Outer Limits 4x4 Board

What are peoples opinions on removing coils and running air bags all round?

todsmods wrote:What are peoples opinions on removing coils and running air bags all round?

Go to the Rover section and ask peoples' opinions on removing air bags and running coils all round.

-Scott- wrote:

todsmods wrote:What are peoples opinions on removing coils and running air bags all round?

Go to the Rover section and ask peoples' opinions on removing air bags and running coils all round.

Haha. Id say most of the people that do that (going from airbags to coils) are doing it because of the stupidly expensive parts that wear out on the Rangies and the relatively cheap cost of new coil springs and conversion kit.

I think the only plus would be to dump the ride height to get into car parks. That and the bling factor.

Supposedly the ride is heaps smoother.

I have been thinking about fitting them to my GQ ute. For the main reason that the tray is going to be almost useless high. So yes to dump it on the bumps stops when parked.
Also being able to drop the ride height on the HWY would be nice.

The bit I would like to know. Is how do you set the spring rate? As I wouldnt want a floaty ride that you get with soft coils.

Sorry for the hijack.

There was a good thread on Airbag susp ages ago. But I cant find it.

http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/search.ph ... 8&start=60
http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/ftopic115 ... ght=airbag
http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/ftopic103 ... ght=airbag
http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/ftopic649 ... ght=airbag
http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/ftopic429 ... ght=airbag (Wooders posted in this thread)

turps wrote:The bit I would like to know. Is how do you set the spring rate?

As I understand it, the effective spring rate is determined by the shape of the central bit that the airbag "rolls" up and down along.

I have had airbags in front and rear now for over 3 years. The ride is really great, way better than my EMU coils I had previously. I ride a lot harder and faster with the bags, they just even the bad bits out better. The bags have a very low natural frequency so don't need a heavy shock for washboard roads. Spring rate is changed by swapping out the cone or piston. You can change the shape yourself, but the shapes available form Firestone and Goodyear should be fine. On the GQ the mod was real easy. The back is almost a bolt on. I think I drilled just 2 holes in the top mount and that was it. The front needed the sping cones removed and a flat disc put in, but not difficult.
If you don't want ridiculous flex in the back (14" per side) the the Goodyear bags can be used front and rear. Otherwise a Firestone in the back, but expensive.

todsmods wrote:What are peoples opinions on removing coils and running air bags all round?

on what vehicle? For what purpose?

I recently fitted a set of Firestone to the rear of my GU and have no regrets.

While the ride is better I had to re install the sway bar, when cornering tight sections the rear tended to push and caused too much roll. Since re fitting the bar it has controlled it better and am happy with it. I recently returned from Flinders Ranges and they performed well over what corrugations there where.

The only problem I have is the height constantly changing for un loaded, trailer on.... I have in cab controls to fit which will allow me to adjust at any time.

Couple of flex pics

grimbo wrote:

todsmods wrote:What are peoples opinions on removing coils and running air bags all round?

on what vehicle? For what purpose?

gee, your hard to please

People who change from airbags to coils in rangies just don't know where to get their parts from ( here is a hint - it's not from LR or dunlop) And all parts in most air suspension can be rebuilt rather than replaced, and you can buy kits to do it.

Freakazoid wrote:Spring rate is changed by swapping out the cone or piston. You can change the shape yourself, but the shapes available form Firestone and Goodyear should be fine.

SO it would be possible to have a certain spring rate at say 4" above std as at std height or slightly lower?

Also interesting to hear that a soft shock works better. I was thinking a stiffer/harder setting would have worked better.

turps wrote:

Freakazoid wrote:Spring rate is changed by swapping out the cone or piston. You can change the shape yourself, but the shapes available form Firestone and Goodyear should be fine.

SO it would be possible to have a certain spring rate at say 4" above std as at std height or slightly lower?

Also interesting to hear that a soft shock works better. I was thinking a stiffer/harder setting would have worked better.

Are you trying to suggest a dual rate air spring such as this:
http://www.arnottindustries.com/part_LA ... id298.html

Variable spring rate replacement springs for rangies. Extended height for off-road is soft but road height is stiffer.

stuee wrote:

turps wrote:

Freakazoid wrote:Spring rate is changed by swapping out the cone or piston. You can change the shape yourself, but the shapes available form Firestone and Goodyear should be fine.

SO it would be possible to have a certain spring rate at say 4" above std as at std height or slightly lower?

Also interesting to hear that a soft shock works better. I was thinking a stiffer/harder setting would have worked better.

Are you trying to suggest a dual rate air spring such as this:
http://www.arnottindustries.com/part_LA ... id298.html

Variable spring rate replacement springs for rangies. Extended height for off-road is soft but road height is stiffer.

I was more thinking of having the same spring rate at 4" as at 0" lift. So 300what evers at 4" lift and 300what evers at std ride height (cant remember what spring rate is measured in).
But that way could work also.

give Hobbzee
a ring he sell a lot off them and he had them all round in his comp GU so he will steer you in the right way
steve

On corrugation the softer shock works as well as slow stuff, but I think the bigger stuff at speed will still require a harder shock. I'd still go for a harder shock, my Rancho Pro's are set at max and they work really well. But at high speed over bigger stuff I can still feel that the shock could be stiffer. When crawling over rocks and stuff you'll hardly notice even if you take the shock out completely.

Sooty, you can reduce the roll a lot by changing the piston shape you have. Those pistons tend to almost make you roll. In your flex pic you'll see that the extended end is on the big diameter and the compressed end on the small dimater of the piston. When you look at the graph you'll see that these 2 positions have the same spring force. So there is nothong preventing the roll. I had these same pisotns on the front og my GQ and they caused a lot of roll. I changed to a straighter piston that just flares out at the bottom and it made a big difference. Your bag supplier should be OK with you swopping and trying other piston shapes.

Turps, have a look at the spec sheets for the different airbags, You'll see the spring rates from their and that you can play with them quite a bit. I settled on something that stays fairly constant till you start bottoming out.