Outer Limits 4x4 Board

bogged wrote:The Factory Turbo and some shiz is off ... (and forsale )

how much?

I'd say for him to talk to his accountant.

From what i recall R+D expenses can be claimed against your tax at a rate of 125% IIRC, so any costs incurred in R+D are a write off against his taxable income.

So coming from that point of view, free upgrades

yorgerg wrote:so any costs incurred in R+D are a write off against his taxable income.

Exactly.

bogged wrote:

Ben wrote:When snorkel companies have wanted to borrow Jeeps for example to R&D on new models, they don't expect you to pay for the part and half the fitting fee, it's all free. To me, that's a fair deal.

one of the blokes from here had his GQ used for a 'template' for pillar pods.

After it was all finished, he wasnt even offered a decent discount, let alone a freeby.

Ahh yes, nice people them.
Took time off work, travelled to the other side of the city and hardly a thanks let alone a decent discount on some thing that retailed for only about $130.00. The item was sh1t anyway.

I have used Andy a few times and found him to be very down to earth, honest and realistic with his prices.
I'm sure Bogged will be happy with the result and will save some $$'s along the way. I'm sure he'll be well looked after in the future as well.

it's still difficult for me to comprehend that a bloke makes an offer for a volunteer (not conscript) spells out the condiotions in his first post and all these people pipe up sook abou it.

No-one is asking anyone who does not want to pay to pony up a cent.

Somone who is willing to pay has done so ... and is happy to do so .. so take the soap boxes and go home.

I am pissed that he isn't in Brisbane and wants to do a 13BT upgrade cos I would be in

frp88 wrote:I am pissed that he isn't in Brisbane and wants to do a 13BT upgrade cos I would be in

roadtrip

I let Andy know he can keep the car for weekend if need be. I want it right, and give him the best opportunity to get it right.

Soooooooooooooo! how is it progressing???

Its actually going well. Just the small things to tidy up. It just never seems to work as well in theory as in practice. Should be on the dyno tomorrow afternoon.


Andy

Seems like a very good offer to me.

If i had the neccessary vehicle and it was in Canberra or nearby i would have snapped up that offer quick smart.

Good on you Dzltec

suggy126 wrote:I can see where zagan is coming from, but in all honesty if you had a vehicle that matched the requirements and wanted a turbo on your truck but were considering doing yourself due to costs, i sure as hell would jump at the deal, risks and all.

I've got an 89 GQ 4.2 diesel that's begging for a turbo, but i'm not rolling in dough and therefore it'll be a rum and mates job as that's what i can afford, now having said that, i ask zagan this,
WHAT WARRENTY WOULD I GET ON MY WORK DONE?

If i found someone offering to fit the thing for cost price parts and 1/2 price labour i'd go hell ye, he's obviously a good shop if he's doing R&D at all, and not every business can burn money (like diesel chip companies) to test a product, plus diesel chips are R&D free because they've never been used before, it's not like this turbo has been built and never used before, he wants to find out if it will work well for his application.

You'd have none, but I couldn't see the offer being $500 and off you go with a warranty for a decade afterwards either.

It's not the first time he's posted up about doing a turbo kit, this is the 3-4th post about it at least.

Anyway, him picking bogged will probably be the best as bogged will have some idea of what the exact, I guess and looks more like a mate helping out a mate rather than unknown person walking in and saying I'm here with the cash and the car for the R&D work.

Anyway as I said I think you'd get a good job but still doesn't change the fact that things can go wrong big time.

Just see what happens and what the end result ends up being for what the full cost will be.

I do have to say at least it's something, you look at the US diesel mags and they have 20-30 diesel shops doing the same sorts of stuff, and none of this seems to happen here much.

If I had the cash and able to find the right people I would setup a diesel shop myself and be doing this sort of thing myself.

There's 3-4 companies selling turbo kits in Australia so there must be a decent market for kits here.

I am hoping it'll be a little more powered up than the current offerings, that would be something real good to see.

Dzltec wrote:Its actually going well. Just the small things to tidy up. It just never seems to work as well in theory as in practice. Should be on the dyno tomorrow afternoon.


Andy

I have to ask the obvious question here.

Based on your offer is it fair to say Bogged will end up paying the same as what retail will be for labour because next time you will do it in half the time ?

yorgerg wrote:I'd say for him to talk to his accountant.

From what i recall R+D expenses can be claimed against your tax at a rate of 125% IIRC, so any costs incurred in R+D are a write off against his taxable income.

So coming from that point of view, free upgrades

Really, i've never heard this before? If so my patrol is going to be getting some serious R&D!!

zagan wrote:
Anyway as I said I think you'd get a good job but still doesn't change the fact that things can go wrong big time.

dude it's not like he's talking some unknown turbo and huge boost with massive fuel.

there turbo it self is already a proven product and subject to it's own R&D by the manufacturer.

the engine is still using a factory fuel pump, so is limited in how much fuel can be used.

on top of that the guy has been tuning turbo diesels for years and knows what a TD42 can put up with. I honestly think you're being just tad harsh here.

soooooooo after all the back and forward bull shit. how does this vehicle perform???
worth the time and money???
cheers andrew

PGS 4WD wrote:We do custom work every day, we obviously can't work at 1/2 price just because we haven't done that exact job before. Would you expect a house builder to build a house at 1/2 price labour just because you changed the floor plan from the last 20 he built?
In reality we make less money on such work as we already often have to discount of rates to get the job.
Automotive parts suppliers offer very poor warranties, it is the fitter of the parts that wears most issues. The liability is much greater with custom work. Particularly with performance upgrades where the power of an engine may be double or triple that of stock and pre existing production parts are more highly stressed.
For example I've fitted camshafts that have failed, had them tested and proven the material hardness was not satisfactory and still have to wear the labour of the repair, all we get in most instances is a replacement part, not the days labour required to fit it or the gaskets and oils and so on.

