Outer Limits 4x4 Board

Have an issue with my auto that was fully re-built 1 year ago.
The box was fully upgraded with extra clutch plates, up rated pump for more pressure and flow and a new (later to fid out it's a reco unit) torque convertor.

The torque convertor is cracked now and the box has been leaking oil. It is getting changed over under warrenty, but they are now saying that they can't garantee thatit wont happen again.

The only thing they can do it modify it from a 4 bolt connection to an 8 bolt connection at an extra charge to me.

Has any one had similar issues?
What are your thoughts?

then why didnt they do that in the first place?


Give Rodney a call.
or Dave
K.B. Automatic Transmissions
31 Enterprise Ave,
Berwick, VIC 3806
p: (03) 9707 3864

bogged wrote:then why didnt they do that in the first place?


Give Rodney a call.
or Dave
K.B. Automatic Transmissions
31 Enterprise Ave,
Berwick, VIC 3806
p: (03) 9707 3864

Precisely, why didn't they.
I was very specific that I wanted the box fully re-done and upgraded to handle any increase in HP and for towing. A year later I'm without my car for another 2 weeks.

GUJohnno wrote:

bogged wrote:then why didnt they do that in the first place?


Give Rodney a call.
or Dave
K.B. Automatic Transmissions
31 Enterprise Ave,
Berwick, VIC 3806
p: (03) 9707 3864

Precisely, why didn't they.
I was very specific that I wanted the box fully re-done and upgraded to handle any increase in HP and for towing. A year later I'm without my car for another 2 weeks.

Better than 7 mths, and then gettin it back still rooted.. Quality.....

Sounds like they don't know what they are doing!
I had my auto upgraded a couple of years ago to similar spec to what you have described. ie more clutchs, increased pressure etc. The other thing that was done was to put extra weld on the spline. Aparently that is the weak point.
Anyway with that done mine was fine and you could say I abused it. ie for comp work off the line I would put foot hard on brake, floor the gas pedal and before the wheels moved I would have 2000rpm and 14psi boost. It ran to 21psi and was used alot. Not a DD but was used several times a week.
The same auto with different torque convertor is now behind my current motor and is handling the 280rwkw. I do now have one of Rodney's valve bodies though.
And in both cases it is still only a 4 bolt conection. From my research the weakness is the spline tearing out not the conection to the flex plate.

It does have one of Rodneys valvue bodies in it.

The whole problem with my box started a year ago when I got it serviced and they fiddled with the valve body. All I wanted was an oil change.
From then on it drove like sh1t and wouldn't lock up.
I ended up adding a manual lock up switch to it to over come this. The auto place then advised me wrongly on the use of the lock up switch which made the toque convertor go stuffing the whole box.

Who reco'd your box nzdarin?

GUJohnno wrote:It does have one of Rodneys valvue bodies in it.?

No it doesnt.
The young expert there told me they were "shit" and it was the first thing they threw in the bin..
I'd be asking the question.

When they did the re-build they modified it to their up-graded GU spec, what ever that is...

bogged wrote:

GUJohnno wrote:It does have one of Rodneys valvue bodies in it.?

No it doesnt.
The young expert there told me they were "shit" and it was the first thing they threw in the bin..
I'd be asking the question.

I gather the young expert is Paul?

So your saying they threw my valve body in the bin and replaced it with theirs?

Nice of them to discuss this with me first.

GUJohnno wrote:Have an issue with my auto that was fully re-built 1 year ago.
The box was fully upgraded with extra clutch plates, up rated pump for more pressure and flow and a new (later to fid out it's a reco unit) torque convertor.

The torque convertor is cracked now and the box has been leaking oil. It is getting changed over under warrenty, but they are now saying that they can't garantee thatit wont happen again.

The only thing they can do it modify it from a 4 bolt connection to an 8 bolt connection at an extra charge to me.

Has any one had similar issues?
Are these guys trying to rip me off?
What are your thoughts?

