Outer Limits 4x4 Board

Hi all,

I have a 1.3L G13BA which has done 297,000 faithful kilometres without any internal work ... just timing belts, etc.

Has been a beaut engine, still starts first crank even on cold mornings, does 120 km/h on 275/75R15s, but did a head gasket yesterday (hopefully not a cracked head ) so figure it's time to treat her to a reco.

Is there anything in particular (beyond a straight engine reco) that we should do while the engine's out and things are accessible (eg clutch, which I will be doing)?

First engine rebuild for me so any advice appreciated! My bro-in-law owns his own auto mechanical workshop and is more than happy to help out if a slab's in the fridge, so should be all right in that respect

Cheers,
Tim

i think we done the timing belt and water pump whilst we were in there.. maybe some cam work if you want to. could always bore the block and get a full rebuilt kit (pistons etc)

hopefully the heads all good mate. good luck with it

Yup will be boring the block and putting in new pistons. Thinking of getting Suzisports rebuild kit ($550 + delivery). Anyone got any good/bad experiences with this kit??

Will do timing belt too; wouldn't take one off without replacing it! Not worth the hassle and risk.

Water pump sounds pretty alright at the moment, no knocks or vibration, so might leave that for the time being. Depends what it looks like inside - radiator is .... well used

Do you clutch (and cable) and have your flywheel machined. May as well do the waterpump while its apart in your shed instead of bush mechanics on the side of the road. Check your engine mounts, rear gearbox mount, transfers mounts etc. Sounds like over kill but your new engine may have the power (lol) to wreck whats been there for years. There's more I'm sure...

Valves , they tend to need grinding around that age seating surface gets a little narrow. best to get the head serviced , especialy after a failed head gasket

although i never have rebuilt an engine i'm nearly at the stage where i got all the bit to build it from scratch real soon Here are my suggestions.

the suzisport rebuild kit comes with a new waterpump so put it in.

If you don't intend to rebuild it again i suggest you go whole hog and 1mm overbore it, that will net you a total of 35cc doesn't sound much but thats 2.6% increase in displacemnt (2 cubes ) In an old performance book David Vizard said each cube extra could result up to one extra pound of torque and hp, he went further to say that increasing displacement is the only way to increase torque across the entire rev range.(variable valve timing being non existant then) 2Lbft = 2.7nm

I'm pretty sure the pistons are 9.5:1 in the suzisport kit (spoke to derek about it some time back) if not (or you go elsewhere) ask for swift pistons as they definetely are. If you go the oversize the compression wil be slightly higher.

While it's all apart think of upgrading the cam, i found out that the vitara cam has slightly more lift and duration then a sierra one. On it's own the difference probably neglegiable but with the extra 2 cubes and higher compresion it may shine.

Lastly if the head is cracked replace it with a vitara head. bigger exhaust valves and it already would have the cam

Yep Whack a cam in it , and drive it at 3 -7ooorpm every where make it work like a real performace motor ,

don,t worry just keep a snatch strap in your car as well



THe problem with throwing cams into a Zook,
the motor is in a low state of Tune for a reason Longer duration cams Usualy have less vacunm at idle , meaning your idle speed needs to be increased there for raising the speed of stall , Now if you don't have
100 to 1 low range , This increases the slowest attianable crawl speed
before the motor dies, meaning you have to drive faster to keep the motor from stalling , Not a good look in real wheeling .

JMO.

Thanks for your help!

Hadn't noticed the Suzisport kit included a waterpump - will certainly be putting that in if I get the kit!

With 300,000k's on the clock I imagine the bores are probably somewhat scored (seeing as nobody but nobody treats a Zook right *all* the time!!!), so I'll most likely be boring it out either 1.0 or 1.5mm.

Anyone know whether you can go 1.5mm reliably with the alloy block?? 1.5mm oversize is the biggest piston/ring combo Suzisport sell.

Not really keen on cam work ... I'm happy with the performance of the 1.3L as it is ... there's something intensly satisfying about a stock Sierra overtaking a Landcruiser bogged to the hubs

Any recommendations in Adelaide for good workshops for block boring / head service?

that's why i rang suzisport, they don't have 1.5mm overbore and can't get them.

If you want 1.5mm you need to go vitara pistons, which means gti rods.

as for the cam Superf1y from teamswift.net the forums no1 cam and head grinder posted stock profiles.

Lift/Duration at .050"

1.3 8V 330/192
1.6 8V 356/202

not a huge difference in profile

superf1y wrote:Duration.
Generally speaking, the duration will determine the useful RPM range of your engine. As duration is increased, the power band moves up in the RPM range. What you gain on one end, you will lose on the other.

Lift
Increasing the lift will almost always result in increased torque, and horsepower. It has been said that lift = torque, and horsepower.

