Outer Limits 4x4 Board

chimpboy wrote:

V8Patrol wrote:You do all the work .......... they get the money

yep ...... it SUCKS

I find that hard to believe, I thought that if you work hard and you're good your boss will always look after you?

You really do work for yourself dont you? maybe I'm just jaded because I've worked for too many wankers.

At the end of the day, the engineer is liable when the wheels fall off at 100km/h. I'd want to be getting paid a bit more, too.

-Stu

shakes wrote:

chimpboy wrote:

V8Patrol wrote:You do all the work .......... they get the money

yep ...... it SUCKS

I find that hard to believe, I thought that if you work hard and you're good your boss will always look after you?

You really do work for yourself dont you? maybe I'm just jaded because I've worked for too many wankers.

I do believe the Chimp was being sarcastic.

I work part time in production engineering for a large company....that sells stuff...anyhow, sometimes I do wonder if all the stress and risk on the full time guys shoulders (engineers) is worth it. One often wonders how it would be to be a gardener or work on a resort... sounds relaxing does'nt it ?

stuffed the fan one, Q38. It depends on perspective i guess, i assumed the perspective of the fan, but they assume the perspective of a person vieing it.

From each fan's perspective, they are spinning opposite directions.

also stuffed the N/A engine one.

Shadow wrote:stuffed the fan one, Q38. It depends on perspective i guess, i assumed the perspective of the fan, but they assume the perspective of a person vieing it.

From each fan's perspective, they are spinning opposite directions.

also stuffed the N/A engine one.

looknig at the fans from any perspective they will appear to both turn the 'same' way - viewed 'through' the back of one fan at the other, the blades will both be turning (say) clockwise. viewed from the side like in the picture, they will both be turning so the blades turn (say) down relative to the observer. the only way you can oberve them to be turning in opposite directions (which they do, you're quite right) is to put yourself between the fans and observe them individually, which is counter intuitive to say the least. if you set it up as a demonstation and asked observers to tell you if the fans were turning in the same direction, I think most everyone would say yes. to answer otherwise is to overanalyse the situation

dumbdunce wrote:

Shadow wrote:stuffed the fan one, Q38. It depends on perspective i guess, i assumed the perspective of the fan, but they assume the perspective of a person vieing it.

From each fan's perspective, they are spinning opposite directions.

also stuffed the N/A engine one.

looknig at the fans from any perspective they will appear to both turn the 'same' way - viewed 'through' the back of one fan at the other, the blades will both be turning (say) clockwise. viewed from the side like in the picture, they will both be turning so the blades turn (say) down relative to the observer. the only way you can oberve them to be turning in opposite directions (which they do, you're quite right) is to put yourself between the fans and observe them individually, which is counter intuitive to say the least. if you set it up as a demonstation and asked observers to tell you if the fans were turning in the same direction, I think most everyone would say yes. to answer otherwise is to overanalyse the situation

I can see I got the answer wrong, but not because i didnt know what was going on, but because IMO the question could have been worded differently.

I think if you truly understand the situation, and know the principals of whats going on, it is more intuative to say the fan spins the opposite way. Might just be me tho.

dumbdunce wrote:

Shadow wrote:stuffed the fan one, Q38. It depends on perspective i guess, i assumed the perspective of the fan, but they assume the perspective of a person vieing it.

From each fan's perspective, they are spinning opposite directions.

also stuffed the N/A engine one.

looknig at the fans from any perspective they will appear to both turn the 'same' way - viewed 'through' the back of one fan at the other, the blades will both be turning (say) clockwise. viewed from the side like in the picture, they will both be turning so the blades turn (say) down relative to the observer. the only way you can oberve them to be turning in opposite directions (which they do, you're quite right) is to put yourself between the fans and observe them individually, which is counter intuitive to say the least. if you set it up as a demonstation and asked observers to tell you if the fans were turning in the same direction, I think most everyone would say yes. to answer otherwise is to overanalyse the situation

DD, you sure you haven't overanalysed this?

RED60 wrote:

dumbdunce wrote:

Shadow wrote:stuffed the fan one, Q38. It depends on perspective i guess, i assumed the perspective of the fan, but they assume the perspective of a person vieing it.

From each fan's perspective, they are spinning opposite directions.

also stuffed the N/A engine one.

looknig at the fans from any perspective they will appear to both turn the 'same' way - viewed 'through' the back of one fan at the other, the blades will both be turning (say) clockwise. viewed from the side like in the picture, they will both be turning so the blades turn (say) down relative to the observer. the only way you can oberve them to be turning in opposite directions (which they do, you're quite right) is to put yourself between the fans and observe them individually, which is counter intuitive to say the least. if you set it up as a demonstation and asked observers to tell you if the fans were turning in the same direction, I think most everyone would say yes. to answer otherwise is to overanalyse the situation

DD, you sure you haven't overanalysed this?

not sure, requires further investigation...

