Outer Limits 4x4 Board

OKay im very close to installing the body lift, this weekend infact BUT i cant for the life of me remember wether those two mounts in the rear wheel arches and actual mounts of just buffers, kind of like bump stops??

Also another couple of things i cant remember wether the captive nuts in the back, actually come out or wether they need to be oxy'd out or bashed out??

The rubbers that are under the chassis where the nut sits, do you keep that when you put your blocks in??? So it gives it a little bit of flex??

Do you remove the the bottom section of the radiator shroud or do you just lover the whole shroud..

AND last my springs at the front have sagged and there is about 1.5" difference between the front and back. As im the mayor of Broke Town would it be possible to just extend the front shackles to even out the springs until i can afford to get some new springs??


All answers will be GREATLY appreciated..

Marc

Shark wrote: i cant for the life of me remember wether those two mounts in the rear wheel arches and actual mounts of just buffers, kind of like bump stops??

All of the bolts with blocks etceteras are used to hold the body, they aren't really 'optional'. Just checked the block you are talking about - yes, it has a bolt through the body and chassis.

Shark wrote: Also another couple of things i cant remember wether the captive nuts in the back, actually come out or wether they need to be oxy'd out or bashed out??

Get a hole saw and cut through the floor from the top. This lets you get a socket onto the bolt and treat any rust you find at the same time. Then get a rubber bung of suitable size (or choose your hole saw size to suit the bung!) and plug it up after you've installed the new kit.

Shark wrote: The rubbers that are under the chassis where the nut sits, do you keep that when you put your blocks in??? So it gives it a little bit of flex??

Many people use aluminium or some other metal to provide the lift and usually leave the rubber in there. I have seen installations with plastic and no rubber. I prefer to get a moderately soft nolathane (or similar) of the correct height to give the lift you want without the rubber and strong enough to hold the car up, but soft enough to take vibration and allow the body to move indenpendantly of the chassis. Yes, the chassis do flex. My chassis has flexed over 30mm when doing 'frame benders' and dented the sill with my bush bar mount - you can usually get your fingers through the gap! Rubber lets the frame flex without bending the body (as suspension force etc is bending the chassis), so having bigger lift of soft compound (too soft and it'll squash) reduces vibes and allows better flex to reduce developing body squeaks due to everything getting loose from twisting.

Shark wrote:Do you remove the the bottom section of the radiator shroud or do you just lover the whole shroud..

How high you going? 1", don't worry, more than that, you start cutting, as moving the shroud down tends to obscure the flow as the fan hangs out the bottom but doesn't pull more air from the top. Often time to consider an 'up front' thermo fan. A real pain to install if you have A/C as the return pipe is in the way. :-/

In my MK wagon I've gone 2" suspension lift (soft, rated payload 400kg) and 1" body lift to make cleaning easier, as you can get a pressure washer in under the frame. I haven't found clearance issues with tyres (generally run 31" roads, 32" muds, have used 33" no problem), being about the only reason you want more body lift, as this makes the truck taller and weight heigher with a larger frontal profile that won't help stability or windage. But depends on what you're looking for. *shrugs*

Shark wrote: AND last my springs at the front have sagged and there is about 1.5" difference between the front and back. ... Would it be possible to just extend the front shackles to even out the springs until i can afford to get some new springs??

The back, when set up properly and no load, will sit higher than the front. It is quite noticeable when my fuel tanks are almost empty with nothing in the back. When fully loaded, everything should sit level. If this is the case, don't fiddle.

In most places, extended shackles are illegal; depends on how you feel about giving the boys in blue something to pick on.

Longer shackles will adjust your spring rate due to changing the leverage point. Longer will make the spring action 'softer' as it has more leverage, which may make your sag worse. I'm also guessing that if your springs are sad, your shocks are shot, so this will then increase wallow, tyre scallopping, body roll and other bad handling characteristics.

From the sound of what you're trying to do, body lift won't really help your ground clearance, will mess up your handling, can still get things scraping when running big rubber, you need suspension anyway and you can't afford the mods. About right? My tip would be get a set of shockers to improve your handling and grip (keeping tyres on the ground improves grip!) then save up for a suitable set of springs, then consider body lift if required after you've upgraded your rubber and found things tend to scrape.

Scrapper.

Shark wrote:OKay im very close to installing the body lift, this weekend infact BUT i cant for the life of me remember wether those two mounts in the rear wheel arches and actual mounts of just buffers, kind of like bump stops??

they do nothing to support the body, you can leave them out.

Shark wrote:Also another couple of things i cant remember wether the captive nuts in the back, actually come out or wether they need to be oxy'd out or bashed out??

they have some sort of thread locking compound on them. People use an Oxy to heat them to break down that chemical lock. You can get them out without heat if you are patient. If you just try to keep unwinding them they will break off in there and you will have to cut the floor and drill them out. But if you undo half a turn at a time and then go back in one full turn, you can get them out. Its long and tedious and hard work, but its possible... most of the time!

Shark wrote:The rubbers that are under the chassis where the nut sits, do you keep that when you put your blocks in??? So it gives it a little bit of flex??

yes, you use the rubbers with the lift kit. They are there for a reason, and beside, if you don't use them your 2" lift is more like 1.25" lift.

