Outer Limits 4x4 Board

Im waying up the pros and cons of putting a vit gearbox auto/manual and transfer into a lwb zook with a sierra transer on the end of it.
Will the gearbox fit in the trans tunnel without a bodylift?
How long is the gearbox plus tranfer?
What is the ratio of 5th gear?
What is the ratio of low range?
I know I could just get a s3 rh but then I would have to change diff gears to get road speed and Im not sure about being stuck with ultra low range all the time. I love rock crawling but also like other stuff to.
I already have the vit engine and a spare vit transfer just after a few ideas.
Or could the search nazis tell me where to look as this puter takes a few mins to load each page
Thanks for any positive/negative input
Nik

NIK wrote:Im waying up the pros and cons of putting a vit gearbox auto/manual and transfer into a lwb zook with a sierra transer on the end of it.
Will the gearbox fit in the trans tunnel without a bodylift?
How long is the gearbox plus tranfer?
What is the ratio of 5th gear?
What is the ratio of low range?
I know I could just get a s3 rh but then I would have to change diff gears to get road speed and Im not sure about being stuck with ultra low range all the time. I love rock crawling but also like other stuff to.
I already have the vit engine and a spare vit transfer just after a few ideas.
Or could the search nazis tell me where to look as this puter takes a few mins to load each page
Thanks for any positive/negative input
Nik

ok number 1. no it will not fit without a body lift unless you chop the floor.
as for the rest i have no idea sorry. you reverse the sierra gearbox to vit engine adaptor to fit it on though. the flex plate bolts straight on to the sierra crank..

cheers mark

5th is the same as far as I know.

High range is direct in a vitara, which normally causes a problem. with your current setup, I get 2450 RPM @ 100kph with a direct high range. My guess is this is far too low IMHO - 5th will be useless- you'll be in 4th, at about 3000 rpm.

Stock vitara low is 1.851:1


Even with crawler gears in a vitara case, you'll only have a best of 78:1 low range, which is OK, but my my calcs you have 106:1 now.


My vote- trade your 4.88's for stock gen 3 hilux 4.3:s, and put a TT 6:4.1 gearset in. you get 3500rpm high range cruising (should be fine close to sierra stock) and 100:1 low range.

I think this is the best spread.

Steve.

Thanks for the input guys, I knew I would need to mod the vit transfer and make a new gearbox crossmember but I dont think I want a body lift Im already thinking how to lower it.
Steve that is some good info thank you, I was going to use the sierra transfer after the vit one so it should still be the same on road?
The vit low range is a bit odinary I was thinking if it was atleast 2:1 it would be well worth looking into.
I like your thinking with the 6.4:1 what speed would it be (roughly) at 3500rpm? Im not that good with gearing calcs.
The 6.4:1 with 4.3 r&p does sound like it would be best all round and propably alot easier to do.
Thanks Nik

mud4b wrote:

NIK wrote:Im waying up the pros and cons of putting a vit gearbox auto/manual and transfer into a lwb zook with a sierra transer on the end of it.
Will the gearbox fit in the trans tunnel without a bodylift?
How long is the gearbox plus tranfer?
What is the ratio of 5th gear?
What is the ratio of low range?
I know I could just get a s3 rh but then I would have to change diff gears to get road speed and Im not sure about being stuck with ultra low range all the time. I love rock crawling but also like other stuff to.
I already have the vit engine and a spare vit transfer just after a few ideas.
Or could the search nazis tell me where to look as this puter takes a few mins to load each page
Thanks for any positive/negative input
Nik

ok number 1. no it will not fit without a body lift unless you chop the floor.
as for the rest i have no idea sorry. you reverse the sierra gearbox to vit engine adaptor to fit it on though. the flex plate bolts straight on to the sierra crank..

cheers mark

I got an auto with 3" body lift and still need to trim the tunnel as it's too narrow

Don't know much about this. But check out this post (if your superfast computer will let you), and scroll down to you find where the bloke fitted the Sierra transfer to his LWB Vitara.

http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/phpBB2/vi ... p?t=114694

Plenty of photos, gives you some ideas about whats involved, how big its gonna be roughly, etc.

Warning: If your computer is really that bad, the link I put up has over 100 picies in it!!!

Highway-Star wrote: http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/phpBB2/vi ... p?t=114694

Warning: If your computer is really that bad, the link I put up has over 100 picies in it!!!

It's worth wait,,,,,good build thread, he's even got cad drawings for his brackets

Thanks Highway star I,ll check that out on the weekend on a better computer
Tell me is there much difference between the 6.four:one and the 6.5:one gears besides two hundred US bucks and three% high range? Numbers below 5 dont work either now
My trans tunnel is a little wider than stock due to a bad engine swap previously.
Nik

NIK wrote: I was going to use the sierra transfer after the vit one so it should still be the same on road?

With a stock 1.3 sierra transfer and a vitara transfer, 4.88 diffs:

@ 100kph = 3407 RPM
Crawl ratio - 78:1
With a 1.0 transfer, your 100kph revs shoot up to 3748 - too high IMHO, but crawl only goes to 83.1

That's a lot of work for two pretty "normal" numbers. Sure, you could drop crawler gears in the vitara range box, but then your crawl goes either 39:1 (useless with a LWB and 33's unless your'e on sand) to 78:1 to 171:1, (equally useless), so you still only really get one low range out of all that work.

