Outer Limits 4x4 Board

As the 80 series longfields are the longer spline versions (1994+) and the Aisin hubs are shorter requiring a new groove in the Longfield CV also a bit of a trim off the end to get them to fit. I was wondering if later model DX part time 80 series run the longer CV's as well? If so won't the Aisins off them fit straight onto the Longfield CV with no modifications needed?

I found that there are 2 size Aisin hubs, but I am still not sure if they are going to work.

The longer Aisins are part numbers:

FHT-005 43530-35012
FHT-006 43530-35020

These are 62.5mm long, anyone know what model cruiser they come off?

You can run the long c/v and aisin by putting one circlip behind the normal circlip...it all fits under the cap no trim

dow50r wrote:You can run the long c/v and aisin by putting one circlip behind the normal circlip...it all fits under the cap no trim

No it doesnt, there is 8mm of play in the CV. If the circlip was 8mm thick ok, but it then hits the inside of the locking section of the hub. It still needs to be cut down and a new groove cut. I can see no way around it. Unless you know something I dont?

g35me wrote:

dow50r wrote:You can run the long c/v and aisin by putting one circlip behind the normal circlip...it all fits under the cap no trim

No it doesnt, there is 8mm of play in the CV. If the circlip was 8mm thick ok, but it then hits the inside of the locking section of the hub. It still needs to be cut down and a new groove cut. I can see no way around it. Unless you know something I dont?

Good idea to buy the longfeild hub gears also or drive flanges cause if your standard free wheeling hub let go and it will, then destroys the spline on your long they wont cover it under waranty. just a something to think about.

HIGH ROLLER wrote:

g35me wrote:

dow50r wrote:You can run the long c/v and aisin by putting one circlip behind the normal circlip...it all fits under the cap no trim

No it doesnt, there is 8mm of play in the CV. If the circlip was 8mm thick ok, but it then hits the inside of the locking section of the hub. It still needs to be cut down and a new groove cut. I can see no way around it. Unless you know something I dont?

Good idea to buy the longfeild hub gears also or drive flanges cause if your standard free wheeling hub let go and it will, then destroys the spline on your long they wont cover it under waranty. just a something to think about.

I have the longfield hub gears.

g35me wrote:

HIGH ROLLER wrote:

g35me wrote:

dow50r wrote:You can run the long c/v and aisin by putting one circlip behind the normal circlip...it all fits under the cap no trim

No it doesnt, there is 8mm of play in the CV. If the circlip was 8mm thick ok, but it then hits the inside of the locking section of the hub. It still needs to be cut down and a new groove cut. I can see no way around it. Unless you know something I dont?

Good idea to buy the longfeild hub gears also or drive flanges cause if your standard free wheeling hub let go and it will, then destroys the spline on your long they wont cover it under waranty. just a something to think about.

I have the longfield hub gears.

your laughing then.

did you try ringing bobby long and asking him?
or if you know there is 8mm of play then exchange those hubs for the ones you need?

DIRTY ROCK STAR wrote:did you try ringing bobby long and asking him?
or if you know there is 8mm of play then exchange those hubs for the ones you need?

In the states they only got full time petrol trucks hence the longs only being listed in the longer size (no free wheel hubs fiited)

perhaps bobby could do a custom set
or if enough demand he may make them in the 2 lengths for us people in other countries with part time trucks

i also want a set of short longfeilds for part time aisins in an 80 i was going to trim the end off then cut a new groove this would perhaps void any chance of warrenty though

The warranty is still covered with regrooving and shortening. This is what I am getting done tomorrow.

marks addapters do a part time kit for the latter model with the longer cv

http://www.marks4wd.com/products/part-t ... PT4WD.html

rob

75 cruser wrote:marks addapters do a part time kit for the latter model with the longer cv

http://www.marks4wd.com/products/part-t ... PT4WD.html

rob

Yep but the marks adapters kit comes with AVM hubs which are crap, also longfields dont warrant their CV's on a part time kit unless it is fitted with Aisin hubs and their custom hub gear. Which is odd as their CV's dont work with Aisins hubs as per my first post.

I ran mine for ages with one circlip behind the std one, by the time the cap is installed, the c/v has at most 1mm movement in and out. Best to do what you have thou....
Andrew

Everyones input is great but I still dont know the answer to my original question of if the 1994 + model 80 series part timers have different length Asin Hubs.

Just to clarify a few things for anyone else looking into this:

The AVM hubs in the Marks adapters kit have a bad reputation (When you are running large tyres, from what I hear)

Longfields dont warrant their axles and CV's with any other part time free wheeling hub except the original Toyota Aisin hub WITH their modified hub gear installed.

AVM hubs in the Marks kit come with an 8mm spacer so they fit on the newer 1994+ CV's however the Aisin hub is shallower than the AVM hub and even if the spacer from Marks Adapters is fitted the end of the CV will hit the inside of the free wheeling hub and you wont even be able to get the cap on to do the bolts up.

AVM hubs do not fit the Longfield hub gears.

