Outer Limits 4x4 Board

You take a navara transfer case which has a left hand drop and fit it to a moon buggy with a commodore v6 and auto, 60's landcruiser diffs. easy


do you need to flip the diffs?


second question, if you were to use a 350, 2 speedglide and GQ transfer and make the motor run backward would you need to flip the diffs?


Yes i have way to much time on my hands.

NICK

NICK wrote:You take a navara transfer case which has a left hand drop and fit it to a moon buggy with a commodore v6 and auto, 60's landcruiser diffs. easy


do you need to flip the diffs?

Front, I would say yes. Rear, I don't know.

Nick wrote: second question, if you were to use a 350, 2 speedglide and GQ transfer and make the motor run backward would you need to flip the diffs?

No. But I don't know if the speedglide & transfer would like to run backwards.

Front, I would say yes. Rear, I don't know.

how could you flip one and not the other, this would drive the 2 diffs toward each other.

as for the glide and transfer. the transfer would be no different to driving a normal truck in reverse for a period of time, however i cant get my head around the auto drawing the fluid through the pump ruther than pumping it. i think it would close the valve body off and cause the converter to flair.


NICK

NICK wrote:You take a navara transfer case which has a left hand drop and fit it to a moon buggy with a commodore v6 and auto, 60's landcruiser diffs. easy


do you need to flip the diffs?


second question, if you were to use a 350, 2 speedglide and GQ transfer and make the motor run backward would you need to flip the diffs?


Yes i have way to much time on my hands.

NICK

You need to flip diffs in both situations.

Now that you have too much time on your hands...

Pen and paper or work this out in your head.

draw pic of diffs and their direction being forward

draw pic of motor to t/case in standard position... now turn it around...

diff direction is now backwards because the transfer case is now rotating in the wrong direction giving a reverse drive to the diffs... flipping the diffs around reverses the drive back again to forward.

Hope that helps..

NICK wrote:You take a navara transfer case which has a left hand drop and fit it to a moon buggy with a commodore v6 and auto, 60's landcruiser diffs. easy


do you need to flip the diffs?


second question, if you were to use a 350, 2 speedglide and GQ transfer and make the motor run backward would you need to flip the diffs?


Yes i have way to much time on my hands.

NICK

The first one yes you will still need to flip the diffs. And move the pumpkin over on the front to suit the LH drop.

The second one if we are still talking a moon buggy then no you would not need to flip the diffs as long as it was also possible to get the auto to run backwards. Ive never seen that done though. The motor is a simple mod to run it backwards though as its done in a lot of inboard boats.

RUFF wrote: The first one yes you will still need to flip the diffs. And move the pumpkin over on the front to suit the LH drop.

if you turn the gearbox around the out put is now on the RH side matching the 60s diffs before flipping them, this is how i got confussed with the rotation of the drive shafts or the flippin of the diffs.

NICK

NICK wrote:

RUFF wrote: The first one yes you will still need to flip the diffs. And move the pumpkin over on the front to suit the LH drop.

if you turn the gearbox around the out put is now on the RH side matching the 60s diffs before flipping them, this is how i got confussed with the rotation of the drive shafts or the flippin of the diffs.

NICK

Correct but you would then have 4 reverse gears and one forward if you dont flip the diffs

NICK wrote: second question, if you were to use a 350, 2 speedglide and GQ transfer and make the motor run backward would you need to flip the diffs?

NICK

In theory maybe.. but in practise its almost impossible.
The engine would need custom oil pump, water pump, camshaft and distributor. The powerglide is another drama. The pump won't work if spun backwards, neither will the torque converter.
If you did somehow manage to get it going backwards the transfer wouldn't like it much as the bearings and shafts are set up to take the load (primarily) in one direction only.

mount motor and gearbox backwards ???

water pump at back and transfer at front ??

as above - getting a auto or petrol motor to run backwards is NOT easy...

BrettInUte wrote:mount motor and gearbox backwards ???

water pump at back and transfer at front ??

as above - getting a auto or petrol motor to run backwards is NOT easy...