I do like the fact, that when everyone gets the question wrong, they blame the "wording"

I had to do almost exactly the same test when I started my apprenticeship!

V8Patrol wrote: I have to work with engineers on a daily basis.......

Trust me .... engineers do SUCK !

We need the engineers you work with to give their opinion of you.

I got 76%, i think thats pretty good considering that i have no mechanical background.

Cheers,
Sean

How do you explain Q45. The balloons are all exposed to the same pressure on the outside which would be 1 atmosphere.
Maybe the rubber was thicker and harder to stretch on the smaller one?
The only way the pressure could be different is if it was in a pressure chamber of some sort, I can't see one.
Got Q8 wrong as well, I know which way they turn, but I obviously don't know a turn from a rotate.

HIL01X wrote:How do you explain Q45. The balloons are all exposed to the same pressure on the outside which would be 1 atmosphere.
Maybe the rubber was thicker and harder to stretch on the smaller one?
The only way the pressure could be different is if it was in a pressure chamber of some sort, I can't see one.
Got Q8 wrong as well, I know which way they turn, but I obviously don't know a turn from a rotate.

q45 asks which balloon is experiencing the highest atmospheric pressure (i.e. the balloons obviously aren't in the same place). One could be on the top of koziosko, another at sea level.

I stand by my comment - if this were a VCE/Tafe or Uni exam it would have been far better written!

I agree that the fan question depends on perspective.

-Stu

To picture it you just have to think of the "Atmosphere" (or air n stuff) as a liquid. Suppose you held those baloons under water which one of them would have the greatest force up wards... the big one.. its the same principle as the baloons in air etc.
Ben

HIL01X wrote:How do you explain Q45. The balloons are all exposed to the same pressure on the outside which would be 1 atmosphere.
Maybe the rubber was thicker and harder to stretch on the smaller one?
The only way the pressure could be different is if it was in a pressure chamber of some sort, I can't see one.

I think their point was that each balloon was subject to a different outside temperature. The point was that this was the only way that otherwise identical balloons with identical amounts of gas inside could be larger/smaller, therefore you had to reach that conclusion... if they showed "chambers" etc then that would give the answer away.

That's from memory anyway.

I got 80%
Not bad for a computer dude

dogbreath_48 wrote:
q45 asks which balloon is experiencing the highest atmospheric pressure (i.e. the balloons obviously aren't in the same place). One could be on the top of koziosko, another at sea level.

I stand by my comment - if this were a VCE/Tafe or Uni exam it would have been far better written!

I agree that the fan question depends on perspective.

-Stu

Well you make more sense than the questions.
I was first going to pick the smaller one but then thought no, they're all in the same place.
Q8 was the sungear/ring gear one.

got Q 7 wrong and the piston one wrong.

How are people getting 100% when Q 7 is worng?

D is not reverse it is reduction.
A is also a reduction but the final gear is turning in reverse

So ???

jeep97tj wrote:got Q 7 wrong and the piston one wrong.

How are people getting 100% when Q 7 is worng?

D is not reverse it is reduction.
A is also a reduction but the final gear is turning in reverse

So ???

Well only one of them was reverse compared to the other three IIRC.

chimpboy wrote:

jeep97tj wrote:got Q 7 wrong and the piston one wrong.

How are people getting 100% when Q 7 is worng?

D is not reverse it is reduction.
A is also a reduction but the final gear is turning in reverse

So ???

Well only one of them was reverse compared to the other three IIRC.

That's essentially how I answered it - reverse was "the one that's left."

chimpboy wrote:

HIL01X wrote:How do you explain Q45. The balloons are all exposed to the same pressure on the outside which would be 1 atmosphere.
Maybe the rubber was thicker and harder to stretch on the smaller one?
The only way the pressure could be different is if it was in a pressure chamber of some sort, I can't see one.

I think their point was that each balloon was subject to a different outside temperature. The point was that this was the only way that otherwise identical balloons with identical amounts of gas inside could be larger/smaller, therefore you had to reach that conclusion... if they showed "chambers" etc then that would give the answer away.

That's from memory anyway.

nah its to do with pressure, the higher up a balloon the bigger it gets.

Weather ballons expand from 1m diametre to something like 15m diametre before they explode.

-Scott- wrote:

chimpboy wrote:

jeep97tj wrote:got Q 7 wrong and the piston one wrong.

How are people getting 100% when Q 7 is worng?