2 possible solutions are 1. make a spacer of 8mm behind the free wheeling hub, basically a big ring that goes over the studs and has room for the two locating dowels bringing everything 8mm closer so their will be no free play in the CV/Axle and the end cap of the Aisin hub will fit on. or 2. Take the CV off and get a new groove cut 8mm closer to the bell for the split ring stops the CV from moving then take 8mm off the end of the CV to allow the hub on.

I think solution 2 is better than 1 as I believe 1 will put to much stress on the already stupidly small Toyota studs.

dow50r wrote:I ran mine for ages with one circlip behind the std one, by the time the cap is installed, the c/v has at most 1mm movement in and out. Best to do what you have thou....
Andrew

I cant see there only being 1mm of movement even with a circlip behind the original. The circlip is at best 2mm thick still leaving lateral movement of 6mm which means that your locking hub will be constantly bashed from the inside by your CV as it slides in and out. I can fit it all on if I push the CV/Axle into the diff as far as it can go however its going smash the crap out of the hub. Our setups must be different I think.

g35me wrote:Everyones input is great but I still dont know the answer to my original question of if the 1994 + model 80 series part timers have different length Asin Hubs.

Just to clarify a few things for anyone else looking into this:

The AVM hubs in the Marks adapters kit have a bad reputation (When you are running large tyres, from what I hear)

Longfields dont warrant their axles and CV's with any other part time free wheeling hub except the original Toyota Aisin hub WITH their modified hub gear installed.

AVM hubs in the Marks kit come with an 8mm spacer so they fit on the newer 1994+ CV's however the Aisin hub is shallower than the AVM hub and even if the spacer from Marks Adapters is fitted the end of the CV will hit the inside of the free wheeling hub and you wont even be able to get the cap on to do the bolts up.

AVM hubs do not fit the Longfield hub gears.

2 possible solutions are 1. make a spacer of 8mm behind the free wheeling hub, basically a big ring that goes over the studs and has room for the two locating dowels bringing everything 8mm closer so their will be no free play in the CV/Axle and the end cap of the Aisin hub will fit on. or 2. Take the CV off and get a new groove cut 8mm closer to the bell for the split ring stops the CV from moving then take 8mm off the end of the CV to allow the hub on.

I think solution 2 is better than 1 as I believe 1 will put to much stress on the already stupidly small Toyota studs.

All the part time 80s cruisers run the shorter cv 1990-1997

A freind of mine ran 8mm spacers and this weakened as you said an allready weak set up all the studs are longer and the dowl pins as well giving them more of a chance to stretch and twist side ways

my failures have always been the studs or the hubs them selves not a cv YET!
though it is a matter of time

i even looked into fitting 100 series hubs with the 10mm studs but that came to a dead end apparently the studs are spaced differently in the free wheel hub assy

from what i have worked out the only way to go is to get the lonfeilds shortened regroved, run asin hubs with the longfeild hub gears and fit arp allen studs insted of the factory studs and cone washers.

once longfeilds are fitted they take a lot of stress out of the whole drive line due to their ability to twist like a spring(torsion bar) taking a lot of shock out of the system.

once done the weakest link is the aisin hubs at least an easy change on the track
the whole set up is much stronger than std

thrashlux wrote: from what i have worked out the only way to go is to get the lonfeilds shortened regroved, run asin hubs with the longfeild hub gears and fit arp allen studs insted of the factory studs and cone washers.

what are these arp's you mention? might change my studs over to them

thrashlux wrote:

g35me wrote:Everyones input is great but I still dont know the answer to my original question of if the 1994 + model 80 series part timers have different length Asin Hubs.

Just to clarify a few things for anyone else looking into this:

The AVM hubs in the Marks adapters kit have a bad reputation (When you are running large tyres, from what I hear)

Longfields dont warrant their axles and CV's with any other part time free wheeling hub except the original Toyota Aisin hub WITH their modified hub gear installed.

AVM hubs in the Marks kit come with an 8mm spacer so they fit on the newer 1994+ CV's however the Aisin hub is shallower than the AVM hub and even if the spacer from Marks Adapters is fitted the end of the CV will hit the inside of the free wheeling hub and you wont even be able to get the cap on to do the bolts up.

AVM hubs do not fit the Longfield hub gears.

2 possible solutions are 1. make a spacer of 8mm behind the free wheeling hub, basically a big ring that goes over the studs and has room for the two locating dowels bringing everything 8mm closer so their will be no free play in the CV/Axle and the end cap of the Aisin hub will fit on. or 2. Take the CV off and get a new groove cut 8mm closer to the bell for the split ring stops the CV from moving then take 8mm off the end of the CV to allow the hub on.

I think solution 2 is better than 1 as I believe 1 will put to much stress on the already stupidly small Toyota studs.

