Outer Limits 4x4 Board

the vehicle in qu. 2001 soft top series II with 4 spd auto, and G13BB, V8 trans cooler.

now, i know they engine swap isn't new, has been done heaps, lots of write ups, done the search thing, read the posts etc.

my qu. is, will the block (G16B) bolt to the auto (ex G13BB), will there be any issues with flex plate or torque converter, or crank, or even computer (trans)??

have posted same qu. on jimny.se

will.

no, you'll need a 1.6 vitara to 1.3 sierra conversion plate. Should work fine then.

not sure about flexplate but I think it should be a straight swap.

as for trans - the G13BB uses a separate TCC so if you pick the right wires out of the G16 computer it might talk to the G13BB TCC.

It's all a bit of unknown territory though.

Jimny's have a fairly long jackshaft and a roomy trans tunnel though from memory - I think if it was me, I'd be using the AW-4 out of the donor GV with a tailshaft adapter plate. easy to make, a lot better (stronger) auto, and no issues with computers etc.

You'd probably get the auto for nearly nothing attached to a GV 1.6 and it would be a much better conversion IMHO.

Steve.

Have a look at this thread. Lots of info on installing G16 with Jimny injection (inta a Sierra). Some of it will apply to you.

http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/phpBB2/ftopic156229.php

I'm pretty sure the Grand Vitara motor your talking about has a very similar looking inlet manifold to the Jimny, and may well plug straight into your Jimny loom.
If not you could just keep the Jimny injection and intake manifold and install the G16 block and head.

PM me if you need an adaptor kit.


Ben

good responses, good info.

now, in return to aw4 g'box, is it likely the stock jimny auto can handle 25% power increase, and 30% more torque??

it's a tiny auto, other than over-heating, is it a good box??

will.

y0di wrote:good responses, good info.

now, in return to aw4 g'box, is it likely the stock jimny auto can handle 25% power increase, and 30% more torque??

it's a tiny auto, other than over-heating, is it a good box??

will.

The jimny box is made by Aisin-Warner and is acutually designed for 660cc Kei cars- it's the same box used in the 660cc Kei Jimny. It's designated as a "low torque" box by AW.

The torque output of the 660 jimny is basically exactly the same as the G13BB jimny, and it would be wise to assume that that's basically the torque limit for the box. Boxes can be run beyond their torque limit, but you're on a slippery slope of durability then.

The word from Rod at wholesale autos is that the box might cope with a 1.6.... but might not, however, here's the catch - there's no upgrade parts, no expertise, ano other applications for this box, and as a result, parts are all ex suzuki, and therefore far from cheap. THe source of cores is also a problem as there's no other application, so you can't pull a core from a burnt out jeep, hilux, commodore or whatever for rebuilding.

It might be possible to up the line pressure a bit, run synth fluid etc, but if you have the room to fit it, the AW-4 is going to be a miles better option as it can happily cope with over 300Nm, so it's going to last forever behind a 1.6. There's also miles more expertise getting these trans to work and last.

Unfortunately, getting an AW-4 into a SWB sierra is a fairly big hassle.

Steve.

steve, you're a wealth of info, thanks.

qu.

if i get a G16B long motor, put the jimny manifolds and ancillaries on it, run stock harness etc, and run the matching AW4 box, will i need the vitara trans control module? or can the jimny one be adapted/ or is same?

as per above, i'd need an adaptor for the rear of the trans, and a new jack shaft? is this correct?

have the AW4's been slotted into jimny's before, is there sufficient room in the tunnel without mods?

is the jimny transfer up to the job of the vitara power and torque increase?

thanks, will.

What Steve said.

I spent some time investigating various engine and auto combinations and a bit of time with Rod at Wholesale Automatics (who does know his stuff) discussing what could be done with the Jimny auto. They desperately need a decent trans cooler no matter what. In a street application or light offroad it "should" cope with a 1.6 but as I want to alter the gearing substantially and use it harder than it was ever intended for, it was felt that it would be seriously pushing the limits of its design parameters. There were some possibilities of playing with it internally BUT it would be experimental with all the risks that entails. As there is only one source for these I ended up deciding not to risk my $$$. If you killed it though you could always swap in a manual in the meantime.