D is not reverse it is reduction.
A is also a reduction but the final gear is turning in reverse

So ???

Well only one of them was reverse compared to the other three IIRC.

That's essentially how I answered it - reverse was "the one that's left."

I think its to do with a car transmission specifically, where the input shaft rotation is always reversed for forward gears, its just reveresed twice for reverse.

Shadow wrote:[
I think its to do with a car transmission specifically, where the input shaft rotation is always reversed for forward gears, its just reveresed twice for reverse.

that's only true of (most) front wheel drive gearboxes - in rear wheel drive gearboxes the input and output turn in the same direction in forward gears, they are even locked together in one gear (usually 4th in a 4 or 5 speed).

The baloons...
When you hold a blow up pool toy under water it tries to "float" to the top... then you get a bigger one and it is even harder to pull it under the water.
This is called buoyant force. Where the surrounding liquid weighs more than the air, therefore it pushes it up (resulting in less than a net force where the baloon/pool toy creates less downwards force than the water causing a net upwards force).
Try and relate it to the baloons in our case and make sure you consider the surrounding atmosphere as a liquid. So the gas in the baloon (helium ..etc) weighs less than the surrounding atmosphere, if there is more gas in the baloon, then it will have a greater force.
Think of a hot air baloon, same thing, the bigger it is, the more it will float.
Ben

dumbdunce wrote:

V8Patrol wrote:You do all the work .......... they get the money

sounds like a cry-baby, whinyassed opinion to me dude

if, as you imply, engineers are so lazy and stupid, how about you put aside a few years, go to uni, get yourself an engineering degree - should be easy since you can beat them in an online mechanical aptitude test - become an engineer, show them all how much better you can do it, then sit back and get all the money while someone else does all the work for you.

just a suggestion. you could show the UAC your score on this test to add weight to your application.

On a daily basis I'm in touch with engineers regarding THEIR drawings, usually in relation to POOR quailty drawings that are either incomplete or simply DONT have the required information on them.

The result ( 9/10 ) is that we submit a shop drawing, using the exact same program that they use, that they then check and sign off on.

Can anyone explain to me why a customer should fork out in most cases in our line of work cost $4000 + for a set of plans that are incomplete, then once you've explained that then tell me why we fabricators must supply shop drawings to the engineers for approval on a connection design that we have had to draft up..... they get their money for nothing.

On a shed we did a few months back the customer paid out $6000 for his plans ONLY...... for a large shed with an overhead gantry.....
The stupid engineer didnt put on HIS plans a single hold down bolt connection size...... yep a wonderfull drawing but without the most critical size of the damn hold down bolt anywhere !!

Last week we quoted on another shed.... again the drawings were from the same engineer........

THE EXACT SAME DRAWING with a different name in the customers box


that cost the customer ....... $6000

for a fugging copy !

AND STILL WITHOUT THE HOLD DOWN BOLT SIZE




We do around a hundred sheds a year...... I see the same plans comming from the same places about 25% of the time, the only differance is the customers name on those plans.
In all honesty I cant recall the last set of plans we received that were 100% complete and didnt require a phonecall to get a verification on.


They get paid to do a job that they dont do .

Perhaps as the builders we should follow to the letter every detail on the supplied plans .... then when it falls down we can simply pass the buck.

Imagine that...... a large shed with an overhead gantry, finished off to the letter of the plans......
And not a single bolt holding it in place !


Thank God auotmotive engineers remember to add the brakes on vehicles !



Someones gotta think up the idea
Someones gotta design it so it works
someones gotta build it

Time that the middle man was deleted.

KiwiBacon wrote:

V8Patrol wrote: I have to work with engineers on a daily basis.......

Trust me .... engineers do SUCK !

We need the engineers you work with to give their opinion of you.

easy answer......


they hate me

why ...... cause I actually make em do what they are paid to do in the first place.

Shadow wrote:

chimpboy wrote:

HIL01X wrote:How do you explain Q45. The balloons are all exposed to the same pressure on the outside which would be 1 atmosphere.
Maybe the rubber was thicker and harder to stretch on the smaller one?
The only way the pressure could be different is if it was in a pressure chamber of some sort, I can't see one.

I think their point was that each balloon was subject to a different outside temperature. The point was that this was the only way that otherwise identical balloons with identical amounts of gas inside could be larger/smaller, therefore you had to reach that conclusion... if they showed "chambers" etc then that would give the answer away.

That's from memory anyway.

nah its to do with pressure, the higher up a balloon the bigger it gets.

Weather ballons expand from 1m diametre to something like 15m diametre before they explode.

You're right, I have no idea why I wrote temperature there when i meant pressure.