So a 1.6l cam has a greater lift but similar duration meaning the powerband wouldn't shift to much.
that's why i suggested it over some radical cam

fingers crossed the extra lift also means that it compensates for the power shift resulting in same power down low (ie no increase as oppose to loss)

Thanks Santos ... heaps of good info there. Will look into the cam once I see what state my existing head is in - Vitara head sounds like a worthwhile option. Will do some research

I don't think I woudl recommend a vitara head with a sierra bottom end. vitaras run larger valves so you will loose some bottom end torque, and I imagine the vitara cam is also a bit "bigger" to run the 1600, all up, I think it woudl shift your powerband up, even if you put the 1.3 cam back in it due to the bigger valves.

I know that people have run the 1.3 head on the 1.6 bottom end to build low RPM torque.

Steve.

If your gonna bother with all the above engine mods, get a Vitara 1.6 EFI and be done with it.

In a 1.3 head use 1.3 intake and 1.6 exhaust valves from memory 1.5 to 2mm bigger with a good 3 angle valve job makes for some nice low end torque while still being able ot breathe quite well all the way to redline and well beyond.
Combine that with a torque gringd on the cam and extractors you will have a motor that will pull quite respectably from about 800rpm to 8000rpm (that is when the GTI rods are a nice addition) I went to the touble of gasket matching mine on both intake and exhaust .. not sure how much difference the gasket matching made ..

The 1.3 head is reported to have stonger rocker gear.

The head mods should only cost about $250 or so that is including new exhaust valves from suzuki.

If you can do a full Vit 1.6 efi swap for less than $1100 (about what it will cost to rebuild the 1.3 properly) and have it 100% legal with the engineers etc .. I will drive the vehicle to your door, hand you the cash and buy you four dozen of your favorite frosty beverage to do the job.

Can I just have the cash and the beer

=SKB= wrote:If your gonna bother with all the above engine mods, get a Vitara 1.6 EFI and be done with it.

And there's the correct answer!

By the time you do all this work, you will have way more than $1100 in the motor and it will still be a carby 1300.

IMHO rebuilt 1300's don't seem to last more than about 20,000km anyway.

Just pony up and but the right motor in it from scratch.

Steve.

love_mud wrote: The 1.3 head is reported to have stonger rocker gear.

The head mods should only cost about $250 or so that is including new exhaust valves from suzuki.

as it is i got a vit head and a sierra head at home, i can bust out the calipers and measure rocker gear thickness (and possible weight by puting them on my Uber1kg/ 0.1g increment scales)

Be aware that the 1.6 head most probly has a larger combustion chamber
most probly only a few CC s But it will drop the compression ratio of a 1.3 .

I guess what I'm really after from my rebuild is a reliable 1.3L producing round about factory power. Basically my current engine minus water and oil leaks

I'm not real keen on tossing in a Vit 1.6 EFI which would cost probably $1500 to buy, $350 for a bell-housing adaptor, probably not less than $2k installed, and then might find 20,000k's down the track that I need to do a rebuild on it. Also have heard they have a problem with the block cracking which sounds a bit nasty.

I'd rather keep the good engine I have, spruce it up, treat it right and get another 150,000k's out of it.

I suspect most rebuilt engines die shortly after being rebuilt because:
1) people go for more power, run more aggressive cams, etc
2) rebuild quality not up to factory standard (now, where did this bolt come from )
3) boring the block / shaving the head / etc changes compression ratios and tolerances

That's what this post is really about ... asking people their experiences with what works in Suzi rebuilds, and what is pushing too far.

Cheers for all who've helped out so far!

i'v rebuilt mine 18mths ago drivenhard every day but use good oil every 10,000ks semisynh cost 500 bucks to do

Dozoor wrote:Be aware that the 1.6 head most probly has a larger combustion chamber
most probly only a few CC s But it will drop the compression ratio of a 1.3 .

i was the one who really pushed this idea but Superf1y said they measured the same and after taking rough depth and width with caliper say i agree

Santos wrote:

Dozoor wrote:Be aware that the 1.6 head most probly has a larger combustion chamber
most probly only a few CC s But it will drop the compression ratio of a 1.3 .

i was the one who really pushed this idea but Superf1y said they measured the same and after taking rough depth and width with caliper say i agree

Your saying the 1.3 and 1.6 heads are the same CC capacity ?

and you checked this with calipers ?

whats Suzisports contact number? i mignt need one of these kits

Suzisport

Suzuki Parts Specialist, New, Used & Reco Parts
666 Gympie Rd Lawnton QLD 4501
ph: 1800 611 000 Auto Parts Recyclers

Their website appears to be down at the moment, but is www.suzisport.com.au. Kit is under "Online Shop" --> "Sierra 1.3" --> "Performance". $550 incl. GST from memory plus postage. Not sure what it would cost for postage but shouldn't be more than $50 tops.

I'm going to strip mine down, see whether I need to overbore the cylinders, then give them a call and work out the details.

Moph wrote: I'm going to strip mine down, see whether I need to overbore the cylinders, then give them a call and work out the details.

as your motor has quite a number of K's on it I would suggest that you do rebore it (taking the minimum amount off) to ensure your bores are truely round.