Outer Limits 4x4 Board

For everyone... What type of tubing do you use on your 4b? Whether it be a rollcage bull bar or full exo. Im wanting to cage my sierra, thinking of medium 32nb, or od bout 41mm i think, as its fairly cheap over 6.5m $41...

if you want it to be to ccda regulation etc, it will have to be made out of DOM(draw over mandral) cold draw steel with A piller hoops out of a minimum of 38mm and main hoop out of 44.5mm(1.3/4").

The best I can get it for is $150 for 7mtrs.

All this should be on the ccda site.

Daniels

my suzy wont be doing any comps, just a regestered dayly driver... i am going to get it engineered also so i will have to do the requirements but.

Not to be a nazi but this has been covered both here and in the zook section a fair few times.

To answer your question, 32nb medium or heavy is the way to go.

ok cool, mite do that thanx. i know i have searched, so many answers

v840 wrote:Not to be a nazi but this has been covered both here and in the zook section a fair few times.

To answer your question, 32nb medium or heavy is the way to go.

I disagree. For an internal cage, which does nothing until it's REALLY needed, I would only recommend DOM. I have used 1 3/4" racetech 350 tube. It's much lighter than "black pipe" or "steam pipe" for the same amount of tube and has much better mechanical properties.

However, for an exo, that's going to take lots of tube and that tube will experience lots of mechanical damage from hitting rocks etc, and will protect the car in a light roll, I think pipe is fine. Its also easier to work with because of the added wall thickness. It's much "softer" than DOM though.

I am making my sorta exo thingy out of steampipe- 32mm OD for the A pillars and roof and 41mm OD for the B pillar bar. I do not expect this cage to protect me in a hard roll, but at the moment I seem to spend a lot of time jamming my cab into the ground and want to prevent totalling the cab.

It's horses for courses, but remember steampipe isn't designed as rollcage material.

Steve.

your refering to steampipe, is that like the exhaust stuff??? 1mm wall? nah i wouldent b using that, medium is 3mm wall i think. i want it to be sorta tough, rub on rocks etc. ive heard about your rollings of gwagensteve. pitty i aint there to see them

No, "steam pipe" is very heavy wall- certainly 3mm or over. It's used in pressure piping. It's very cheap and quite strong. It's what you're talking about. It's adequate for an exo that is designed to take some abuse but will never match the strength/weight of proper roll cage tube. Exhaust tube is exhaust tube.


I've done heaps with DOM but for my rough junk I'm fine with steam pipe.

Steve.

yeah my suzy is a budget backyarder job, but will be made like a workshop build. im a fitter/welder so its easy 4 me to build metal, its my trade

I think you will find the 32 nb medium wall for an exo will work fine. If you dent it its easier to cut that bit out and put a new bit in rather than DOM maybe bending the cage with its extra strenght.

Steampipe is also good for turbo exhaust manifolds.....
Can be bought in bends .

Now back to topic...

nah thats cool, i was thinking of the buying bends bit but i might just buy a cheapo bender

Gwagensteve wrote:
I disagree. For an internal cage, which does nothing until it's REALLY needed, I would only recommend DOM. I have used 1 3/4" racetech 350 tube. It's much lighter than "black pipe" or "steam pipe" for the same amount of tube and has much better mechanical properties.

However, for an exo, that's going to take lots of tube and that tube will experience lots of mechanical damage from hitting rocks etc, and will protect the car in a light roll, I think pipe is fine. Its also easier to work with because of the added wall thickness. It's much "softer" than DOM though.

I am making my sorta exo thingy out of steampipe- 32mm OD for the A pillars and roof and 41mm OD for the B pillar bar. I do not expect this cage to protect me in a hard roll, but at the moment I seem to spend a lot of time jamming my cab into the ground and want to prevent totalling the cab.

It's horses for courses, but remember steampipe isn't designed as rollcage material.

Steve.

Ive made front/rear bars, rollbars, and exo's (not an internal though) out of 32nb all of which have been subjected to big knocks or rollovers and all have held up fine.

Yes, it gets dented and beat up but to me a roll cage, particularly an exo, is like a motorcycle helmet, it gets used, then replaced. Or at least sections do.

I do agree about using DOM for certain applications, but for a weekender that more than likely will never see a hardcore rollover I think it should be sweet. I cant say much about DOM though as Ive never used it. Im aware of its superior qualities to regular seamed tube and its use in competition cages, though I think that its better strength can be overcome via gussetting and bracing on an exo, which is not so easy with an internal.

