Outer Limits 4x4 Board

So I beleive I need a surge tank and two fuel pumps, seems easy enough so far.

I figure I shouldn't need anymore than 1.5ltr capacity but they are few and far between on ebay, mainly starting at 2ltr. I want a smaller one to put under the tray of my hilux unless for space reasons unless bigger is somehow better.

I am hoping that two VL commodore pumps will be sufficient unless someone can tell me why they wouldn't be.


The main question though is how many fittings should a surge tank have, for my purposes it seems that three is all I need. Pump from petrol tank to surge tank, from surge tank to engine and then a return line to the surge tank so three in total.


Am I missing something as most of the ones I see on ebay have atleast 4 fittings.

I think I remember you asking this before and you have a Hilux?

Whats the matter with getting a V6 4runner tank? Already has an internal EFI pump and inbuilt surge tank and bolts straight into a Hilux chassis with no mods.

v6hilux wrote:I think I remember you asking this before and you have a Hilux?

Whats the matter with getting a V6 4runner tank? Already has an internal EFI pump and inbuilt surge tank and bolts straight into a Hilux chassis with no mods.

My local doesn't have any and they would want about $200 anyway apparently. It seems like a neat way of doing it but I would rather put the longrange tank in that I have available either way. The long range is from a hilux with a 22r though so probably doesn't have the gear in it that you mention. Plus I havent received an answer to that question in that thread.

You also need a return line (right up the top of the surge tank) from the surge tank to the main fuel tank. This is for both returning fuel and venting air.

$200 delivered Aus wide from certain wreckers is about right.

Can you mount you long range tank on the other side an re-rout the exhaust?

I'm not keen to swap tank sides and mess around. The surge tank sounds like a good way to do it with a sealed unit.

Cheers for the advice Chimpy aswell, slapping myself in the forehead atm for not thinking of that

I am now seeing tanks with only 2 barbs on them, it would seem to make sense that by returning to the fuel tank it cuts two hoses out.

Would this be acceptable, I have to wonder how often I would be off camber long enough to use 1.5-2.0ltrs of fuel whilst off camber and with an empty fuel tank.

Im using VL pump and a facet lift pump.
Made the surge tank mysellf.Its square (same size as the chassis).
3x1/4" 1x3/8"fittings and a drain plug in the bottom.
3/8"- feed to VL pump
1/4"- efi return
1/4"- surge return to main
1/4" -main to surge

Also had pressurizing problems in the main tank with the diesel fuel cap.
had to get an unleaded filler neck and cap.(not a hilux though)

Have you considered having the long range tank altered to accept a 100 series in tank pump fitted. No need for external surge tank then,less bits to find room for,less plumbing means less possible leaks.
Just a thought
Dave

dai-hard wrote:Im using VL pump and a facet lift pump.
Made the surge tank mysellf.Its square (same size as the chassis).
3x1/4" 1x3/8"fittings and a drain plug in the bottom.
3/8"- feed to VL pump
1/4"- efi return
1/4"- surge return to main
1/4" -main to surge

Also had pressurizing problems in the main tank with the diesel fuel cap.
had to get an unleaded filler neck and cap.(not a hilux though)

This is the set up you want.

playtime4x4 wrote:Have you considered having the long range tank altered to accept a 100 series in tank pump fitted. No need for external surge tank then,less bits to find room for,less plumbing means less possible leaks.
Just a thought
Dave

This would work but would be more expensive and in the long term if the pump fails would be dificult to find on a Sunday in the middle of nowhere. The VL pump should be available off the shelf in every auto parts shop in Australia.

RUFF wrote:

dai-hard wrote:Im using VL pump and a facet lift pump.
Made the surge tank mysellf.Its square (same size as the chassis).
3x1/4" 1x3/8"fittings and a drain plug in the bottom.
3/8"- feed to VL pump
1/4"- efi return
1/4"- surge return to main
1/4" -main to surge

Also had pressurizing problems in the main tank with the diesel fuel cap.
had to get an unleaded filler neck and cap.(not a hilux though)

This is the set up you want.

Looks like I have a plan now

I have to ask though, a lift pump.... Is this dropped into my fuel tank or is just a fancy name for an inline pump?

I only ask because I figure the old diesel tank gravity fed to the injector pump so actually getting a flow from the tank outlet to an inline pump shouldn't be a problem???

high n mighty wrote:Looks like I have a plan now

I have to ask though, a lift pump.... Is this dropped into my fuel tank or is just a fancy name for an inline pump?

I only ask because I figure the old diesel tank gravity fed to the injector pump so actually getting a flow from the tank outlet to an inline pump shouldn't be a problem???

An external Low pressure lift pump will work fine.

http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Electric-Fuel-Pu ... dZViewItem

high n mighty wrote:http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Electric-Fuel-Pu ... dZViewItem

Perfect.

Thankyou Tony, I just bought it. Guessing make a very similar tank to what Dai-hard has mentioned and a VL pump= me styling

Thats the one.
Noisy little buggers though you sure know when youre runnin out of fuel

I am having a hell of a noise problem with mine at the moment. It is a facet lift pump feeding straight into a Walbro pump for an EFI windsor. It makes a hell of a noise. Is it just that facet pumps are noisy or am I pulling too much fuel thru to the High pressure? I am not running a surge tank on mine.

They are a noisy pump. I usually rubber mount them so they at least dont vibrate as bad then.

Common sense would tell me that the two pumps are fighting each other.


I am not normally one you would call on for common sense though

Mines not too bad until it starts to run dry. might try the rubber mount.
I blow a fuse to my lift pump when i 1st got mine going drove around for a coupla days without the lift pump running.My VL pump is in the engine bay and it didnt have much fuel in it and never surged or give any probs.
So you might not need a surge tank

cheers craig.

High n mighty
Ive fitted a couple of v6s to "other vehicles" one being a 88 narava. The Narava all ready had a intank low pressure high volume fuel pump. I then fitted the external high pressure c/dore pump but had issues that the external pump was running dry as the internal tank pump couldnt keep up with the external pump. I remounted the external pump as low as possible and eliminated to internal pump, problem solved. To recap 88 narava no internal tank pump, no surge tank, one external c/dore high pressure pump, one return line from injector fuel rail to fuel tank. The converson was done 18 months ago 20000km.

ive also had efi on a hilux with no surge tank or lift pump. And had no problems with it. Just had the Commodore pump mounted on the chassie rail. Its not allways neccissary but it is a better set up to run a surge tank.

The V6 in my Lux isnt running a surge tank.
I have just got a Long range fuel tank running into a VL pump.
Never had any dramas. I think the LR tanks have pretty good baffling inside and stop any fuel starvation.
When I truggify my Lux and fit a fuel cell it will be getting a lift pump and surge tank though.

So now I am looking at running a VL pump only?


That would still keep me pretty happy if it is as doable as it sounds

If youre just using the VL pump try to use 3/8 fuel hose from the tank to the pump.

dai-hard wrote:If youre just using the VL pump try to use 3/8 fuel hose from the tank to the pump.

I was running a 22R with EFI and just used an adapter from the Toyota fuel hose out of the tank to the VL Pump. Only ever had an issue on one climb in a local arera but it was a climb only a few have made in the past.

This is sounding better again, especially for the initial stage of running and shake down etc

high n mighty wrote:This is sounding better again, especially for the initial stage of running and shake down etc

It will work. But as i said you are better off running a surge tank. In the long run it will save you money as without one you risk running the pump dry and the VL pumps dont cope with this very well.