Outer Limits 4x4 Board

Ive read a lot about the GTI conversion and there seems like a lot of people talking up MK1 and then MK2 then Blah blah you get the idea!

For those who have done them, which years or MK would you use as the easy/best option?

90 onwards efi vitara...........

maybe a combo...
DOHC + G16 bottom end. Best of both worlds.

dank wrote:maybe a combo...
DOHC + G16 bottom end. Best of both worlds.

haha....and the gti head is more advanced over the vit 16 valve because?

joeblow wrote:

dank wrote:maybe a combo...
DOHC + G16 bottom end. Best of both worlds.

haha....and the gti head is more advanced over the vit 16 valve because?

and the extra work of the twin cam cant justify the power gain on a 1600 you wont notice it driving

jimbo jones wrote:

joeblow wrote:

dank wrote:maybe a combo...
DOHC + G16 bottom end. Best of both worlds.

haha....and the gti head is more advanced over the vit 16 valve because?

and the extra work of the twin cam cant justify the power gain on a 1600 you wont notice it driving

i hear ya jimbo.....but i don't think there is actually a power gain.

was thinking of this article - http://autospeed.com/cms/A_110289/article.html

1.3 GTI Years and Models I was thinking boys

not if 1.6 was a better option etc, that has been proven and argued before millon times.

as late model as you can.

joeblow wrote:

jimbo jones wrote:

joeblow wrote:

dank wrote:maybe a combo...
DOHC + G16 bottom end. Best of both worlds.

haha....and the gti head is more advanced over the vit 16 valve because?

and the extra work of the twin cam cant justify the power gain on a 1600 you wont notice it driving

i hear ya jimbo.....but i don't think there is actually a power gain.

Yeah there is, but it can mostly be attributed to a good aftermarket ecu. A mate has G16B bottom end with GTI DOHC head running standard GTI ecu at the moment, and it easily has more power than a sierra with EFI vit donk. The car has made even more power in the past with an archaic Microtech.

IMO not worth the hassle with wiring, ecu's and firewall clearance/ dizzy angle drive issues.

Pete

Thanks for the info crew

Why the later model Joe?

Better Head? Better Wring? Less hassle??

dank wrote:maybe a combo...
DOHC + G16 bottom end. Best of both worlds.

great idea if u have allot of money my mate just done it 6k upwards after and really cheap engine and computer buy and a rebuild and tuning lots of trouble but a good result

Remydog05 wrote:Thanks for the info crew

Why the later model Joe?

Better Head? Better Wring? Less hassle??

Later models are supposed to be more powerful

'Mk1' Boxy Gti is fuel only with dizzy, it makes it easier if you run the right angle dizzy adaptor. aprox 100 HP (mid 80's)

'Mk2' Fuel and Spark, the ECU i think has a 128k processor
approx 115hp (early nineties)

'Mk3' Fuel and Spark, 256k ECU
approx 115hp (mid-late nineties)

The mk3 ECu works in MK2 bu not the other way round and has a faster reactin time

i think Joe is recomending latest on the grounds that it probbly hs lower k's nd any 'bug' would of been sorted out

In any case i think seting the up a DOHC for a sierra is plausible but you shouldnt take the same path as the redlinegti.com folk when i comes to power tuning.
I keep saying it but if you aint ging turbo take out the forged crank to regain some zip on the lower end, and invest in some adjustable cam gears to get the powerband lower.

If you want to stick it in, save tme spend a little more (or rather he same, just in one hit) on the G13BB (maybe go funky wih a vitara cam )

dank wrote:was thinking of this article - http://autospeed.com/cms/A_110289/article.html

That article is a bit of an unfair comparison, single throttle body injection and head (g16) to DOHC and MPFI (g13b). Yes in this case id agree, very noticeable power difference, although this is mainly attributed to the difference in efi systems not heads.

Dan

dank wrote:maybe a combo...
DOHC + G16 bottom end. Best of both worlds.

Own one. Will never own one again.
C@#T of a combo. Stick to a g16b vitara/baleno donk and be done with it.
GTI is not all its cracked up to be.

mnemonix wrote:

dank wrote:maybe a combo...
DOHC + G16 bottom end. Best of both worlds.

Own one. Will never own one again.
C@#T of a combo. Stick to a g16b vitara/baleno donk and be done with it.
GTI is not all its cracked up to be.

what didnt you like about it, I have helped a few people build ths combo and they have been happy. ( I only did the motor side none of the ECU\EFI part)

Gutless wrote: A mate has G16B bottom end with GTI DOHC head running standard GTI ecu at the moment, and it easily has more power than a sierra with EFI vit donk. The car has made even more power in the past with an archaic Microtech.


Pete

Go say that on redline.com and watch yourself get laughed at. It's been back to back tested before. The DOHC G13B head flows no better than a G16B DOHC head and vice versa. The power comes from revs in a GTi and hence the need for forged bottom end. I think it's pointless owning a GTi motor and putting in a cast crank as you won't be able to rev it safely to where it makes all it's power. Mine motor frequents 7000rpm on the street just driving around and it loves it. I have mates with GTi's with over 200000km's with rev limits set at 8250rpm. They're not for everybody but they have their strengths.

love_mud wrote: what didnt you like about it, I have helped a few people build ths combo and they have been happy. ( I only did the motor side none of the ECU\EFI part)

I've previously owned a standard G16b sierra. It was a great combo.
My current zook has a g16b, gti head, sr20 throttle body, bored out inlet manifold, aftermarket ecu, upgraded fuel rail, pump, FPR.
Sc14 supercharger has been on the car, but is currently removed while I make a few changes to the mounts I have made.

N/A, the power increase from the GTI mod's and associated throttle body upgrades etc don't justify the work involved. Even though I can do the work myself, so labour cost is not an issue.
The power delivery is not in a rev range that is used for the type of driving I do. It's OK in mudholes etc where you might feel the need to find the revlimiter and throw some rooster tails, but overall for an offroad vehicle utilising the 2500-4500rpm range, the standard G16b was a better engine for me. Performance wise, it flows a greater volume of air in N/A form than the twin cam GTI anyway.

GRPABT1 wrote:I think it's pointless owning a GTi motor and putting in a cast crank as you won't be able to rev it safely to where it makes all it's power.

My twincam G16b has a 7000rpm softcut and 7500hard cut in the adaptronic ecu, and you could damn near drive around on the revlimiter if you were that way inclined.
Peak horsepower is achieved at 6400 rpm and holds this power until 7900rrpm where it drops off dramatically.
It was originally set to 7800 hard cut only, and drove fine up to that point. It was only dropped as I don't need to be abusing an engine to that point with my driving style.