You mention you're using 41mm OD for your B-pillar, Im pretty sure that that is equivalent to 32nb med anyway. Thanks for the tip on steampipe though, Ive never used it but sounds like it could be good.

here is a pick of my tray that was made with 50nb pipe note that the radius of bends in the rollbar, was as tight as we could get using an oxy and a chinese bender...

we welded some 12mm bar on to the sides of the die, so the edges of the bend wouldn't blow out as much.. took a bit to get the pipe out of the die though.



Also a pic of exo made of 32nb ( i think )

renyolds 531 is what ive been told to use for a internal cage, unlike chromoly 4130 etc it dosent need to be stressed releived. + i cant find any one who sells DOM or The like.

renyolds 531 is what ive been told to use for a internal cage, unlike chromoly 4130 etc it dosent need to be stressed releived. + i cant find any one who sells DOM or The like.

So the cheapo bender looks to be no good for the 50mm.o.d as it has the flats on the outside. looks bit poxy sorry. i like the smooth bends thats also y i wanted to downsize the piping abit so it would hopefully bend better in the Super Cheapo bender

90Mav wrote:here is a pick of my tray that was made with 50nb pipe note that the radius of bends in the rollbar, was as tight as we could get using an oxy and a chinese bender...

we welded some 12mm bar on to the sides of the die, so the edges of the bend wouldn't blow out as much.. took a bit to get the pipe out of the die though.



Also a pic of exo made of 32nb ( i think )

its not the bender thats the problem its the dies. get one from dawn there ozzy made but not cheap
the chinese dies are too shallow and allow the pipe toblow out on the sides causing it to flatten. this will happen with all the sizes thats why you need the flats welded on . you need to to buy a dawn die to do it properly

cheers steve

ah now i get ya, scubasteve22, did you weld pieces as a sidewall on the die? sounds like a sinch, mite put some g clamps to add to stop the flatbar from spreading apart while bending the tube.....mmm good idea and i see now why u have had abit off trouble getting them out, they would fatten out...did you try any type of lube? silicon spray etc? That might of helped alittle

Gwagensteve wrote:
I disagree

yeah but always disagree

mine is 40NB, it was going to be 32, but some fuck head orderd m the wrong size die for my bender...

pics



btw zook stock... if u can get that much pipe that cheep good work!!!
u also need a welder. and stuff to cut it...something to notch it etc etc... nothing is that easy!!!!!

id say a grand for a exo all up!

Twistinchassie wrote:renyolds 531 is what ive been told to use for a internal cage, unlike chromoly 4130 etc it dosent need to be stressed releived. + i cant find any one who sells DOM or The like.

Yet another case of where a "little bit of knowledge is a dangerous thing".
Nothing wrong with Chrome/Moly 4130 if you feel you have the need for it and are prepared to pay the premium price. All sprintcars, supercars, use or used 4130 and none of them are stress relieved.
Supercars have even gone to 15cdv6 Steel tubing which has nearly double the tensile strength of 4130 but it doesn't bend easily so the main hoop and A pillar tubes are 4130 but still only 1.6mm thick the new 15cdv6 Steel is only 1mm thick and used for most of the straight sections.
Major drawback of 15cdv6 Steel is the price is around 3-4 times that of 4130 but the supercar guys can take the weight out of the top area of the car and put their ballast lower to improve balance so they pay the premium.
Regards Andrew.

BlueSuzy wrote:ah now i get ya, scubasteve22, did you weld pieces as a sidewall on the die? sounds like a sinch, mite put some g clamps to add to stop the flatbar from spreading apart while bending the tube.....mmm good idea and i see now why u have had abit off trouble getting them out, they would fatten out...did you try any type of lube? silicon spray etc? That might of helped alittle

x actly
the problem with mav90's job was i didnt weld the flats on well enough and they broke
yeah i tried grease & it helped
i have been successful with my 32nb die which i use more often .
just make sure you fully prep the weld first & fully weld it both sides
and sand it smooth on the inside
the g clamp while a good idea, wont work as it hits the bender
also cut a peice of tube of the same size or bigger about 150 long
and split it down the middle into half nd place them between the pipe
and the roller to stop any dents in the tube

cheers steve

I thought of the g-clamp thing just as i posted it up...yeah it wouldent work and i think i get what you have done with the extra tubing parts on over the rollers so it doesnt crush the piping and mite cover them in grease, Another good idea! Also, i mite make up some sort of solid jig with a 40mm holesaw adapted for a pistol drill for notches i think.

My theory is, stuff around with it till it works, even if it takes days, or weeks....
If its still shat, try a different approach, which normally means buy the thing you need already done.
Lucky i have alot of patience

So:
* Super Cheapo Bender = $150-$170
* Tubing at my $41 6.5m x4 = $164
* Bits and Bobs from work and mates welder to mod dolly and some skill
* Holesaw from work, make jig at work.

So really all up $340 mmmmm tempting