Outer Limits 4x4 Board

G'day,

i've got tough dog 2" raised coils and shocks on my LWB vitara, and at low speed the rear end is stiff as.

To those who know more about suspension set ups then i do, would this be caused by the springs alone, or would the shocks be the culprit ?

and if it is the shocks, what would be a better fit Old Man Emu ?

will be a combo of springs, shocks and tyre pressure. make sure your running what the factory specifies on the tyre placard and go from there. if it has the foam cell shocks you will find these to be a lot stiffer than gas shocks. like i said check your pressures first. and don't forget if its only bad on rough dirt roads than you should be airing your tyres down.

I agree. Its probably a combination.

Although I have no personal experience with Tough Dog stuff, I have used King Springs HD springs in the past, and I need to carry around my 70kg lawn roller to make the rear suspension work.

So, when I did my lift, I got "standard ride" springs made up (by Aldo), which, because they are lifted, it has to accomodate the sag suffered by it simply being a longer spring. They were manufactured using 1mm greater diameter steel. This gives me a great ride, whilst still supporting the lift.

I use RS9000 "5-speed" shocks, and I always use the softest setting. If I turn them up, its way too hard to drive on the road, and I need a kidney belt.

Again, I'm afraid I have no experience with tough dogs, but it sounded as if they may be "heavy duty" springs and possibly gas shocks, whereas if you want some rear suspension (particularly in SWB's), you need not have either.

The Vitara Bible has a couple of posts where the shocks, etc are discussed, and gas is discouraged over oil, but I'm afraid I'm not sure of the actual threads.

Who makes the RS9000, and how much do they cost ?

i have a feeling that the shocks may very well be the problem

tough dog and rancho share the same foam cell technology, i would be looking at a good quality nitrogen gas shock.

well actually, the tough dog shocks that i have are gas already

The Rancho RS9000's I'm using were in a mate's TJ originally, and that may be part of the reason why they're hard unless I have them turned right down.

Having said that, it may also just refer to the mounting hardware that was included in the kit that makes them suitable for the TJ, and Rancho RS9000's are RS9000's.

Someone with a bit more experience with them may be able to shed some light on that aspect of them for you.

bugden23 wrote:well actually, the tough dog shocks that i have are gas already

ahhh....you have the 'little' ones. companies like that are not renowned for thier valving technology. alot of the times its 'one valving suits all' policy. the reason for this is it costs alot of money to have engineers try various combos until they get it right with the spring combo. go around and hand try some other gas shocks and you will find there is only 2 or 3 that a valved for the zook.

cheers thanks,

if anyone knows which ones are valved properly it'd help me out heaps

OME...

Steve.

Gwagensteve wrote:OME...

Steve.

X2

very happy with mine even with "heavy" OME springs.

Goes even better when fully loaded or towing

I"m leaning towards the adjustables as it gives me the best of both worlds.

I don't know if they make them for the front struts though

any ideas ?

what both worlds?

well, by coincidence theres an article in the new 4wd action that came out this week on the rancho shocks

with these aparently you can control the stiffness from soft to hard depending on what ur driving on, what ur carrying

won't make a difference if the valving aint right in the first place. ring rancho up and ask if they are valved for a zook....i know the answer i got....

for sure,

i don't claim to be an expert.

i've been reading up on them though, and aparently they adjust by lowering and increasing how much oil can pass through (valves) in escense allowing you to control the valving through 9 different settings hard to soft

don't take my word for it ofcourse this is just my understanding, just food for thought

Go and do some resaerch on valving. It works in both directions and then go and talk to Rancho again and ask them some more questions about what their adjustability is altering By the way just because something is adjustable and works on some vehicles it may not be of any use on a light vehicle if it must always be run on the softest setting. Don't get caught up in the bling.

Just my thinking aswell,

have sent of requests for that kind of information already

I've put the adjustable 9000s into my LWB vit, but made up new top brackets to lean the shock back at about 30 deg. Works great. Number 3 setting now like number 1 was. Just loose a bit of travel.

bugden23 wrote:Just my thinking aswell,

have sent of requests for that kind of information already

Good luck. The stock line is "Rancho valving is proprietary information and won't be released. These shocks have 800% adjustability so you can set them to work in your application"

No you can't.

You might be able to, but you can't check for sure without dynoing a shock, which the Rancho distributor then won't accept back if it won't work. "you dyno it, you own it"

I've been there, spent the money on the dyno, and found that the "recommended" fitment for my G wagen was unusable on the front and about 15% too soft for the rear even on the stiffest setting.

The thing is, shock valving doesn't depend on use anywhere near as much as the spring rate you need to control. If you aren't changing the springs, you don't need to change the valving.

I bought RS9000's and I used to play with the adjustment offroad. I bought into the hype and thought my car was better to drive with the shocks softer while offroad. Really, I was wrong. I was mostly making the car less predictable and less drivable and more floppy.

a 99009 should, based on my experience and dyno results, work quite well on the rear of a vitara with bumpstop spacing. whether you use the adjustment or not is up to you, but only one setting will actually work properly. More than one click either way will be so wrong it's not funny.

The adjustment is so coarse it's ridiculous.

PS Petah from oz - laying your shocks back 30˚ will increase wheel travel if you've got the top mount in the right place.

Steve.

joeblow wrote:what both worlds?

Joe has hit the nail on the head.

Having had Rancho shocks on 4 cars now, i can only think of once that i adjusted the damn things.

I can also think of 4 cars that i've ripped the adjuster knobs off while out wheeling. OME Shocks represent very good value for money, they should match up with your 2" lift height, weather they'll match up with your brand/rate of coils however i do not know.

All of the vehicles we build here at work now run Koni shocks, valved for the vehicles we sell and the weights they're set up to carry. There was however a significant amount of homework put into the set up.

OME is the sensible option for you.

petah from oz wrote:I've put the adjustable 9000s into my LWB vit, but made up new top brackets to lean the shock back at about 30 deg. Works great. Number 3 setting now like number 1 was. Just loose a bit of travel.

Do you have any pics of the top bracket setup?

Has anyone had experience with Rancho 5000 series?

I'm looking at the possibility of suing 5236s with a 2" lift, but really have no idea about the valving. Are there others in the 5000 series that are more suitable to the rear of a vitara?

I just brought a vitara with 4" off suspension lift and i giesse it's a mix up off springs and shocks but the shock's are munroe..... The suspension is very nice flex's up nice on dirt roads is like my comodore on the roads!

Off road is way nicer to drive then my old sierra!

Will have a look who the springs are made by tomorow for ya!

suzuki boy wrote:I just brought a vitara with 4" off suspension lift and i giesse it's a mix up off springs and shocks but the shock's are munroe..... The suspension is very nice flex's up nice on dirt roads is like my comodore on the roads!

Off road is way nicer to drive then my old sierra!

Will have a look who the springs are made by tomorow for ya!

4" you have to post up pics of that...........

my 3" is like driving a go kart

ONly got it from QLD on thursday but yeah headed out on the weekend and it was awsome!

Got some pick's will wack em up!