90% of convertors fitted are reco when you say cracked where about's around the throat,weld,pillars etc? convertors do not usually have problems for no reason...dowls not missing from back of engine block that align trans up?

They said there are 4 bolts that the TC bolts to...? whatever and it is under one of these bolts that the crack has appeared.

The company doing the TC cannot guarantee that this wont happen again and say the only way to do it properly is to modify it to an 8 bolt pattern.

if hes talkign about the 4 bolts which attach the convertor to the driveplate hes a moron.

i know of 3 1000hp fords and holdens both NA and turbo (extra torque) and they all run standard 4 bolt drive plates.

i think you should quickly find yourself a new auto shop.... they suck by the sounds of it and i dont know much about autos.

i would be getting them to rebuild another convertor under warranty and fitting it to the vehicle and see how it goes this is not a common problem but could happen as the pillars are ony fusion welded to the cover.

Johnno, would Rodneys at Wholesale Auto's kiln bronzed and modified low speed stall convertors be a solution? I know he talks about using them in V8 conversions but maybe they'll do the job you want.
http://www.automatictransmission.com.au ... wsId=24346
Regards Andrew.

They are rebuilding a TC under warranty and are going halves with this modification.
I have also requested for them to change the stall speed to allow the turbo to spool up better.

Wish I had taken it to Rodney at Wholesale Autos from the start

GUJohnno wrote:Wish I had taken it to Rodney at Wholesale Autos from the start

Oh how I can relate to that... x 219487293487298374928734928734957687866342343557674528734982734982734982734982734982734987234987239482739482374982374982374ty..

bogged wrote:

GUJohnno wrote:Wish I had taken it to Rodney at Wholesale Autos from the start

Oh how I can relate to that... x 219487293487298374928734928734957687866342343557674528734982734982734982734982734982734987234987239482739482374982374982374ty..

+1

Yeah I have to agree about Rodney! The manual valve body I'm using is great. 280rwkw and it doesn't get hot at all! I use the rev limiter as a shift point when racing without any hesitation. I've only had it together for 12 months but I've never seen the trans fluid temp over 90*C. Yes I have 2 oil coolers on it but still. I have a different torque convertor as the VH uses the same trans as a TD just with different bellhousing and torque convertor.
With my experience with GQ auto's I can't see any need to upgrade the torque convertor beyond welding the spline in better. I've always run standard stall speed and with the TD I would do most offroad in high range (untill getting manual shift that is).

All my trans work has been done by Advanced Automatics in Whangarei (NZ), except for the fitting of Rodney's valve body as they told me to just do it myself. ie really easy to take one out on put the other in.
My tow wagon is a 96 GQ TD42T auto and that has done quite a few k's with trailer and my comp truck one. All that this has had done is a shift kit and a big cooler.

GUJohnno wrote:They are rebuilding a TC under warranty and are going halves with this modification.
I have also requested for them to change the stall speed to allow the turbo to spool up better.

Wish I had taken it to Rodney at Wholesale Autos from the start

increasing stall speed is not a good idea on a patrol.
you need to decrease it if anything

Jes

jessie928 wrote:

GUJohnno wrote:They are rebuilding a TC under warranty and are going halves with this modification.
I have also requested for them to change the stall speed to allow the turbo to spool up better.

Wish I had taken it to Rodney at Wholesale Autos from the start

increasing stall speed is not a good idea on a patrol.
you need to decrease it if anything

Jes

And your reasoning on this?

Both Andy at Diesel Tec and Rodney at Wholesale Auto both agreed this will make a great difference.

GUJohnno wrote:

jessie928 wrote:

GUJohnno wrote:They are rebuilding a TC under warranty and are going halves with this modification.
I have also requested for them to change the stall speed to allow the turbo to spool up better.

Wish I had taken it to Rodney at Wholesale Autos from the start

increasing stall speed is not a good idea on a patrol.
you need to decrease it if anything

Jes

And your reasoning on this?