The Evolution Warthog that was a TTC07 Alternate this year ran the motor in the back, into a powerglide, then a marine V-drive to send drive forward to a Stak 3 speed transfer.

$$$

want33s wrote:

NICK wrote: second question, if you were to use a 350, 2 speedglide and GQ transfer and make the motor run backward would you need to flip the diffs?

NICK

In theory maybe.. but in practise its almost impossible.
The engine would need custom oil pump, water pump, camshaft and distributor.

Its a simple marinising kit. As i said its common in boats. Very common.

BrettInUte wrote:as above - getting a auto or petrol motor to run backwards is NOT easy...

And as i stated above the motor is a simple fix. The Auto may not be.

RUFF wrote:

want33s wrote:

NICK wrote: second question, if you were to use a 350, 2 speedglide and GQ transfer and make the motor run backward would you need to flip the diffs?

NICK

In theory maybe.. but in practise its almost impossible.
The engine would need custom oil pump, water pump, camshaft and distributor.

Its a simple marinising kit. As i said its common in boats. Very common.

Sorry for the hijack but, why is it common in boats?
Something about countering the torque in twin engine setups or something?

RUFF wrote:

want33s wrote:

NICK wrote: second question, if you were to use a 350, 2 speedglide and GQ transfer and make the motor run backward would you need to flip the diffs?

NICK

In theory maybe.. but in practise its almost impossible.
The engine would need custom oil pump, water pump, camshaft and distributor.

Its a simple marinising kit. As i said its common in boats. Very common.

Marinising makes the engine run backassed how?

Left and right hand rotation chev's are common in boats, PCM mercruiser etc, mainly for twin enigine setups

wosat wrote:

RUFF wrote:

want33s wrote:

NICK wrote: second question, if you were to use a 350, 2 speedglide and GQ transfer and make the motor run backward would you need to flip the diffs?

NICK

In theory maybe.. but in practise its almost impossible.
The engine would need custom oil pump, water pump, camshaft and distributor.

Its a simple marinising kit. As i said its common in boats. Very common.

Sorry for the hijack but, why is it common in boats?
Something about countering the torque in twin engine setups or something?

Ahh, to put it simply, Yup

RUFF wrote: Its a simple marinising kit. As i said its common in boats. Very common.

How simple is simple for the uneducated ?

And yes this is a serious question

Nick

CWBYUP wrote:

RUFF wrote: Its a simple marinising kit. As i said its common in boats. Very common.

How simple is simple for the uneducated ?

And yes this is a serious question

Nick

Camshaft,oil pump,distributor,water pump and starter motor. I prob shouldnt have called it a marinising kit either as that is the common term for a way of cooling an inboard engine as most use sea water to cool rather than a radiator. Commonly they suck the water in and blow it back out the exhausts. I prob should have called it a counter rotation kit. Which as someone said above is used a lot in twin inboard engine applications.

Never seen a counter clockwise ENGINE kit as suggested. ONLY ever seen reverse rotation legs.
http://www.diversified-marine.biz/catal ... rts/dt6396
Not just Mercury(Mercruiser) but most manufacturers make a reverse rotation leg for twin engine setups ..EG: Shark cats

want33s wrote:
Never seen a counter clockwise ENGINE kit as suggested. ONLY ever seen reverse rotation legs.
http://www.diversified-marine.biz/catal ... rts/dt6396
Not just Mercury(Mercruiser) but most manufacturers make a reverse rotation leg for twin engine setups ..EG: Shark cats

Sorry i just made it all up

But i guess who ever wrote this was talking out their ass as well-
http://www.boatpartsinfo.com/engine-rotation.html

"Due to the higher production costs and the advent of fuel injected gasoline engines bristling with computer modules and sensors, engine manufacturers discontinued reverse rotation engines in most cases. Since then, engine outputs have been handled by reduction gears capable of reversing engine output rotation. Both engines are standard left hand rotation but the reverse reduction gear changes the starboard engine output to right hand rotation. This is a much simpler, less expensive way to handle the need for opposite rotating engines. "

