoke, just look of the pics of Patrols with no swaybars fitted lifting a front wheel as they corner.

I have no sympathy for people who get defects as it is your responsibility to keep your vehicle roadworthy, and its not hard.

GU4800, maybe next time you can ask why instead of just jumping on me because you dont understand
I don't really like your choice of words, mate. If you are suggesting that modified vehicles which have been passed by engineering authority and comply with state laws are not suitable for the roads then that is rubbish.

I didnt say all, but they are out there & you are a little nieve to think they are not.

If a vehicle is lifting wheels going at reasonable speed around a corner it's hard to see how it has passed the pretty strict laws, and my guess is that the mods are not engineered.

I would personally prefer to be on the road with any modded 4x4 with engineering certificate than a car "with a couple of bald tyres".

Bald tyres are not inherently dangerous until it rains & then it depends on the level of wear as to how it performs, its all relative.
We have a system which allows limited mods to vehicles and still able to drive on the road. By bagging this system you really are in the same category as the rest of the anti- 4x4 media.

How can this be, I own one, I enjoy it I just choose not to mod it & I have no problem with the system as long as the mods are performed correctly.

Remember, this is "outerlimits" after all.