Outer Limits 4x4 Board

Hey Ive been searching around and reading some threads like below

http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/ftopic154 ... ht=splines

http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/ftopic145 ... ht=splines

I went to my local wreckers to pick up a rear diff centre, so old mate says yeah this is a rear with a LSD and wants $380 for it, so I told him a locker will be going in it so he goes ah well there is this other one on the rack which is a rear and should be fine and did it for $220. Its tagged 3.7 ratio which is what I have and need, get home thought i'd double check it was a rear and shove a rear axle in and it wouldn't go in. So I went to the shed and got a spare front axle out goes straight in... So he has given me a front diff... I assume or did some Zuk's come with different spline count other than 26 mmmm.

So I'm asking because Im swapping over my new locker with Couplers it doesn't really matter about the spline count, but is a front diff centre weaker or will I require other bits to make it work in the rear. Old mate at the wreckers seems to think there were models with different splines for the rear which I don't think is correct, I think they are flogging of fronts as rears and IMHO think a front should be a little cheaper or do people disagree with me here...? Other than than the front that I have is quite good condition and looks like its had very low K's so Im happy to use it if the centre swap over is easy as the R & P are in good nic.

Oh and so Im thinking should I just go get an actual rear or go and ask for it to be cheaper as its a front diff...?

So open to everyone's suggestions and advice

2 pin or 4 pin centre??

like you said if it is a front normally have really good condition gears.

Not sure how to check and can you explain meaning of 2 pin or 4 pin centre? Another issue Im trying to fully understand.

Other than slipping in an axle what are the best ways of Identifying a front and a rear if you didn't have the two next to each other. ...?

count the splines where the axle goes in...

this is a vitara 4 planetary center, same as sierra visually. there are pins that that hold those 4 gears in that you can see from the outside.

Hi Mud-pig.

There is 2 different front diffs for the Sierra. Both variants are 22 spline (as opposed to a 26 spline in the rear).

Now, about the 2 different centres: one is a 4 pinion, which is exactly the same as a rear diff apart from the 22 spline side-gears...
The other center available is a 2 pinion which looks very different inside to a 4 pinion one.


What I have been able to work out about Sierra diffs:


*ALL REAR diffs in Sierras are 4 pinion.

*ALMOST all FRONT diffs before 1988.5 were 4 pinion (same as the rear diff but with 22 spline side gears)

*ALMOST all FRONT diffs AFTER 1988.5 are 2 pinion with 22 spline.

*You can put 26 spline side gears in a FRONT 4-pinion diff and use it in the rear, and vise-versa.

NEW INFO:

*Lockright #1510 can go in a 2 pinion centre and is covered in the latest fitting instructions.

*Apparently around 1994 a different side gear went into the 2 pin carrier and it needs a bit machined off it to work with the #1510 Lockright.

*A 2-pinion Lockright might not be as strong as a 4-pinion one.



If anyone can add to that (or correct any errors) please feel free!

I hope that helps!

Pez

i have a lockright in my two pin w/t front diff. it is a internet myth that
you cant put a locker in a 2 pin carrier.

MUD PIG why cant you use the R&P you got with your old carrier all the
worn bits will be replaced by the lockright?

sheps wrote:i have a lockright in my two pin w/t front diff. it is a internet myth that
you cant put a locker in a 2 pin carrier.

What kind of locker do you have? My Richmond Lockright #1510 manual says that it will NOT go into a 2-pinion front...

Here is a lockright installation with lots of pics of a 4-pinion carrier.:
http://www.geckocycles.com/sammy_lock_right_install.htm

Here is a pic of a 2-pinion and 4-pinion diff side by side. The 2-pinion is the one still installed in the diff housing (on the right):



Very different!

Pez

sheps - this is from my Richmond Lockright manual:

"The LOCK-RIGHT is designed to function in 4-pinion
differentials only, not in 2-pinion design; to install a LOCKRIGHT
in these differentials a suitable 4-pinion rear differential
may be substituted."

