Outer Limits 4x4 Board

Trying to get a price on buying un-used oil to possibly run in my diesel Rocky, out of the 3 oils above, does it matter which you use? Veg oil is veg oil right? And if one day I try and use waste oil, does it matter if its not veg oil? ie, animal fat?

So this is your new scam ey Nath

Damn straight

Paid $1.71/L for diesel Wednesday

I found a supplier that can deliver a 1000L pallecon (?) to my door. I can choose from the above 3 blends, and am waiting to hear back on price.\


Knowing my luck though, if I bought 1000L of veg oil the price of crude would plummet and diesel would drop back under $1/L

RockyF75 wrote:Damn straight

Paid $1.71/L for diesel Wednesday

I found a supplier that can deliver a 1000L pallecon (?) to my door. I can choose from the above 3 blends, and am waiting to hear back on price.\


Knowing my luck though, if I bought 1000L of veg oil the price of crude would plummet and diesel would drop back under $1/L

What is the cost per ltr

Don't forget to pay your excise per litre to lil' Kevvy Rudd

longlux wrote:
What is the cost per ltr

Don't know yet, waiting to hear back. I'm not getting my hopes up, last place inquired it was just over $2/L. But that was in 20L drums, so not really bulk.

HotFourOk wrote:Don't forget to pay your excise per litre to lil' Kevvy Rudd

No worries, anytime he wants to come over here and collect, I'll be more than happy to give him whats owing to him

You'll need to convert the engine so you can run it first.

HotFourOk wrote:Don't forget to pay your excise per litre to lil' Kevvy Rudd

You pay excise on biodiesel but not straight vege oil....

zagan wrote:You'll need to convert the engine so you can run it first.

false, in theory

Choice of oil might depend on which one smells best. I got a mate who runs his diesel tojo on old fish & chip shop oil - every time he starts his ute, the whole yard smells of fish & chips. See which one you like the smell of best - if you buy 2000 litres and it stinks, you're buggered.

Also, look in the supermarkets and find which one has the most energy (kilojoules) per litre. If its the same price, then you're getting more energy for your money - more power or economy.

I think all he does to his oil is filter it, so the bits of batter don't clog his fuel filters - I don't think any engine conversion is needed.

Easy to try - just fill a 1 liter can, join it up to your filter intake, bleed it, and see if it runs. That way, if it doesn't, you don't have to empty the whole tank. Maybe try a 30/70 oil/diesel mix first. If that works, make it a bit stronger and try it again.

PS - if you've got a really nice motor, and don't want to risk buggering it, maybe try all this on a mates old banger first - get him really pissed and make him think it was all his idea, and there's no comebacks either.

Mike.

I've heard people change the type of fuel filter and they run thicker fuel lines due to its harder to pick up?

in terms of running different lines, its because the older rubber lines would perish with the bio running thru it.
filters? you will clog up the first couple with all the gunk that will get flushed out running bio fuels, so prehaps its just that he went thru a cpl quickly? or anticipated it and ran a bigger filter to avoid the first cpl of changes

RED60 wrote:

HotFourOk wrote:Don't forget to pay your excise per litre to lil' Kevvy Rudd

You pay excise on biodiesel but not straight vege oil....

But... aren't you meant to pay an excise on whatever fuel is running your car?

At the end of the day, is it legal to run vege oil? I thought it wasn't.

HotFourOk wrote:

RED60 wrote:

HotFourOk wrote:Don't forget to pay your excise per litre to lil' Kevvy Rudd

You pay excise on biodiesel but not straight vege oil....

But... aren't you meant to pay an excise on whatever fuel is running your car?

At the end of the day, is it legal to run vege oil? I thought it wasn't.

so is avgas but you see all the ricers running that

send a PM to pongo, he knows whats the go with this sorta stuff

I was thinking about this the other day.

Do the vehicles run as well on the oil as they do on diesel?

I was wondering if the thicker viscosity of the oil effected its ability to spray evenly through the injectors? as this would effect how well it burns.

also anyone know the difference in energy between the oil and the diesel? as not only does the price per liter matter but also the fuel ecconomy you get with the oil.

very interesting idea, with the number of k's i do i could easily buy it at 1000 liter lots?

RockyF75 wrote:Knowing my luck though, if I bought 1000L of veg oil the price of crude would plummet and diesel would drop back under $1/L

it will never in this lifetime get below $1.50ltr for diesel again.
Wait for the addition of some bullchit "Carbon Credit" tax or whatever it is of 20cpl to go on too...

Cant fukin wait.

RockyF75 wrote:But that was in 20L drums, so not really bulk.

so... for 20ltrs of oil, do you get 20ltrs of fuel to use in your truck? or is it you only get 10ltrs. ?? if so, seems lot of work for the effort unless you can do the 1000ltrs gig.

bogged wrote:so... for 20ltrs of oil, do you get 20ltrs of fuel to use in your truck? or is it you only get 10ltrs. ?? if so, seems lot of work for the effort unless you can do the 1000ltrs gig.