All the part time 80s cruisers run the shorter cv 1990-1997

A freind of mine ran 8mm spacers and this weakened as you said an allready weak set up all the studs are longer and the dowl pins as well giving them more of a chance to stretch and twist side ways

my failures have always been the studs or the hubs them selves not a cv YET!
though it is a matter of time

i even looked into fitting 100 series hubs with the 10mm studs but that came to a dead end apparently the studs are spaced differently in the free wheel hub assy

from what i have worked out the only way to go is to get the lonfeilds shortened regroved, run asin hubs with the longfeild hub gears and fit arp allen studs insted of the factory studs and cone washers.

once longfeilds are fitted they take a lot of stress out of the whole drive line due to their ability to twist like a spring(torsion bar) taking a lot of shock out of the system.

once done the weakest link is the aisin hubs at least an easy change on the track
the whole set up is much stronger than std

This is definately what I will be doing. I also use 10mm allen key bolts for the rear hubs so I will probably do that on the front as well.

hulsty wrote:

thrashlux wrote: from what i have worked out the only way to go is to get the lonfeilds shortened regroved, run asin hubs with the longfeild hub gears and fit arp allen studs insted of the factory studs and cone washers.

what are these arp's you mention? might change my studs over to them

I should have showed you this when you were over yesturday.

this is the thread where i was thrashing out what i was going to do it has all the info on studs etc

http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/ftopic158 ... highlight=

cheers

jonathan

Just run the drive flanges and don't worry about FWH.

Can you tell the difference when hub is unlocked?

How many miles do you actually do know, understand on daily driver but a play truck like this.

Arguement of fishing stage whilst broken CV by unlocking hub, unbolt the flange and finish.

LOCKEE wrote:Just run the drive flanges and don't worry about FWH.

Can you tell the difference when hub is unlocked?

How many miles do you actually do know, understand on daily driver but a play truck like this.

Arguement of fishing stage whilst broken CV by unlocking hub, unbolt the flange and finish.

Good point, I will carry a flange or 2 as a spare. Its mainly to stop drivetrain wear on the Longfields. They only last apparently 18,000miles and as the aus $ has crapped itself over the last 6 months I could spend money elsewhere rather than buying new CV's at that price.

I want to retain the freeheel hub option as i go to the trouble to change tyres for running on the road for 2000 km each way to get to the dirt

most of my trips are around the 10000 km mark probably 4000 in 4x4

so do the long fields wear more quickly due to their construction/metallurgy

if so this is a major consideration

cheers

jonathan

thrashlux wrote:I want to retain the freeheel hub option as i go to the trouble to change tyres for running on the road for 2000 km each way to get to the dirt

most of my trips are around the 10000 km mark probably 4000 in 4x4

so do the long fields wear more quickly due to their construction/metallurgy

if so this is a major consideration

cheers

jonathan

Yes they wear significantly quicker. You sacrifice longevity for the ultimate strength. I would be concerned about doing those k's without a part time kit.

g35me wrote:

LOCKEE wrote: .

They only last apparently 18,000miles .

thats exactly what bobby told me. the mileage is poor.
but for my application thats about 10x what i will ever need.


goodluck on this hope it fits and lasts for ages.

I would'nt recomend getting rid of the cone washers and studs, a few of my mates have done this and they are forever comming loose just get a heap of cromo dowl pins from bobby and he also supplies a drill bit, then drill em out and add a shit load more dowl pins.

HIGH ROLLER wrote:I would'nt recomend getting rid of the cone washers and studs, a few of my mates have done this and they are forever comming loose just get a heap of cromo dowl pins from bobby and he also supplies a drill bit, then drill em out and add a shit load more dowl pins.

It is not posible on an 80 series to fit the additional there is no metal where the extra studs need to go in the bearing carrier(the thing the brake disk and free wheel hub bolt to)

the way you stop the studs coming loose is to lock wire them
then there is no need for cone washers (they come loose any way)

my cone washers were forever coming loose due to the studs stretching.

thrashlux wrote:

HIGH ROLLER wrote:I would'nt recomend getting rid of the cone washers and studs, a few of my mates have done this and they are forever comming loose just get a heap of cromo dowl pins from bobby and he also supplies a drill bit, then drill em out and add a shit load more dowl pins.

It is not posible on an 80 series to fit the additional there is no metal where the extra studs need to go in the bearing carrier(the thing the brake disk and free wheel hub bolt to)

the way you stop the studs coming loose is to lock wire them
then there is no need for cone washers (they come loose any way)

my cone washers were forever coming loose due to the studs stretching.

k looks like you have it sorted just thought i would mention it, i run drive flanges so was'nt sure anyway good luck with it

HIGH ROLLER wrote:

thrashlux wrote:

HIGH ROLLER wrote:I would'nt recomend getting rid of the cone washers and studs, a few of my mates have done this and they are forever comming loose just get a heap of cromo dowl pins from bobby and he also supplies a drill bit, then drill em out and add a shit load more dowl pins.

It is not posible on an 80 series to fit the additional there is no metal where the extra studs need to go in the bearing carrier(the thing the brake disk and free wheel hub bolt to)

the way you stop the studs coming loose is to lock wire them
then there is no need for cone washers (they come loose any way)

my cone washers were forever coming loose due to the studs stretching.

k looks like you have it sorted just thougth i would mention it, i run drive flanges so was'nt sure anyway good luck with it

thanks

yeh its a bit of a bitch would be easier if it were like the luxes or early cruisers

cheers


jonathan

sure sounds like it