With 4.3 gears and a 6:1 you'll be doing 3500 @ 100kph and have 100:1, with no fabrication work at all. I think I know what I'd prefer.

I like your thinking with the 6.4:1 what speed would it be (roughly) at 3500rpm?

100kph - should be sweet.

Steve.

mud4b wrote:

NIK wrote:Im waying up the pros and cons of putting a vit gearbox auto/manual and transfer into a lwb zook with a sierra transer on the end of it.
Will the gearbox fit in the trans tunnel without a bodylift?
How long is the gearbox plus tranfer?
What is the ratio of 5th gear?
What is the ratio of low range?
I know I could just get a s3 rh but then I would have to change diff gears to get road speed and Im not sure about being stuck with ultra low range all the time. I love rock crawling but also like other stuff to.
I already have the vit engine and a spare vit transfer just after a few ideas.
Or could the search nazis tell me where to look as this puter takes a few mins to load each page
Thanks for any positive/negative input
Nik

ok number 1. no it will not fit without a body lift unless you chop the floor.
as for the rest i have no idea sorry. you reverse the sierra gearbox to vit engine adaptor to fit it on though. the flex plate bolts straight on to the sierra crank..

cheers mark

Hi

No1 wrong you can fit the box in without a body lift and very minimal tunnell mods.
Just run the vit box straight into the sierra transfer.(manual box only though)

Thanks steve I know what id rather as well, I was only going to do it if the vit had a better lowrange. No point putting gears in the vit case it would be cheaper and easir just to regear the sierra one. I was watchin a zook drive past today dreaming about how good it would be to d/d mine.
Is there a quality difference between the 6.four and the 6.5 gears? Only three percent difference in high range shouldnt do much for road speed. Any ideas?
Thanks Sam for the info, just looking at ways to get better road speed and better crawl ratio at the same time.
Nik

After doing bothe stlyes of 1600 conversions with Sierra box and With Vitara box the vit box is just so much nicer to drive is worth the little extra effort I think.

SAM

Trailtough do 6.4 gears (?) Trail gear and Calmini do 6.5

I think the trailtough gears are the best option for you as they have the tallest high range @ 1.65. Most other 6.XX gears have shorter high ranges which will have you revving too hard on the highway.


Rockhopper S4 are the "worst" at 1.75

Steve.

Would 3% make much difference to rpm vs $$ savings?
Damn I was looking forward to the bling of 3 sticks
Nik

3% is around 100rpm at cruise, if you don't own the gears yet then IMHO it makes sense to get the best high range for your application.

The end result is more than 3% difference though worst case to best case.

RH S4 - 1.75 high range, 4.3 diffs @ 100kph = 3729 rpm
TT 6.4 - 1.65 High range, 4.3 diffs @ 100kph - 3515 rpm

Steve.

Sam, i asked a question before about this with a few replies and no real answer to my qestion. so are you saying you can run a sierra transfer behind the vitara manual gearbox ( no vit transfer) using a sierra jackshaft or similar? and is your ''minimal tunnel mods'' an impact massager or is it still cutting and welding.( i'm not affrain of work, but i want it to look factory.
jason

Thanks Steve your a wealth of knowledge
I hear what your saying but Im thinking with my wallet, dont want to spend more than I have too $244US is a big difference between the 6.4 and 6.5 cases.
6.5 trail creeeper 20% high 187% low $475US
6.4 trail tough 17% high 181% low $$719US
Both kits come with gaskets bearings etc so for 100-200rpm difference high range the 6.5 looks better??
Nik

mr green wrote:Sam, i asked a question before about this with a few replies and no real answer to my qestion. so are you saying you can run a sierra transfer behind the vitara manual gearbox ( no vit transfer) using a sierra jackshaft or similar? and is your ''minimal tunnel mods'' an impact massager or is it still cutting and welding.( i'm not affrain of work, but i want it to look factory.
jason

Yes you can run the seirra transfer behind the Vitara Manual using a jack shaft similar to standard.
As far as the mods to fit the box if you trim the sides of what is the adapter from the vit box to transfer then there is very little masaging to make it fit no cutting or welding.

Sorry NIK for getting a little sidetracked.

SAM

NIK wrote:Thanks Steve your a wealth of knowledge
I hear what your saying but Im thinking with my wallet, dont want to spend more than I have too $244US is a big difference between the 6.4 and 6.5 cases.
6.5 trail creeeper 20% high 187% low $475US
6.4 trail tough 17% high 181% low $$719US
Both kits come with gaskets bearings etc so for 100-200rpm difference high range the 6.5 looks better??
Nik

I haven't looked so I'm not casting aspersions, but the TT kit comes with genuine replacement suzuki bearings for the intermediate shaft, new gasket kit, new shift sheet and intermediate shaft. Some of the difference in price might be in these parts.

If you are happy with what you get for your money go for it - yes the difference will be about 100rpm, if this is fine then cool - no worries.

Steve.

Mmm lots to think about. At first I though the price differece would be one came with EVERYTHING and the other just had the gears. But both claim to include bearings intermediate shaft gaskets seals..
I will make sure though before I buy.
Thanks for the info Steve
Thanks for your info to Sam I,ll keep it in mind but I,m really after lower low and higher high. I just took the zook to get some gravel and it rides so nice at 3500rpm shame it was only doing about 70km/h though
Nik