Shark wrote:Do you remove the the bottom section of the radiator shroud or do you just lover the whole shroud..

just remove the lower section of the shroud.

Couple of other things you should know:

when you are doing the body lift, loosen the steering shaft knuckle's slip joint. My 2" lift in MQ SWB was fine without a spacer.

You will need a longer clutch hose. The steel brake lines have plenty of room for expansion in the coiled up sections.

remember to unclip all the rubber splash gaurds in the front wheelarches before trying to lift the body.

4WD lever will hit the floor after the lift. you can bend (with Oxy) or grind for clearance.

http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/ftopic998 ... highlight=

check out the pics as i went along.

those nuts your talking about at the back are bloody hard work, but doa-able.

cheers

Hey guys, all went well except the bloody rear captives.. They started spinning on the spot and no amount of bashing would get it out so had to drill the suckers out... If it wasnt for those two bolts i would have had the lift done by myself in 3.5 hrs which i was pretty stoked about..

Just gotta sort the front suspension out now, the front sits 60mm lower than the rear and looks terrible. Trying to work out wether to reset some springs i was given or just extend the shackles. Im leaning more towards reseting the springs i was given but i wont be able to afford that for a while.

Tore my gearshift boot which im not too happy about, anyone know how to sort out the boot, its heaps noiser with the hole in it and it wont sit in there properly.

Marc

mate, forget about reseting the springs, theyll just sagg again. See if you can find some on the cheap extended (raised) springs.

Go to a wrecker and see if you can pilfer a boot

while your there, you might find some raised springs.

The springs i was given are Tough dogs they were apparently installed wrong so i thought they would be worth a reset???


Marc

Shark wrote:The springs i was given are Tough dogs they were apparently installed wrong so i thought they would be worth a reset???

Vanne wrote: forget about reseting the springs, theyll just sagg again.

Go to a wrecker and see if you can pilfer a boot while your there, you might find some raised springs.

The lift looks nice in the silver MK wagon that was linked, but pity about the mangled floor to get to the bolts! Would have been better to drill them out with a hole saw and put a rubber bung back to fill things up neatly.

Depends on what loads you plan to carry. Too heavy springs makes for bad ride and low amounts of flex. The scragged Tough Dogs springs you have could be a heap better than what you are running - jack up the front from the frame rail and compare unladen curves.

If the springs are the right weight for the task, then getting them recurved or reset is not a problem. Springs do wear, they are a moving part. If they are set properly, you don't overload them, then they will eventually sag with usage and kilometres. You can put rock-hard-heavy-duty-don't-flex-never-sag springs in, but if you don't carry heavy loads then you are breaking your tail end (and other things!) and losing flex all for the sake of not putting in new springs when you need them. Let's face it - even truck springs wear out - use the right spring and shock combination for the job.

Not sure about allegedly installed incorrectly - if they are damaged (twisted, kinked, wear spots in sides, etc), then don't use them (risk of breakage), otherwise should not be a problem. They could be scragged (sagged till they bend the wrong way) due to being abused (hit hard, over loaded), but that will only reduce their performance. Also get the hassle of MQ Tilt - car leans to the right as all heavy stuff (transfer, drive shafts, driver???) tends to be down the RHS), so if one pair is taller, put them on the right to compensate.

Have put Ironman 3" lifted springs and shocks into the MQ wagon I had. Ok flex, better than factory ride, sagging front but the rear is still standing tall - probably similar sag to what you are describing. Cost me $400, so not complaining too loudly. Was fairly easy to install and sucked me into trying to do the MK myself.

Previous suspension in the MK was super-soft and flexed like crazy with a cushy ride, but soon sagged down to factory height. Only cost me the effort to swap it into my car (two days worth of swearing as the old suspension had partially seized!). Was a lot better than factory, for sure!

I spent $1500 for a full set of recurved and set to my load requirement (400kg payload) 2" lifted springs with new greasable shackles, all bushes (including the metal ones inside the frame 99% of people don't change!), shockers, all U-bolts and had them installed by Hi Tek suspension in Lilydale. They know their stuff - the ride has been very good, very good flex, maintained ride height and hasn't sagged past the 'breaking in' stage after 12+ months of use for towing, touring and off-roading. It felt expensive at the time, but money well spent.

Incidentally the rear springs are based on factory MQ wagon springs!

Don't bother buying a second hand gearstick boot. They split - it's an MQ feature. The bodge is to get a good quality toweling (no oil or grease, lots of cotton or other natural fibre) type rag and wrap it around the gearstick up under the split boot - will block the noise and heat flow from underneath. I haven't found aftermarket gearstick boots to do anything other than 'look nice'. The original boots can be ordered through Nissan, are under $50 from memory and you won't need another one unless you do something stupid to it. I've changed several for 'good second hand' only to have them split a few months later. The hassle of getting them in is not worth the cost difference; they are a nuisance to change.

I've had 6 MQ/MK's; 4 diesel, 2 petrol; SWB and LWB configurations and done most modifications at some stage, so I can probably tell you the best way to do it and the bodgey way along with the drawbacks you may encounter. Cutting some corners saves cost and effort, others cost you a new axle...