Outer Limits 4x4 Board

Was there ever a version of the coil spring land rover to use that Salisbury axle up front?

Yes

Later model military vehicles. I know where one is that came out of a army defender in Ireland but Im not sure if its for sale. They are a bloody heavy diff for the front and not sure of CV size/strength either

101s

defmec wrote:101s

101s are leaf sprung (SOA).

But to answer the question, armoured 110s were fitted with a sals front end. They are rare as hens teeth outside northern ireland though

Easier to build your own from a rear sals.

Here is one



It was bought from ebay.co.uk, came as a complete Kit with track rods, panhard and double cardan driveshaft. Halfhshafts and CV´s are standard AEU2522´s, so not worth it. This axle has custom 30 spline 1.3" shafts with longfields. No breakage so far.

Is there point to doing this?? Even with that one above, you can only go to 30 spline, which is much weaker than the Dana 60 center. It makes more sense to put a Toy center in the Rover axle with 30 spline.

red90 wrote:Is there point to doing this?? Even with that one above, you can only go to 30 spline, which is much weaker than the Dana 60 center. It makes more sense to put a Toy center in the Rover axle with 30 spline.

They're high pinion and pretty weak

red90 wrote:Is there point to doing this?? Even with that one above, you can only go to 30 spline, which is much weaker than the Dana 60 center. It makes more sense to put a Toy center in the Rover axle with 30 spline.

I really don´t think that makes any sense! With a Toyota center, your weakest link is the Ring and Pinion. I prefer (with any doubt) to have my weakest link in 1.3" alloy steel halfshaft or in a 30 Spline Longfield than in a weak 8" reverse cut Ring Gear and Pinion...You can replace a shaft or CV much easier than a broken ring and pinion! Beside that, Toyotas in portuguese competition brake A LOT OF high pinion 3rd members (only with 35" tires or smaller and small turbo diesel engines)!! I could never trust 38.5 Boggers and 430 Nm engine torque in a toyota 8" center. I know the ground clearence is not the best, such as the weight, but for the use of this truck, I really believe this is the strongest front rover axle you can get.

Overall this setup has a far superior overall resistence and is much easier to fix in the field in case of failure.

But, the salisbury axles bend much more. And you can not laminate them...

well unless theres a major difference between the sals and dana's i don't think this is a real problem..... theres a few dana's running in trucks in the USA.....

Does any reckon that a converted front to Salisbury is much better than a rover type front.

cloughy wrote:They're high pinion and pretty weak

High pinion in a front axle is stronger than low pinion... The high pinion is only a weak option in a rear axle.

uninformed wrote:well unless theres a major difference between the sals and dana's i don't think this is a real problem..... theres a few dana's running in trucks in the USA.....

Salisburies have thinner-walled tubing than a D60, which makes them lighter. IME they are pretty strong, but is easy to brace them if you are worried.

I agree with FerRi on the merits of a Sals front end.

red90 wrote:

cloughy wrote:They're high pinion and pretty weak

High pinion in a front axle is stronger than low pinion... The high pinion is only a weak option in a rear axle.

Yep, Until you reverse back

Seen them break, in young vehicles, in reverse.......weak as piss, I'd rather a rover front in the front, Tojo rear set up

cloughy wrote:Tojo rear set up

A low pinion rear is just as weak in reverse as the high pinion front

People need to learn how to drive....

A Salisbury/Dana 60 should have 35 spline. No point otherwise.

red90 wrote:

cloughy wrote:Tojo rear set up

A low pinion rear is just as weak in reverse as the high pinion front

People need to learn how to drive....

A Salisbury/Dana 60 should have 35 spline. No point otherwise.

Yep,sure

red90 wrote:

cloughy wrote:Tojo rear set up

A low pinion rear is just as weak in reverse as the high pinion front

People need to learn how to drive....

A Salisbury/Dana 60 should have 35 spline. No point otherwise.

The rear Salisbury in this truck has 35 spline because it is easy to convert. The front is only possible by going open knucle...that means building an entire axle from scratch...a lot more work and LOT more expensive. And you can´t find front Dana60s easily in Europe.

So this front Salisbury is pretty much a bolt on solution. The 1.3" shafts are rated at 1750 Mpa Tensile Strength and the Longfields are stronger than a Spicer Dana60 UJ (Longfield Website data), so I believe this axle is not very far in strength to a standard 35 splined Dana60.

Like I said before, for the use of this truck, a Toyota 3rd member is not an option...too weak. And I´ve seen them break going front also, not just reverse.

So, in the end, I do believe it is easier to go front Salisbury than actually learning how to drive

red90 wrote:

cloughy wrote:Tojo rear set up

A low pinion rear is just as weak in reverse as the high pinion front

People need to learn how to drive....

A Salisbury/Dana 60 should have 35 spline. No point otherwise.