SOURCE:
http://www.boatpartsinfo.com/engine-rotation.html
That would explain why I've never come across it.
Its a discontinued practise in smaller boats especially petrol engined inboards.
PS. Why would you say you must be 'talking out your ass' because I've never come across it?

want33s wrote:"Due to the higher production costs and the advent of fuel injected gasoline engines bristling with computer modules and sensors, engine manufacturers discontinued reverse rotation engines in most cases. Since then, engine outputs have been handled by reduction gears capable of reversing engine output rotation. Both engines are standard left hand rotation but the reverse reduction gear changes the starboard engine output to right hand rotation. This is a much simpler, less expensive way to handle the need for opposite rotating engines. "

SOURCE:
http://www.boatpartsinfo.com/engine-rotation.html

Your point is?

want33s wrote:"Due to the higher production costs and the advent of fuel injected gasoline engines bristling with computer modules and sensors, engine manufacturers discontinued reverse rotation engines in most cases. Since then, engine outputs have been handled by reduction gears capable of reversing engine output rotation. Both engines are standard left hand rotation but the reverse reduction gear changes the starboard engine output to right hand rotation. This is a much simpler, less expensive way to handle the need for opposite rotating engines. "

SOURCE:
http://www.boatpartsinfo.com/engine-rotation.html
That would explain why I've never come across it.
Its a discontinued practise in smaller boats especially petrol engined inboards.
PS. Why would you say you must be 'talking out your ass' because I've never come across it?

Go and order a new crate 350 from PCM, Mercruiser and all the others and when they ask if you'd like a counter rotating motor, tell them they're idiots

http://www.pcmengines.com/NewFiles/EX-3 ... 0Sheet.PDF

You want LH or RH rotation with

cloughy wrote:Go and order a new crate 350 from PCM, Mercruiser and all the others and when they ask if you'd like a counter rotating motor, tell them they're idiots

PCM website says LH or RH PROP rotation with the output through a 1:1 transmission. NO mention of reverse rotation engine.
This is getting off topic and I may very well be wrong but I can't find anything to say the engines run backwards.
http://www.pcmengines.com/NewFiles/Pro% ... 0Sheet.PDF

want33s wrote:

cloughy wrote:Go and order a new crate 350 from PCM, Mercruiser and all the others and when they ask if you'd like a counter rotating motor, tell them they're idiots

PCM website says LH or RH PROP rotation with the output through a 1:1 transmission. NO mention of reverse rotation engine.
This is getting off topic and I may very well be wrong but I can't find anything to say the engines run backwards.
http://www.pcmengines.com/NewFiles/Pro% ... 0Sheet.PDF

Shame I dont have the engine manual from a workmates brand new skicraft senator

Give me a bit, will look on this nerd box.....just to prove you wrong again ......Ruff's link already does this

That's the best thing about forums...
Everyone is entitled to their opinion...
PM sent.
PM also received...

cloughy wrote: Yea missed the prop rotation bit, not crank

To all

bwaaaahhaaahahaaa

Is there any reason why you couldn't flip the rear diff as per standard practise, and rotate upsidedown the front third member, but leave the housing as is so the drop suits the Navara transfer? Surely this would be easier than flipping the front and then moving the diff again.

Slunnie wrote:Is there any reason why you couldn't flip the rear diff as per standard practise, and rotate upsidedown the front third member, but leave the housing as is so the drop suits the Navara transfer? Surely this would be easier than flipping the front and then moving the diff again.

Yes, its only the diff centre that needs to be flipped, whether you flip the centre only or the whole diff housing is irrelevant, as long as the diff centre is upside down to its normal position it will work in a rear engine set up.

-Richo- wrote:

Slunnie wrote:Is there any reason why you couldn't flip the rear diff as per standard practise, and rotate upsidedown the front third member, but leave the housing as is so the drop suits the Navara transfer? Surely this would be easier than flipping the front and then moving the diff again.

Yes, its only the diff centre that needs to be flipped, whether you flip the centre only or the whole diff housing is irrelevant, as long as the diff centre is upside down to its normal position it will work in a rear engine set up.

have to flip the front cover of the diff housing too, or mightaswell cut it off and weld on a stronger cover for it anyway