In theory you can pour it straight in and away you go.

In terms of how much energy you get, according to http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_yield2.html the calorific value (ie energy) in diesel is 38.3 megajoules/litre, for canola oil it's 36.9 megajoules/litre. So if the canola oil is 6% cheaper than the diesel then you are breaking even in terms of cost per kilometre. That's leaving issues of tuning out of it.

There is heaps of info out there on this. I would have thought that the ideal compression ratios could be a little different and this would affect the overall economy with canola oil vs diesel. But there are people out there who will be able to answer that one for sure.

I would be willing to give it a go in an old diesel rig, especially at a 20:80 mix or something. I would try it with a smaller amount first.

anyone know how high the ratio can go? casue if your only substituting 20% then any saving has to be divided by 5, which means its not worth the stuffing around and having to buy 1000L at a time...

bogged wrote:

RockyF75 wrote:But that was in 20L drums, so not really bulk.

so... for 20ltrs of oil, do you get 20ltrs of fuel to use in your truck? or is it you only get 10ltrs. ?? if so, seems lot of work for the effort unless you can do the 1000ltrs gig.

I think he is going to run the pure vege oil (whether straight or a mix of oil/diesel, rather than convert the oil to Biodiesel, which is I think what you meant.

HotFourOk wrote:I think he is going to run the pure vege oil (whether straight or a mix of oil/diesel, rather than convert the oil to Biodiesel, which is I think what you meant.

ah ok, answers a lot

thehanko wrote:anyone know how high the ratio can go? casue if your only substituting 20% then any saving has to be divided by 5, which means its not worth the stuffing around and having to buy 1000L at a time...

this is what Im wondering.
I've used the pump bio from Ouyen once, no issues..

The bio you get at the pump is only about 10% oil, i think. Rest is mixed in with dino diesel or some crap.

Ideally i want to run straight veg oil, but of course that depends on a few things like will it gell up on me in winter, will it clog my injectors, etc. This aint something I'll just do overnight. But atm, wanted to know if there's any real difference in the oils, so I can get a price. In the end I just asked them for the price of each of the three. Guess I'll find out on Monday.


I've got an old diesel engine, just need to pull out the bellhousing and starter off another wreck I've got, and I'll let that run for a bit on straight oil to see what happens. But as mentioned, lots of people have done it, even some off this board. Can't be too bad for the engine but I'm paranoid, cause my current engine is grouse

If I have to PAY for the oil, then its really not worth the hassle running a 50/50 or leaner mix of oil/diesel. If/when I can get a reliable source of free, used oil, and a means to filter it reasonably quickly, then I'll prolly run 50/50 just for the ease of not having to pre-heat the oil.

There is heaps of info on the net about this. If you wish to run straight veg oil you _may_ need to add a fuel heater into your system to ensure the viscosity is OK for your injector pump & injectors. If looking at using used oil you will need to peform some processing to ensure reliability. The upside is you'll never need to buy soap again

I found the journettoforever website one of THE best on the web. It has info on SVO, WVO etc. There are companies OS that sell bolt in kits so that you can run straight vegetable oil (SVO).

- You probably should run a fuel heater to keep the viscosity in order

- You will most likely have to replace the rubber sections of fuel line in your car, as the veggie oil will eat it.

- Buy a 24 pack of fuel filters, the SVO/WVO will give your fuel system a serious clean out.

Stick it to the man. Save the icebergs.

Coxy

I have run 50/50 WVO/diesel in my surf I didn't notice any difference to starting or running.

Had a friend who used 2 tanks started on diesel got the engine to running temp then switched to WVO then back to diesel about 3 km before shutting down.

He did a lot of Km's & never had any problems.

I was getting into it till someone swiped my source of WVO.

When you find out what its worth at 1000L per buy let us know so we can look at it too.

if a couple of people live close they might even be able to split a 1000L buy to make it easier.

very curious about this whole idea.

thehanko wrote:anyone know how high the ratio can go? casue if your only substituting 20% then any saving has to be divided by 5, which means its not worth the stuffing around and having to buy 1000L at a time...

I meant 80:20 the other way, mostly veg oil.

But I dunno.

sounds more worth while.

As far as running SVO(straight veg oil) these sites are good for info-

http://www.frybrid.com/test.htm

http://www.greasecar.com/forum.cfm

A bit of clever engineering can be done to make these systems work.
Also the veg oil not only should be filtered but also dewatered which is done by boiling the water content out of it.

what would the shelf life of these "oils" be. is any one in particular better/longer lasting then another?

PAUL