I agree - plenty of people need to learn how to drive - especially americans...

However - with a 30spl longfield setup the ring and pinion is the weak point. I don't see the problem with having a salisbury centre and 30slp outers. If the sals is shaved the difference in clearance is only about 1" - and you have a lot more strength.

It is a whole lot of work to get no better than swapping in a Toy center, with more weight plus propshaft and clearance issues to deal with.

If Salisbury fronts were a dime a dozen, it would make sense, but they are not.

Might as well pull a 60 front out a junkyard here and have it shipped over. You guys are so scared of shipping. The LR community in Canada brings in containers from the UK twice a year. You all need to learn to work together.

People here (that know what they are doing) would never run over 35" with 30 spline and never go to a 60 at that size.

A 30 splined Longfield Salisbury is strong enough for the truck above. A 30 splined Toyota isn´t. The salisbury is bolt on. The Toyota center isn´t. Very hard to break a 60 center. Easy to break a toyota center. That is my point.

red90 wrote:It is a whole lot of work to get no better than swapping in a Toy center, with more weight plus propshaft and clearance issues to deal with.

If Salisbury fronts were a dime a dozen, it would make sense, but they are not.

Might as well pull a 60 front out a junkyard here and have it shipped over. You guys are so scared of shipping. The LR community in Canada brings in containers from the UK twice a year. You all need to learn to work together.

People here (that know what they are doing) would never run over 35" with 30 spline and never go to a 60 at that size.

Yet you'd comfortably run a reverse cut, high pinion Tojo 8" centre on +35's and claim its stronger

red90 wrote:It is a whole lot of work to get no better than swapping in a Toy center, with more weight plus propshaft and clearance issues to deal with.

If Salisbury fronts were a dime a dozen, it would make sense, but they are not.

Might as well pull a 60 front out a junkyard here and have it shipped over. You guys are so scared of shipping. The LR community in Canada brings in containers from the UK twice a year. You all need to learn to work together.

People here (that know what they are doing) would never run over 35" with 30 spline and never go to a 60 at that size.

I just bought a sals for AUD$200. How much would a D60 cost - prices I have seen are US$600-1000ish??? Then there would be shipping on top of that. Then it is still not bolt in - I would need to change the width, get custom axles made, change stud pattern etc... By the time I have started it would be just as much work as starting with a sals. Longfields seem to be about as strong as OEM 35 splines (though naturally less than aftermarket 35s).

If you want an easy swap in OZ fit 60/80 series or GQ/GU axles.

ISUZUROVER wrote:I just bought a sals for AUD$200. How much would a D60 cost - prices I have seen are US$600-1000ish??? Then there would be shipping on top of that. Then it is still not bolt in - I would need to change the width, get custom axles made, change stud pattern etc... By the time I have started it would be just as much work as starting with a sals. Longfields seem to be about as strong as OEM 35 splines (though naturally less than aftermarket 35s).

Brakes too. To fit a D60 in the front of a rover is a nightmare. A 24 spline sals with new longs would be easier and way cheaper. You would still need to lengthen/shorten axle tubes, but apart from that its almost a bolt in fit. A toy center would be an easier to conversion though not as strong.

red90 wrote:

cloughy wrote:Tojo rear set up

A low pinion rear is just as weak in reverse as the high pinion front

After running high pinions in hilux's fronts before I would much rather a low pinion in the front.

High and Low Pinions are very very similar in strength in forward direction.

Low pinions are far stronger than a high pinion in reverse.

Knowing I can quickly snap reverse and not imediatly hear the snap of pinon far outways the disadvantage of the lower drive shaft.

I know guys who do the toy swap this is not an option as the steering is behind the axle.

In a rear application, I have only broken them due to bearing failures, the gears were in correctly set-up or just plain getting it going forward.

ever tried pegging the diff bubs

defmec wrote:ever tried pegging the diff bubs

??

Okay, I know as much about this as I do about the space shuttle, but surely it doesn't make any difference if it's high or low pinion so long as all other factors are the same. In other words, as long as you are running on the same side of the gear teeth, you should have the same strength. The exception being reverse cut gears - sure you have all the strength in the world when bouncing up hills going forward, but get stuck with your front end in a ditch and you'll always going to break the front R&P. Educate me! Are the Toy hi-pinion fronts reverse cut or something?

Yes

does diff pegging work as good as they say

diff pegging if done properly will take some of the flex out of the crown wheel and pinion...... but you can only polish a turd so much...

saying this i am happy to stick with rover front with Maxidrive. run r606665 cv and use the stub axle as a fuse. i don't wheel that hard hell more soft than anything. so this will do me fine.

mine is a daily driver so high km reliability is a big factor for me.

i'm sorry but how can a toy 8 inch crw+p be as strong as a sals?????

cheers, serg