Pez

Thanks for the photo Pezooki thats the sorta info I was after, I went back and looked at my photos of my rear and can see the difference. What I have is a two pin front diff for sure then.

sheps wrote:MUD PIG why cant you use the R&P you got with your old carrier all the worn bits will be replaced by the lockright?

Carrier is wrecked and bent no point using the other R&P if I have to get whole new carrier anyway. As Ball was saying he couldn't get the backlash back to factory that's why he couldn't get it right, and thats why my diff kept unloading when I put it back in. Now sorting a good condition rear diff.

Bugger,atleast you will have good spares anyway i guess.

I have a 4 pin arrier you can have full of broken gears,bolts and weld

No problems Mudpig- Good luck with the job!

Pez

Pezooki wrote:sheps - this is from my Richmond Lockright manual:

"The LOCK-RIGHT is designed to function in 4-pinion
differentials only, not in 2-pinion design; to install a LOCKRIGHT
in these differentials a suitable 4-pinion rear differential
may be substituted."

Pez

there are two lockrights for a sierra.
and like i say, i have a lockright in my 2 pin front diff. i rang loctup and ordered
a lockright for my 2 pin carrier and installed it.
let me say it again i HAVE a lockright in my front diff which also happens to
be a 2 pin carrier. it makes no difference weather people say it cant be
done or not cos i have one.

MUD PIG i am going to a suzie graveyard tommorow if there are any centers left i will grab them for ya and drop them off next wed. also i will have a look through my junk in case i have a carrier .

Hey sheps.

No worries - I will take your word for it.

I spoke to Lowrange Offroad and Rocky Road Outfitters before I purchased my Lockright, and they both told me that I had no option but to remove my 2 pinion and swap in a 4-pinion.... Either they didn't know a 2-pinion option existed, or perhaps its a new part??? I ordered mine about 2 years ago now...

So there IS a Lockright to suit the 2-pinion diff - thats good stuff - too bad they are keeping it a secret!!! The part number for the 4-pinion Lockright is "#1510". Do you have a part number for yours? (The Powertrax website is not working for me). I would like to check this all out!

Interesting stuff.

Pez

yep 1510 can go in a 2 pinion center and is in the fitting instructions that i got.
the 1520 or 1530 (cant remember off the top off my head) has the 26 spline
coupling.
my front lockright works perfectly while the rear one is a bit off a pig.

just remembered something, apparently around 94 or so a different side gear
went into the 2 pin carrier and it needs a bit machined off it to work with the
1510 lockright. mine is a 89 sierra. there are a few threads on pirate about it.

we have 2 cars in our club running them with 2 pinnon . got them from BBM .CHEERS RON

Pezooki wrote:Hey sheps.

No worries - I will take your word for it.

I spoke to Lowrange Offroad and Rocky Road Outfitters before I purchased my Lockright, and they both told me that I had no option but to remove my 2 pinion and swap in a 4-pinion.... Either they didn't know a 2-pinion option existed, or perhaps its a new part??? I ordered mine about 2 years ago now...

So there IS a Lockright to suit the 2-pinion diff - thats good stuff - too bad they are keeping it a secret!!! The part number for the 4-pinion Lockright is "#1510". Do you have a part number for yours? (The Powertrax website is not working for me). I would like to check this all out!

Interesting stuff.

Pez

A mate just fitted one to the 2 pin on the front of mine, he rang me in a mad panic and said it wont work because of the difference, but then after chatting with Locktup and doing some research apparently its the same locker used just less parts ( 2 gears and a pin ) so it wont necessarily be as strong as a 4 pin but will still work.

That was my limited understanding anyway, but a Sheps said if you know what you're doing yes a lockright will fit.

Thanks for the info guys!

I have edited my list (above) of things I know about zook diffs! Hopefully it will save someone's time and money one day!

Cheers all,

Pez

the 2 pin locker is plenty strong enough to do this to C/V's