Outer Limits 4x4 Board

whats the go with 24v winch motors?? is there a specific motor or do you use an xp 6hp 12v motor and just put 24v through it?? it's for a hi mount.

I reckon you'll get good low-load line speed when you put 24V through a 12V motor, but it won't last long if you stall it - at stall, you'll have 4x the power, which it really won't like.

You can buy 24v or 12v motors. Many of the comp trucks you see in winch challenge events run 24v into a 12v motor, it gives it a lot more go but they are a lot more prone to failure/reliability issues, but the speed/power increase is very good.

My advice, if you're not competing, for reliability and affordability you are better off not going down the path of putting 24v into a 12v motor, if you are competing then seriously consider it, the increase in performance is unreal.

Warn have 24v motors (using 12v solenoids)

Superwinch make a genuine 24v winch. I have one of their 12.5k 24v units on my unimog...

-Scott- wrote:I reckon you'll get good low-load line speed when you put 24V through a 12V motor, but it won't last long if you stall it - at stall, you'll have 4x the power, which it really won't like.

Putting 24V through 12V motors only seems to become a problem when powering out. If you keep powering out over an extended period, they fry. But if you give it a flick and let the navi pick up the slack, then give it another flick etc, they seem to last better.

GQ TROL wrote:

-Scott- wrote:I reckon you'll get good low-load line speed when you put 24V through a 12V motor, but it won't last long if you stall it - at stall, you'll have 4x the power, which it really won't like.

Putting 24V through 12V motors only seems to become a problem when powering out. If you keep powering out over an extended period, they fry. But if you give it a flick and let the navi pick up the slack, then give it another flick etc, they seem to last better.

yes the series wound motors over speed themselves and can burn out due to no induced load. There is a VERY easy fix for this, but most are too dumb to understand or dont like to think out of the box. All you have to do is wire in an extra single solenoid to the OUT set and this uses your spotties as a 'LOAD'. fixed!!! so who cares if your spotties turn on when winching out!!

Some comp people draw 12v of there 24v systems or use there motor battery (12v) for out and others just have a freespool.

LudaCris

1MadEngineer wrote:

GQ TROL wrote:

-Scott- wrote:I reckon you'll get good low-load line speed when you put 24V through a 12V motor, but it won't last long if you stall it - at stall, you'll have 4x the power, which it really won't like.

Putting 24V through 12V motors only seems to become a problem when powering out. If you keep powering out over an extended period, they fry. But if you give it a flick and let the navi pick up the slack, then give it another flick etc, they seem to last better.

yes the series wound motors over speed themselves and can burn out due to no induced load. There is a VERY easy fix for this, but most are too dumb to understand or dont like to think out of the box. All you have to do is wire in an extra single solenoid to the OUT set and this uses your spotties as a 'LOAD'. fixed!!! so who cares if your spotties turn on when winching out!!

are spotties enough load, typically there only 200 watts, which is nothing compared to a winch. Could you run a big resistor?

GQ4.8coilcab wrote:are spotties enough load, typically there only 200 watts, which is nothing compared to a winch. Could you run a big resistor?

Got a 200W resistor?

Are you talking 24v globes fitted to some throw away lights that only come on when you winch out.
from my experience, 24v through a 12v globe=really really bright then pop.

cheers smitty

hammey wrote:Are you talking 24v globes fitted to some throw away lights that only come on when you winch out.
from my experience, 24v through a 12v globe=really really bright then pop.

cheers smitty

good point

1MadEngineer wrote:

GQ TROL wrote:

-Scott- wrote:I reckon you'll get good low-load line speed when you put 24V through a 12V motor, but it won't last long if you stall it - at stall, you'll have 4x the power, which it really won't like.

Putting 24V through 12V motors only seems to become a problem when powering out. If you keep powering out over an extended period, they fry. But if you give it a flick and let the navi pick up the slack, then give it another flick etc, they seem to last better.

yes the series wound motors over speed themselves and can burn out due to no induced load. There is a VERY easy fix for this, but most are too dumb to understand or dont like to think out of the box. All you have to do is wire in an extra single solenoid to the OUT set and this uses your spotties as a 'LOAD'. fixed!!! so who cares if your spotties turn on when winching out!!

Could you please explain, i don't underestand how this works?

STIKA wrote:

1MadEngineer wrote:

GQ TROL wrote:

-Scott- wrote:I reckon you'll get good low-load line speed when you put 24V through a 12V motor, but it won't last long if you stall it - at stall, you'll have 4x the power, which it really won't like.

