Outer Limits 4x4 Board

Just want to know if its possible to do this to a leaf sprung zook!
Could it get engineered in QLD,
I'm in love with the arti

Anyone know what diffs it was running?? 5 Stud??

tonks wrote:Anyone know what diffs it was running?? 5 Stud??

I'll take a stab in the dark and say errrr Sierra.

As to doing this with a leafy, best answer, sell it and buy a coily and start from there. Changing suspension setup although possible is very difficult and you would have a lot more success if you started with coils in the first place

Its cheaper to start with a leafy than a coily. And anyone that has owned a coily will tell you that the factory suspension is rubbish and needs removing anyway.

One thing to remember is that all welding and brackets will need to be engineered, but if you use factory parts for the coil seats, trailing arms etc, you will keep the engineers happy. So use Patrol, or 80 series trailing arms, not custom made; no heim joints or rod ends, and fit swaybars to control body roll ( atleast while the engineer is looking at it) and you'll be in with a shot.

Call QLD transport for a list of engineers that they use, and ask them if they would approve a properly carried out coil conversion.

You have LOTS of work ahead of you.

Peter

Not weighing into what's legal or not but the rear diff on Steve azzopardi's car was vitara based. Front was WT but heavily modified.

Steve.

Rear diff is a rear Vitara cut down on one side to line drive shaft up & has floating axels, front diff is a rear coily diff flipped (to get the width) with ends cut off and knuckles welded on!!!!! Its an old photo though, A few more things have been modded since then. Is engineered in NSW.

Thanks for the clarification.

Still the most impressively built sierra I have ever seen. Obviously there are some elements of the build that are dated now, and I am sure that a simpler build might, in fact, work better overall, but the execution was flawless.

The owner - not sure if it was Steve- was asking $11.5K for it and I don't think it sold (that was eariler this year)

Steve.

Danzo wrote: I'm in love with the arti:D

And that's one of the things that dates it. Once articulation numbers get that high, there are a host of issues that have to be dealt with and generally are very difficult to resolve.

This particular car had problems with rear roll stiffness (the same problem stock coil sierras suffer, ironically) which meant the rear shock mounts ended up through the floor.

The rear steer caused by geometry compromises was very significant.

I am sure that on certain obstacles it would have ruled, but on others it would have been frightening. It's a shame it never got to compete in TT that year - missed scrutineering by 45 minutes.

Built with shorter coilovers and maybe 5-6" less travel and maybe 12" less articulation per axle would have taken $$$$$$ and headaches out of the build- everything gets easier - and I reckon a car with broader capability.

In aerenandmel's photo the car was tied off the ramp to load it. In the photo on the tyre the front isn't working anywhere near as hard. Point the car up a steeper hill (or get on the throttle) and that soft, flexy back end would get really spooky

I'm not saying it's not a grouse build and not inspriational, just that a car that poses on ramps well is not necessarily the car you'd want to drive in the bush, or, for that matter, on the street.

In all of my recent (admittedly leaf) builds I do very little to improve the travel of the rear end, and just concentrate on freeing the front up. It makes for cars that are soooo much more predictable to drive on actual terrain, even though they don't pose as well on ramps.

Just my 2c

Steve.

I might be leaning out on a thin branch with this one?:?
Could you use Hilux diffs, for instance more ground stability, and stronger for 33's when off road,:idea:
I mean if an engineer is going to approve a total suspension change over why not wider diffs with a bit more strength? or would they look at that in a bad way?
I might be looking at this conversion early next year if I find out enough info and an engineer that says yes
engine would be as is but with LPG.
Thanks guys all this info is sinking in

Yeah sure, whatever diffs you want, what diffs you use aren't the problem. (Although late model 70 series would be better than hilux IMHO)

The problem is when you pump the figures into a 4 link calculator and try and work where the links want to be while working around the chassis and drivetrain, and then resolve all that with a steering box and a 14" long rear driveshaft.

IF (and it's a big 'if') you can get all the work past an engineer, you will find that getting the car to road drive acceptably with such a short WB, wide track width and high unsprung weight will be a major challenge.

My serious suggestion woudl be to build a buggy and work out suspension design, roll centres anti squat, rear axle steer (that is due to link geometry not actual steering) etc with a buggy and if you can make it durable and reliable then apply your skills to a road car.

Alternatively, start with a LWB vitara and SAS it. Far easier, and you are already starting with more wheelbase and width, a rear end that already works well, and less other problems to work with.

I am yet to build a coil conversion, mostly because I haven't been very impressed with the coil converted cars I have seen and think t hat for the effort, the return is low. Leaves can be made to work very very well.

Steve.

Danzo wrote:I might be leaning out on a thin branch with this one?:?
Could you use Hilux diffs, for instance more ground stability, and stronger for 33's when off road,:idea:
I mean if an engineer is going to approve a total suspension change over why not wider diffs with a bit more strength? or would they look at that in a bad way?
I might be looking at this conversion early next year if I find out enough info and an engineer that says yes
engine would be as is but with LPG.
Thanks guys all this info is sinking in

Seeing as you live in QLD I can't see it happening. From all the stuff that people say on here and other forums those sort of mods will never be possible to get legal in QLD. Best bet is to find out from the authorities but I just don't reckon it is possible to be legally done there.

A couple of videos of it with Steve Azzopardi driving, before a complete change in the rear suspension (now same as the front).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PDPr0osoVY4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W29HHXaHL90

though I had seen it on you tube,

Always hard to assess angle on a video- it balanced better than I would have imagined, but they were pretty easy obstacles.

Way too tall as it was sitting there for Vic though. I never really saw it at ride height in the flesh, strapped down on the trailer it looked the shizzle, but that was maybe 6" lower than it was sitting in the videos. I reckon that's how I'd run it.

Steve.

PS as per Grimbo's comments - you'll be putting an engineers kids though private school trying to get a build this big through QLD laws.

Gwagensteve wrote: Way too tall as it was sitting there for Vic though. I never really saw it at ride height in the flesh, strapped down on the trailer it looked the shizzle, but that was maybe 6" lower than it was sitting in the videos. I reckon that's how I'd run it.

With the new rear sus setup it sits a fair bit lower than it did in the video.