Cheers

Joel

I know of hardly any engine builders who will give a "real" warranty on souped up engines and one offs custom work because they know how they are most likely to be used and its affect on other standard equipment. At best all they should expect is a manufacturers warranty of the individual parts and even then there are conditions attached especially with performance parts. Even most suspension suppliers/manufacturers dont give a warranty on lifts over 2"-3" and they would be crazy to do so.
What I'm saying is that suppliers or fitters etc who give warranties for this kind of thing are gonna shoot themselves in the foot because when something goes wrong they are going to have to foot the all the costs except for the replacement part, maybe. If customers want all sorts of radical mods that substantially change the vehicles characteristics they should not expect too much in the way of warranties. eg: a decent power upgrade may expose a driveline weakness for instance quicker than before and the customer should be made aware that this would not be covered.

Dzltec must have a lot of faith in his work to offer a 20,000km warranty and it sounds like he's not going to do anything radical anyway and when a different turbo is fitted everything has to be retuned and checked anyway so I cant see what the big deal is.

sudso

I'm extremely happy with the whole project.

Basically Andy wanted me to run up some klms on the setup before saying much since this is the first one, making sure all works and there are no bugs. No use selling it if there are any issues, or complaints.

So far I won't say anything bout the system and figures until its all completed.

Believe me, I'm champing at the bit to tell all and laugh at all the wankers that were saying that this deal wasnt worth it to them!

This week it goes back in for checking over and if required it will get another tune, and then I will continue gloating at the rest of the people who missed out.

- The work
- The communication
- The quality of the mods
- The end result
- The Ballbearing turbo sound
- 10/10

But from memory low down torque was up over 60% and EGT's are down 100 right across the range.. It is VERY VERY VERY much worth doing. Everyone says this usually, but 'wish I'd done it before'.

So watch this space.

bogged wrote:I'm extremely happy with the whole project.

Basically Andy wanted me to run up some klms on the setup before saying much since this is the first one, making sure all works and there are no bugs. No use selling it if there are any issues, or complaints.

So far I won't say anything bout the system and figures until its all completed.

Believe me, I'm champing at the bit to tell all and laugh at all the wankers that were saying that this deal wasnt worth it to them!

This week it goes back in for checking over and if required it will get another tune, and then I will continue gloating at the rest of the people who missed out.

- The work
- The communication
- The quality of the mods
- The end result
- The Ballbearing turbo sound
- 10/10

But from memory low down torque was up over 60% and EGT's are down 100 right across the range.. It is VERY VERY VERY much worth doing. Everyone says this usually, but 'wish I'd done it before'.

So watch this space.

I will be VERY interested in the results. Might have to make the drive down south to get it done if all is good.

turbo gu wrote:I will be VERY interested in the results. Might have to make the drive down south to get it done if all is good.

I'll go with - sounds great!

Even better, today he has lent me his turbo diesel 80 to get home in. That saves me 3 hours on train/bus/walk/crawl beg.
Hope nobody gets photos of me in a yoda...
Has a nice MP3 player in it, would look good in the Barina

Your going to need an intercooler

matt.mcinnes wrote:Your going to need an intercooler

its got one

bogged wrote:

matt.mcinnes wrote:Your going to need an intercooler

its got one

It needs a better one

matt.mcinnes wrote:

bogged wrote:

matt.mcinnes wrote:Your going to need an intercooler

its got one

It needs a better one

I know, but $$ :(
Free trial model? cars at Andys if you wanna go measure it up

bogged wrote:

matt.mcinnes wrote:

bogged wrote:

matt.mcinnes wrote:Your going to need an intercooler

its got one

It needs a better one

I know, but $$ :(
Free trial model? cars at Andys if you wanna go measure it up

I might have a chat with Andy. For further down the road.

QUOTE
"test mules get put through rigors some of us wouldn't put our own rigs through. get the mixture/tuning/ whatever wrong during the initial start up and it can potentially shorten the life of the engine. these things are less of a guess on a known product..."

By this comment i gather that you dont know much about diesel engines then.
At the end of the day it is a turbo, with obviously well chosen specs, just plucked from the recycle bin had a bash at and certianly not brain surgary. You cant lean a diesel out so you can get the mixture wrong unless you make major changes to the pump setting and start dumping in to much fuel at full throttle.
I think some people need to get into the real world and know what they are talking about before running down some one who does this for a living(both running a business and being a machanic)
However, i would have tryed to sorce a test car not from a public forum particually how this has come across and been critisised, then charge you all top price.

Been awhile now......

I reckon after driving an 80 he didn't want to go back tot he datsun

Driving the 80 will make his GU feel even faster when he gets it back.

waiting on a part to come from Qld... they sent the wrong one originally, so hadda wait...
Oh well, saved me some money stayin home on that rain predicted weekend that was only sunny and high 20s all weekend

All good, still happy... Oh the 80, goes well wish it still had the sequencials on it though :( :(