Outer Limits 4x4 Board

G'day
ive been given a 2L v6 out of a vitara and im thinking of putting it into my sierra. ive searched but there doesnt seem to be much information on doing it.
does it use the same auto box behind the 1.6 with a different bellhousing or is it completely different gearbox?

theres a guy in perth running that engine in his sierra - PM me and i can give you his email...

do you have the auto box?

I believe that the bellhousing pattern is different to the g series motors, although the gearbox itself is an AW-4, the same as a 1.6.

I'm in the very early planning stages of the same conversion. There's a thread of a guy doing in in Germany on Pirate - and in his case the end result was a very stock looking car - tyre size was close to stock etc. his was a SWB soft top.

Steve.

Sounds like a good conversion. Get the 2l v6 auto setup, take off the transfercase, install the Trail Tuff `Undertaker` [underdrive gearbox] reconnect transfercase with the 4.24/1 TT gear set. Put it all into a LWB Maruti

Gwagensteve wrote:do you have the auto box?

I believe that the bellhousing pattern is different to the g series motors, although the gearbox itself is an AW-4, the same as a 1.6.

I'm in the very early planning stages of the same conversion. There's a thread of a guy doing in in Germany on Pirate - and in his case the end result was a very stock looking car - tyre size was close to stock etc. his was a SWB soft top.

Steve.

i dont have a box yet, was still trying to figure out what one i needed. im pretty sure that a torque convertor from either the 2L or 1.6 will bolt on to the flex plate of the 2L but your right in that the bellhousings are different.

would you have a link to thread on pirate i cant seem to find it

Bentzook wrote:Sounds like a good conversion. Get the 2l v6 auto setup, take off the transfercase, install the Trail Tuff `Undertaker` [underdrive gearbox] reconnect transfercase with the 4.24/1 TT gear set. Put it all into a LWB Maruti

so is it possible to keep the vitara transfer case? will it still line up with the diffs or will it end up with bad uni angles?

or is there a 2wd car that uses a aw4 auto?

toyota supras, cressidas and early celica come out with a a340 auto which is just a renamed aw4 auto. so would i be able just swap the bellhousing over on one of these?
my reasoning behind this is that it would save dropping the transfer case off the vitara auto and it shouldnt be to hard to get a auto from a cressida for cheap

How much harder would this be than the J20a??

With the V6 what would be the main advantage of going that way?

Couldnt you still separate the Tarns case and run the seirra trans case?

Wouldnt you be better off with almost a complete wreak and using the stock radiator etc?

Have you got a link to the thread Steve?

Nope, it was a pretty old thread.

I don't there's a huge advantage at the 2.0 point. The exhaust alone will be a huge headache compared to the J20. I like the idea it's short, not done very often, and will sound funny. I don't like the length of the J20, and also that it's basically a developmental dead end. There's some higher power versions in the US, but I'd rather bolt in more power rather than have to build a new motor from scratch.

Also, the 2.5, and even the last 140Kw 2.7 motor will bolt in.

Yes, a front cut would be a good buy, but mostly for the whole loom, engine mounts, steering box etc. not so much the radiator. I'll be rear mounted.

Yes, you can separate the transfer and still run a sierra case. Thats what I'd be doing.

i mangaed to find the thread on pirate for those who are interested
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthre ... 0&t=283075

Good on ya now im thinking suz v6 for my lwb.... Has anyone engineered them? Mine maybe going v6, vit 5sp, sierra 6.5 transfer

Edit. From looking at that thread... I dont want to be cutting everything!!! fark..maybe just 1.6 for me

sounds like more work than hitler.
surley sr20/ca18/or 4agze would be substantially easier
i understand if you want to keep it all suzuki and dont want to put a heavy motor in and upset the balance blah blah blah. But i think there are better options out there powerwise and installation wise too.

i had a look at the 2lt v6 before i bought my j20a. for the little extra power i could not justify the unforeseen dramas that would have been involved in the extra engine bay usage. now i have seen one. i'm even happier with the j20

There's basically no power difference between the J20 and H20, but obviously the shape of the powerband and the "feel" of the motor is quite different.

Other than the exhaust, I'm not sure how much work it is than a J20 - pretty much all the same systems are being worked with.

In my case, it has nothing to do with staying all suzuki - the H20 is a convenient way to fit a range of powerful, modern engines that run the AW-4 auto and will sit neatly in the sierra engine bay, set well back.

Steve.

mundy wrote:i mangaed to find the thread on pirate for those who are interested
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthre ... 0&t=283075

don't use that thread as a benchmark........is a very rough conversion.

Gwagensteve wrote:Nope, it was a pretty old thread.
I don't like the length of the J20, and also that it's basically a developmental dead end.

Why do you say it's a developmental dead end?