Putting 24V through 12V motors only seems to become a problem when powering out. If you keep powering out over an extended period, they fry. But if you give it a flick and let the navi pick up the slack, then give it another flick etc, they seem to last better.

yes the series wound motors over speed themselves and can burn out due to no induced load. There is a VERY easy fix for this, but most are too dumb to understand or dont like to think out of the box. All you have to do is wire in an extra single solenoid to the OUT set and this uses your spotties as a 'LOAD'. fixed!!! so who cares if your spotties turn on when winching out!!

Could you please explain, i don't underestand how this works?

series motors tend to run away on themselves, so the extra single "starter type " solenoid is wired in parallel to the OUT side of the winch pack. in an OUT situation this solenoid is energised and the EXCESS power is sent to the spotlights (as these trucks generally have many large lights) if the voltages are different then wire in series or parallel to get the specific load requirement. there are other ways to do this electrically but this always seems the easiest.

1MadEngineer wrote:

STIKA wrote:

1MadEngineer wrote:

GQ TROL wrote:

-Scott- wrote:I reckon you'll get good low-load line speed when you put 24V through a 12V motor, but it won't last long if you stall it - at stall, you'll have 4x the power, which it really won't like.

Putting 24V through 12V motors only seems to become a problem when powering out. If you keep powering out over an extended period, they fry. But if you give it a flick and let the navi pick up the slack, then give it another flick etc, they seem to last better.

yes the series wound motors over speed themselves and can burn out due to no induced load. There is a VERY easy fix for this, but most are too dumb to understand or dont like to think out of the box. All you have to do is wire in an extra single solenoid to the OUT set and this uses your spotties as a 'LOAD'. fixed!!! so who cares if your spotties turn on when winching out!!

Could you please explain, i don't underestand how this works?

series motors tend to run away on themselves, so the extra single "starter type " solenoid is wired in parallel to the OUT side of the winch pack. in an OUT situation this solenoid is energised and the EXCESS power is sent to the spotlights (as these trucks generally have many large lights) if the voltages are different then wire in series or parallel to get the specific load requirement. there are other ways to do this electrically but this always seems the easiest.

I under stand the DCseries motor, thats not a problem.

but i don't understand where/how you are getting the required voltage drop.

i know with my 600 watts of lights you may loose .5 of a volts

when the loads are similar and in series the voltage drop across each load should be ~12vdc. the lights being used in series to winch out reduce the voltage across the motor.

althought the voltage drop is minimal, it is the inrush current that is affected most by the induced extra load. ( i think thats the easiest way to say it). Similar to the old eddycurrent dynos that had a huge bank of lamps to induce load on the output generator, just switch on another bank to get a higher setting.

ausoops wrote:when the loads are similar and in series the voltage drop across each load should be ~12vdc. the lights being used in series to winch out reduce the voltage across the motor.

so what you are saying is that, on a 24volt system (if wiring a solinoid as greg ssudjested if the resistance of the motor is equal to the resistance of the lights you should end up with 12 volts going to the winch motor.

is that right?

STIKA wrote:

ausoops wrote:when the loads are similar and in series the voltage drop across each load should be ~12vdc. the lights being used in series to winch out reduce the voltage across the motor.

so what you are saying is that, on a 24volt system (if wiring a solinoid as greg ssudjested if the resistance of the motor is equal to the resistance of the lights you should end up with 12 volts going to the winch motor.

is that right?

Yes. If the winch motor tries to draw more current through the spotlights then more voltage will be dropped across the spotlights and less is available to the motor - so the motor current is limited.

If the motor stalled you could end up with too much voltage across the spotlights - but how will you stall the motor while spooling out?

-Scott- wrote:

STIKA wrote:

ausoops wrote:when the loads are similar and in series the voltage drop across each load should be ~12vdc. the lights being used in series to winch out reduce the voltage across the motor.

so what you are saying is that, on a 24volt system (if wiring a solinoid as greg ssudjested if the resistance of the motor is equal to the resistance of the lights you should end up with 12 volts going to the winch motor.

is that right?

Yes. If the winch motor tries to draw more current through the spotlights then more voltage will be dropped across the spotlights and less is available to the motor - so the motor current is limited.

If the motor stalled you could end up with too much voltage across the spotlights - but how will you stall the motor while spooling out?

so doing this setup if you blow the globe , you can no longer winch out ...

no this is best done in parallel to the 'out' solenoid of the motor it is just enough induced system load to reduce over-run failures.

but then again why bother!!! it amazes me that i go to comps and still see winch controller wires taped to the bonnet and run into the cab!! Damn how hard is it to wire in a switch and an isolator!!