Outer Limits 4x4 Board

G'day guys,

While I've got the engine and auto out for the conversion I was thinking of getting my auto worked slightly to get a more positive shift through the gears. The auto is a cable operated A41 aisin-warner out of a AE71 corolla running behind a 20v 4AGE 1.6.

Am i going to suffer with really harsh gear changes even with a mild kit?

Is it a matter of suck it and see?

Should I just wheel it stock and then see if I need the kit?

dank wrote:Should I just wheel it stock and then see if I need the kit?

It's a Zook, the transmission won't be hard to pull out after a few drives if it needs a freshen up.

Is there even a shift kit available for this Auto?

Try a trimatic shift kit
Not sure about 4speeds but 3speeds are a GM Trimatic core with Zook housing

--Fool Injected

RUFF wrote:Is there even a shift kit available for this Auto?

not off the shelf as such. transtyle in hallam said they can up the pump pressures and muck around with valving. The bloke there said its possible they've done some similar work on the same auto in the past.

I might leave it as it is and throw in a b&m shifter if i can source one at a decent price.

If anyone knows of any other good auto specialists in the south east let me know.

dank wrote:If anyone knows of any other good auto specialists in the south east let me know.

K. B. Automatic Specialist
31 Enterprise Avenue , Berwick, 3806
Telephone: 9707 3864
Fax: 9796 1149

or Rodney at Wholesale automatics.

just be careful round the dande area, theres some real shit auto "specialists"...

Are you sure you want a B&M? I've not been impressed with road car shifters for off road work.

If you really want a bling shifter well suited to off road, you want a Winters or Art-Carr shifter, but they don't really want to sit on the tunnel of a sierra.

Steve.

I done this on a Trimatic (TH180) in my old VB Commy
Takes the slush out of the changes (soild shift), hammers the rest of the drive train though
Extra washers on the pump ups the pressure too

Mousie wrote:Try a trimatic shift kit
Not sure about 4speeds but 3speeds are a GM Trimatic core with Zook housing

--Fool Injected

Actually they are a Trimatic with a Zook bell housing and extension housing. They are still a Trimatic case.

And we are talking about a Toyota A41 Aisin-Warner not a zook Auto. These are verey similar in design internaly to the Borg Warner 35 Autos. Toyota coppied the design as they did with the early Toyo Glide from the Power Glide.

dank wrote:

RUFF wrote:Is there even a shift kit available for this Auto?

not off the shelf as such. transtyle in hallam said they can up the pump pressures and muck around with valving. The bloke there said its possible they've done some similar work on the same auto in the past.

This is what i expected as i had never heard of a "shift Kit" for this auto.

Gwagensteve wrote:Are you sure you want a B&M? I've not been impressed with road car shifters for off road work.

If you really want a bling shifter well suited to off road, you want a Winters or Art-Carr shifter, but they don't really want to sit on the tunnel of a sierra.

Steve.

Cheers for the replies guys. I think i'm gonna run it stock and see how it goes. I bought the auto for the fact that its easier on the drivetrain.

Steve why have you not been impressed with B&M? If you could elaborate that would be great. Also what makes a shifter well suited to offroad?

Apart from the bling factor I want a really positive shift feel. The standard shifter I have at the moment floats around alot and isnt very positive.

When your in low range you,ll find the lower gearing excentuates the firmness of the shift anyway , so give it ago stock .

The lower the gearing the more so.

jmo

B&M and most "go fast" shifters aren't really designed for off road use, and feel a bit, well, cheap and wobbly for my liking.

Avoid anything with a ratchet or double action reverse lockout - you don't ant anything t hat makes it slower to gear down from say 3 to 1, or into reverse. Unfortunately, most of the better quality street shifters also have these annoying (or dangerous) features and aren't well suited to a off road environment as a result.

I was a rockcrawling event a while ago and a car there had a B&M pro ratchet or something. It was pretty funny, every time he wanted to move in a different direction, there was a lot of staring at the shifter and furious slapping and banging to get it from, say, 1 to R. It was pretty funny to watch.

I like stock shifters with a detent mod. I weld a tab on to the N position that means the detent button has to be pushed to get from D to N (so you can't knock it out of gear accidentally, or fly through to N when changing 2-3) This also means you need the button in to get out of R (same reason) but once you're in N, you can "flick" either way (to R or D) without the button.

Steve.

This seems like a good compromise...detent style with a rachet option...also comes in right hand drive model for AUssies.



The B&M StarShifter is one versatile three speed shifter - wrapped up in a clean, timelessly styled package! In the normal mode the StarShifter is a straight line detent shifter. When the lever is in Low, lift the trigger all the way and pull the stick back to convert to ratchet action. Move the stick forward for the 1-2 and 2-3 shifts.

Till it gets dust and mud in it and goes all rattly and floppy and the ratchety thing starts jamming etcetcetc

Also, try and go for reverse in that really quick (especially if the ratchet is engaged) - you have to fully extend your fingers, wrap them onto the little T handle and pull up and then try and hit R without flying though to N and 1/2 way to park while the cars standing in it's tail or your starting to slide backwards and freaking out...

In a street car - fine. In an offroad car? Pointless bling IMHO. It won't work any better than a modded stock shifter. Ratcheting is 100% worse than useless on an off road car - they are ONLY designed to work for the dragstrip. any time you have to change down from, say, 3-2, on the move, they suck badly, and the mechanism is failure prone once it's been in an offroad environment.

The art carr/winters shifter is 100% the "right" shifter for an offroad car, they were designed for that application. (trucks and off highway vehicles) Not easy to fit though.



I know the art carr wiggly gate works because it's pretty much exactly what I have in the G wagen - factory stock.

Steve.

Thanks for your opinion Steve.

Just going by the pics it does look a fair bit stronger than the B&M

What are the problems with fitting that you talk about? It looks like a relatively easy adaptor plate made up for the tranny tunnel would do the job?

The big problem is they're all rear cable exit and that'll put the cable right over the low range shifter. I don't know if it's possible to flip the whole thing around and turn it into a front cable exit "push" system rather than a rear cable "pull" system (and flip the legend to suit) but that's the cause of the fitment issue on a sierra.

We spent a long time trying to work this out on Greg's car and with an overall length of 14" from front edge to rear of cable guide is wasn't going to work, so he's running a stock Jimny linkage shifter.

If it was flipped it might work, but for a $400 shifter, there's going to be a lot of stuffing around with lever ratios, cable mounts, throw distance etcetcetc.

I want one though :sad:

Steve.

should have looked closer at the picture and I would have picked that up. sounds like too much hard work. Might just have to use the one I got with the auto and build a housing for it. I might have a look around the wreckers for something more suitable as the tabs are REALLY soft on the shifter I have. I reckon I would break them if I was in a rush to change gears...