Doesn't the SX4 and the rally version still use the J20A? The rally version even has a turbo.

and the new gv is a j24a........mmmmm wonder where they found the extra 400cc??

mr green wrote:and the new gv is a j24a........mmmmm wonder where they found the extra 400cc??

Stroke and bore. Although it is based on the J18A, J20A & J23A it is my understanding that the J24B is different enough that you can't swap the main components. It may be possible though if the mounts are the same to swap one in down the track.

TheOtherLeft wrote:

Gwagensteve wrote:Nope, it was a pretty old thread.
I don't like the length of the J20, and also that it's basically a developmental dead end.

Why do you say it's a developmental dead end?

Doesn't the SX4 and the rally version still use the J20A? The rally version even has a turbo.

I think what Steve is getting at iis the lack of aftermarket support and locally readily available higher output versions whereas the 2.0V6 can be swapped out for the 2.5 or 2.7 with minimal work giving more power and torque from a Factory setup. The ne w J24B may be an option though for the J20A but they won't be common or cheap for some time.

Would you really need much more power/torque by the time your up in the 2L motors?

Even more weight I would think for the 2.5 & 2.7!

Whats the vote on J20A against H20A, as in how the motor runs and reliability?

cj wrote:

TheOtherLeft wrote:

Gwagensteve wrote:Nope, it was a pretty old thread.
I don't like the length of the J20, and also that it's basically a developmental dead end.

Why do you say it's a developmental dead end?

Doesn't the SX4 and the rally version still use the J20A? The rally version even has a turbo.

I think what Steve is getting at is the lack of aftermarket support and locally readily available higher output versions whereas the 2.0V6 can be swapped out for the 2.5 or 2.7 with minimal work giving more power and torque from a Factory setup. The ne w J24B may be an option though for the J20A but they won't be common or cheap for some time.

I agree with both of you that if you go to a 2L V6 its only a short hop to a 2.5 or 2.7 but I've seen more forged rods, low compression pistons (inc oversizes), oversize bearings and thick copper head gaskets for J20a's around than I have G16A's or B's and V6's. Granted these things are more for turbo/super charger app's, require a re-build and may not represent actual aftermarket parts support but I would of thought it is suggestive. What power does the concept SX4 turbo make again?

For my money my next zook (and first major build) will either be a 2L vit or 1.6 with a 2L transplant with low compression, s/c, headwork and cam with an AW4 behind.

Edit - but all this is beside the point. You've got a free V6. Stick it in. Its the same thing guys do when they get a free dunnydoor V6

There are other motors around that are far more attractive, some of which will fit to an AW4 ( if thats's you gearbox choice ).

Lets face it none of Suzuki engines being discussed are particuularly attractive when you compare them with whats' around if your thinking of starting with a clean slate.

Like virtually all Jap engines of their day they were "acceptable", but by even modest standards they are low powered and quite expensive for what you get.

Of course if you wish to stay with the Suzuki name then that's different, but if you really are going to go to all the effort of an engineered conversion that works well - why not actually select the BEST motor from those available ?

You can get some very good engines ( some listed above ) for very low money, with good parts availability, both performance and stock.

MightyMouse wrote:There are other motors around that are far more attractive, some of which will fit to an AW4 ( if thats's you gearbox choice ).

Lets face it none of Suzuki engines being discussed are particuularly attractive when you compare them with whats' around if your thinking of starting with a clean slate.

Like virtually all Jap engines of their day they were "acceptable", but by even modest standards they are low powered and quite expensive for what you get.

Of course if you wish to stay with the Suzuki name then that's different, but if you really are going to go to all the effort of an engineered conversion that works well - why not actually select the BEST motor from those available ?

You can get some very good engines ( some listed above ) for very low money, with good parts availability, both performance and stock.

At present my thinking has led me to wanting an auto with an overdrive option. The AW4 already fits that requirement so pairing up with a zook motor seems the path of least resistance (since I will likely already have the 2L and Auto as a paired set anyway).

But I'm not fixed in my choice, I'm know there are other engines that will bolt to an AW4 but does that kill the shift/overdrive/TC lockup functioning?
My understanding was that it would and I would have an auto stuck in manual shift.

Are there other RWD engine/AW4(or AKA's) combos that will still leave a fully functional auto?

Controlloning an AW4 ( A44DE ) is dead easy.....

Actually there are a number of choices with the A44 series box.. theres a range of non electric shift versions ( no electronics but not ovedrive ), a variant with hydraulic control and electric overdrive control only and the A44DE with mostly electric control.

I've run an A44DE ( AW4 is zook speak not the actual auto code ) via simple electrical switching for years now and am VERY happy with it. It was going to be a 'temporary" fit unit i sorted out an ECU but there was just no point - simple was just too good.

Actually the manual electric controls are better IMO...... you can shift to any gear at any time - a real winner off road.

And P.S. don't get stressed about the lockup converter - sure it would be "nice" but in practice it makes SFA difference.