Both Andy at Diesel Tec and Rodney at Wholesale Auto both agreed this will make a great difference.

reasoning is
increased stall speed
= more heat
= less engine breaking
= you will probably be below stall speed when doing normal driving, SO increasing heat and making fuel economy worse during normal driving conditions.

depending on your gearing, you may even be below stall speed when you are on d freeway.

yes you will get more boost when you hit teh stall speed, but you will have jack all under it.

jes

But if the stall speed is too low then the engine will not get on boost and won't be performing at it's optimin level. Revs don't equal fuel in a deisel so getting the engine to a speed that it is working more efficiently is going to equal less fuel. So if increasing the stall speed achieves this then performance and economy should increase.
If you were talking a standard TD42 then the stall speed is correct and increasing it would be wrong but with anything modified then factory is going to be wrong.
Anyway I'd spend my money if Andy and Rodney agree.

nzdarin wrote:But if the stall speed is too low then the engine will not get on boost and won't be performing at it's optimin level. Revs don't equal fuel in a deisel so getting the engine to a speed that it is working more efficiently is going to equal less fuel. So if increasing the stall speed achieves this then performance and economy should increase.
If you were talking a standard TD42 then the stall speed is correct and increasing it would be wrong but with anything modified then factory is going to be wrong.
Anyway I'd spend my money if Andy and Rodney agree.

i seriously doubt that increasing the stall speed thus increasing the boost at 2000rpm ( and not having any boost power at all below the stall speed) will be better than having torque already on tap at 1500 ans some boost by 2000rpm.

the thing is a turboed diesel engine is not decompressed, so they are not flat off boost by any means.

anyhow.....

cheers,
Jes

Well i'll soon find out.

"Should" be ready tonight.

GUJohnno wrote:Well i'll soon find out.

"Should" be ready tonight.

Make that tomorrow night now...

GUJohnno wrote:

GUJohnno wrote:Well i'll soon find out.

"Should" be ready tonight.

Make that tomorrow night now...

GEE, never heard this story before.

a good video for any one trying to understand a convertor

http://www.allisontransmission.com/inte ... egion=asia

Well have had the car back for a bit now and it's been driving great.
The mods seem to be working well with how I have the turbo set up now.

This weekend we went to pick up our new camper trailer and on the way up there the auto kicked out of lock up and wouldn't go back in causing the auto to heat up

This is a problem that I had last year after XXX serviced it and played around with the settings
To fix this problem last year I fitted up a lock up switch as XXX could work out how to fix it. How ever XXX gave the wrong advice on how to use it and the end result was the torque converter blew up and a full re-build of the auto.

Now just one week out from our trip to the Flinders I have a rebuilt auto that wont lock up making it virtually impossible to tow the new camper trailer

I'm just a little un happy with XXX

2 words
5 Speed gearbox

Well thats kinds 3 but hay you get my point

GUJohnno wrote:Well have had the car back for a bit now and it's been driving great.
The mods seem to be working well with how I have the turbo set up now.

This weekend we went to pick up our new camper trailer and on the way up there the auto kicked out of lock up and wouldn't go back in causing i the auto to heat up

This is a problem that I had last year after XXX serviced it and played around with the settings
To fix this problem last year I fitted up a lock up switch as XXX could work out how to fix it. How ever XXX gave the wrong advice on how to use it and the end result was the torque converter blew up and a full re-build of the auto.

Now just one week out from our trip to the Flinders I have a rebuilt auto that wont lock up making it virtually impossible to tow the new camper trailer

I'm just a little un happy with XXX

i feel your pain bro..
but, sorry to say you should not have modified the origional converter, converter mods and your asking for trouble.

an auto in a patrol ( even without lockup) would not heat up so badly with a camper trailer enough to blow the box( especially a new one)

i used to tow around my 21" fibgreglass sports cruiser with a 4.2 petrol auto and i never has overheating problems ever, and i did not have an extra external cooler either.

the patrol box in standard guise, in good condition is a robust box. they are good for over 200,000k'ms of punishmet when looked after properly.

Jes