The AW4 on the other hand can cope all day long but there is more mucking around fitting it under a Sierra or Jimny. There is another auto option that I have entertained that is about as light and small as you can get with overdrive and in a manual (non-electronic) format and that is a ZF BUT there would be $$$ and time involved to adapt it

You'd want the Vit trans control due to the shift and lock/unlock points. You could always use something like the AWshifting(?) kit to manually control it.

Personally, if you were going to all this trouble you'd ditch the Jimny transfer and swap in a Sierra to give you more gearing options.

Yes, use a G16B block and swap the Jimny gear onto it including the head if you want to as they are the same.

Yeah, sorry for stealing your thunder there cj

As an aside, the setup CJ was discussing was with a 660, with far less off idle torque than a 1.6- because of the turbo, everything is turning by the time torque (boost) comes in. The ability for the 1.6 to lug the auto in too high a gear would add to the problem of heat buildup.

I've driven an AW-4 offroad with transfer gears in a vitara (thanks, cj) and it was a very nice box.

I've set up a trimatic behind a 1.6 eFI and although it has it's limitations ( no overdrive) it has a nice big loose converter that makes the car really nice to drive offroad.

I haven't driven the Jimny auto'ed car I was involved with offroad for more than a few metres, but it does have a much smaller converter and while that's good for efficiency, it's not quite as sweet to modulate as the lazy trimatic.

Steve.

As Steve said I was looking at using the Jimny auto behind the K6A with some mods (same Factory auto) and I also looked at using the Jimny auto behind the G13BB and G16B with some mods. The G16B in particular was going to be pushing the limits and the G13BB with the same mods wasn't going to be that far behind. The modded K6A was also going to be right up there and although it is doable and may well work, in the end I didn't want to risk it. With the long, steep climbs available here in Vic and the gearing and lockers, load etc. that I'd be running with it I felt it could be too easy to kill it. Your application may be different and it may be fine but that is a decision you will need to make.

the vit auto is actually a pretty nice fit in a jimny.

Thought it would be.

Steve.

anyone selling an AW4

greg wrote:anyone selling an LWB

Edited for you

Steve.

Gwagensteve wrote:

greg wrote:anyone selling an LWB

Edited for you

Steve.

buy a hilux already

greg wrote: buy a jimny already

Steve.

'Cause he really needs another build

At least as badly as you do

Steve.

Pad

well, that begs the question, what are my intentions for the jimny.....

either towing heavy loads, long distances, highway speeds, to camp sites,

or just a heavy load (not towed), long distances at highway speed, to camp sites.

4wd is important to me, but i'm not rock crawling, mud plugging, hill climbs etc.

mainly just dirt roads, corrugations, and sand, and "no" i don't want a subaru or crv. my jimny is zook no.6, i love em.

essentially, it is a daily drive, bitumen only, with a once a year camp 9 hours nw of me. but regularily tow my trailer at 100 kph (struggling).

will.

Sounds like you need more car.

Trying to use a light duty car for heavy duty work is always a recipe for frustration.

Just my 2C.

Even a GV might be enough to do the job.

Steve.

re putting jimny head onto G16B block?

same heads?? then why swap them over??

wouldn't you leave a long motor intact, not disturbing any gaskets not needing to be disturbed?

does it raise the compression? are sensors in different places? does the loom fit better? is it to do with the cam sensor? are the ports better??

i'm curious why i'd change heads over.........ahhh do the manifolds not interchange??

will.

the jimny replaced a 92 LWB vitara, 1.6 efi, 4 spd auto, 2" lift, 7" rims, 215/75 tyres.

that car was great, loved it. mum has it now, she loves it too. i had it for 3 years, never had a problem with it, auto was brilliant in it.

we took it from adelaide, fully loaded car, towing over-loaded trailer to brisbane.

then later from brisbane to townsville, with same load. sat on 100 kph easily, even upto 140 at one point, still easy with more in reserve. still getting 10 lt/100k.

sometimes think i should have kept it.

will.