Outer Limits 4x4 Board

Hey Guys,

I've read the starting troubleshooting guide in the
"Auto Electrical Topics" section at the top of the page,
but after tonights testing, I'm stumped....

Sat night, went to go wheeling on a night mission.
1. Drove all the way to Windsor from Sydney,
no major probs except for the occaisional splutter??
2. Got to Windsor BP, stopped car, filled up, started OK and left.
3. Phone rang, pulled over to find/answer it and while talking,
switched off car.
4. Engine Off for 2 mins, tried to start motor...got reds, lights and all
but nothing at all on key start? (Checked terminals = OK, little dirty)
5. Got jump-started by Ryan, started first go, ran OK cept for occ splutter.
Got home, switched off...car would not start againg (no click at all on key)
6. EASTER SUNDAY and PUB HOL MONDAY - Drinking and Eating
7. TONIGHT - Tested battery cold = 12.56V
8. Tried to start...click.. no start...SMOKE FROM +VE TERMINAL if key is held for 1-2 sec????
9. Jump started from 400CCA starter pack, Starts first go, idles fine?? Measured volts at 14.00 and climbing slowly (14.01,02,03,04)
10. Ran car for 5 mins, switched lights on = 13.91V.
11. Turned spots+lights on = 13.03 and dropping quickly (to 12.78 after 10secs)
12. Turned spots off = 13.78, turned all lights off = 14.10. Switched off.
13. Started car...Start First go. Turned engine off after 20 Secs
14. Started car...Srart first go. Turned off aft 20 secs
15. Started car....FIRST GO.

Can anyone help me with this evil electrical problem?
Battery is a Rocket something or rather with 460CCA, 6 months old.
could it be faulty? Ryan has the same batt and he's having very similar
issues with his.

Cheers,
Bart

to me it sounds like you arnt gettin a flat battery.
i had the same problem with my 3l.
had all the same syptoms.
1st i had startermotr rebuilt. wich it needed
it helped but didnt fix it so went back and they put a relay on the ignition wire. and i havnt had the problem back since.
it turns out the igniton switch is dogy in hilux as they age so u can get a new barrel etc but then u will have differnt key to start the car to the one on your doors. i also had to replace the battery becuase of it going flat from tryin to start the car so many times.

hope this helps

Yeah? That's a bummer.
Did it start happening all of a sudden?? Cause mine did.
I've got a little bit of that greenish gunk on the terminals,
so I'll clean that off and might get the batt. load tested just
to cross that off the list. Also going to test the alternator when
I get a chance too, see if that's charging OK.

So you say a relay in the ignition wire is the go? Might give it a go
if everything prooves to be working OK once started.

It's a very strange and extremely annoying, especially when you
get about 2M from the hard stuff and have to park it.
Did your car splutter occaisionally too, almost like it wasn't getting enough spark?? (This may be an urelated problem, it just started at
the same time as this prob).

Regards,
Bart

Bart,

When i bought my lux, the previous owner told me that it had the problem and only does it everynow and then.....which it did a few cranks of the key and it would start usually...bit harder when its hot thow. He said all it needed was new bush's in the starter...went on for botu a month before i got sick of it cause it just got worse...and i foudn it was killing my very good battery i had bought. Bein a diseal they use alot of cranking power. im not sure if the petrols use as much. so i was just having too much voltage drop while trying to start... its common as they get older..... as i said i took it 2 2 auto elecs that stuffed me around saying yes this is the problem all fixed...$400 later and 2x bein pulled out i still had the problem. I foudn another auto elec and he said that no one had dun anythin excpet replace the bushs... so he rebuilt it ALL!!!! it helped alot till but it eventually came back....so took it back to him and he said sweet just a relay on here and new good battery that hasnt been damaged.. nad i have not had 1 problem since!

i didnt get any spluttering as the diseal dun use much power to run the motor... i think u may have the same problem but bein a petrol and your battery is bein damaged every time it drains and dosnt start. it may be drawin a heap from battery that already is damged.

hope this all make sense:) i carnt see wot size relay they installed but id guess its a big one. try it an see if it helps... check ur starter motor out...and still does it get ur battery checked!

sorry bout the esay to read

double post

double post

if your getting 14Vs from your alternator its fine. 12.56V on a 'cold' battery are fine too (6 cells x 2.1V per cell). and those voltage drop figures on your headlights are normal.

MaccA

I had the same prob with my old lux with the 3Y motor in it. The starter motor bushes were dying, solved that problem by whacking the starter motor with a big pole when it clicked but didnt start. That worked for a year then i had to get the starter motor rebuilt cuz it was chockas with mud and other crud. Then after I had it rebuilt it just started clicking again, i checked the batt. cold it had 13v, tried to start it....click....jump started fine, Got to work and checked the batt. and it had a collapsed cell, so when i was trying to start it the battery was dropping to 2 v. Replaced the batt and it was fine

Cheers for all the great info guys,

Took apart (completely) terminals, washed in bicarb of soda as NAM states in the FAQ section,
Disconnected all aux. items light spots, compressor and locker air-valves.
When I re-connected it all, it started first go, and hasn't had the problem since.

I'm just a bit worried about the gas/steam that was coming off the -ve terminal when holding
the key on, but no starter motor or click was heard?? Wheres the best place to get a batt tested?
How much does it cost??
Like you guys say, this may be the start of an evil recurring electrical issue, at least I have something to work with now!!

Bart

check ya starter lead, cause it could be covered in shit, if so upgrade to a bigger size,

but it sounds like it's something to do with ya starter motor.

1 question ....is the engine "hot" when it wont crank?

This doesn't sound to me like it would have to be the starter motor, it sounds to me like shitty connections and/or inadequate cable.

Jason

Next time it farks up, whack a multimeter on ur fender and crank the engine whilst watching the meter...

If it falls below 9-10 volts, the battery is probably ted. Quite often batteries will show good volts cold, but be rooted when they have to supply a load.


The only difference between your battery starting the car and the jump start is the batteries ability to supply current. If no problems with the jump pack, you would assume the battery?

If its smoking on a terminal then there is a resistive connection allowing power to dissipate.
Terminals should not get hot.
CLEAN and ensure tight, all cables terminated, battery clamps touching all around.

Bazzle

bazzle wrote:If its smoking on a terminal then there is a resistive connection allowing power to dissipate.
Terminals should not get hot.
CLEAN and ensure tight, all cables terminated, battery clamps touching all around.

Bazzle

As Bazzle said you've got to have resistance in the connection for it to heat up like that. Get your battery connections/ cables sorted first and then see how you go from there.

Yeah that's what I was thinking. I just wanted to make sure that the smoking terminal was normal.
Anyway, I gave it the bi-carb of soda treatment, and took apart, cleaned with bi-carb and steel wool, and reassembled both terminals and now the starting problem seems to be gone for now. I have now reconnected the accessories, and it still seems to be working fine.
However, I am now having a problem with the fuel delivery to the carby!!! It just gets better...

Thanks for your suggestions though,
Bart