Outer Limits 4x4 Board

i have 5 spotties i'd like to put on my frog, and i'm not really sure which way to go about it. so if anyone can maybe give me a run down on this, or any advice, would be great.

there will be 2 on the bull bar, and 3 on a roof bar over head. i'd like to have the front and overhead spotties on different switches.

spotties are hella, round, 2x100w, and 3x120w.
they are going on a vitara, so small engine, small battery, and small alternator.

i've heard many different things, but not sure which path to take, and i'm sure this is a place to get an answer.

some say, new battery, or 2 batteries, or bigger alternator, or 12v power amplifiers, and it just keeps going, sorta getting a head ache.

i know basic wiring, but in which method. some say the lights could draw more current than can be provided, resulting in flat battery?

thanks again guys. steve.

HI Steve, you'd be wise to get a bigger alternator at the very least. You need to ensure that the alternator can always supply more current than the entire vehicle's electrical system can drain. A larger battery would also be a good idea, but not essential as long as you have the motor running while using the lights.

As for a "12V amplifier" - WTF?! Steer clear of the place that gave you that recommendation!

i would highly recomend you upgrading the alternator first to something with a little more output,

i have a GQ patrol, with 4 spotties, and the fan on, my voltage meter drops below12V's when at idle, and it drops quickly, works fine when moving thou

ozy1 wrote:i would highly recomend you upgrading the alternator first to something with a little more output,

i have a GQ patrol, with 4 spotties, and the fan on, my voltage meter drops below12V's when at idle, and it drops quickly, works fine when moving thou

Sorry for the thread hijack, but it's probably valuable info anyway - what's the rated output of your alternator ozy?

GQs appear to have come with a few different ones from what I can tell.

Jason

ozy1 wrote: works fine when moving thou

chimp, sounds like its one of those alternators from a wind farm

your lighting will draw around 55amps so just say 60amps to be sure.

if theres room you could just run a second alternator rated at 60amps.

MaccA

Old topic that I found through searching for a querie I have, unfortunatley, I don't know how to convert watts to amps...
My load is 600w of driving lights+stereo & 450w amp, winch on the second battery. I'm running two optima blue tops on a solonoid (soonish', not just yet though) What amperage does my alternator need to be to keep up and run the lights, accessories and engine without too much drama? Keep in mind, this is a suzuki sierra running an efi 1600 vit motor

Power (in Watts)= Voltage (Volts) x Current (Amps)

So, for 600 Watts of lights you'd be drawing 600/13 = ~46 Amps. I've used 13 volts as your battery should be sitting around that with the engine running.

I wouldn't worry too much about figuring your amp into the current draw as it will only pump out 450W max- and is not constant drain (plus it's not as easy to calculate out how much it would draw due to the power supplies used in them.) Things like the EFI computer and ventilation fan should be taken into consideration, as well as the headlights.

I'm unsure what draw the efi and the ventilation fan would draw, I'm good with gears and shiate like that, just suck when it come to sparx...

Allow about 10 Amps for the fan and about the same for the EFI system. (Rough guesses.....)

Hi raqmup, just your driving lights and your head lights alone require around 60 amps at 13.5 volts and then you have to add power for your amp, parking lights and so.
I think you will have already exceeded your alternator’s capacity and adding batteries will only make the problem of getting enough power even worse.
While you are operating your lights and amp, you will most likely be pulling more power than your alternator can produce so power will be pulled from your batteries as well.
For operations of a few minute at a time would not be a problem but to operate every thing for a few hours will be a major problem.
Within a short period of time you will not only lowering you batteries charge but it will also be lowering your operating voltage.
What normally happens in this type of situation, your lights will start to go dull. If you get to this point the best you can do is turn every thing off and just operate on low beam. This will give your alternator some chance to charge your batteries again.
If you are driving and the lights do start to dull, DO NOT STOP YOUR MOTOR. You may have already lowered your battery voltage bellow the point at which it needs to be, to be able to start your vehicle.
If you are off road then the above scenario is likely to happen in a much shorter time as you are more likely to be operating your motor at a lower rev and this means your alternator is probably not producing at maximum output.
Try reducing the wattage of your driving lights and/or don’t use your sound system at the same time.
With all this power consumption, you will probably need to over haul your alternator on a regular basis.
Cheers

Thanks guys, um, if it means upgrading the alternator, I'm prepared to do that without question, my build up is not one to cut corners of any magnitude, sooo, perhaps a bigger one, say a Holden VS alternator (100amps I think someone said ) I'm also told that it'll fit with not too much of an issue, is this true or is my theory a bit blurry?

Hi again raqmup, I don’t know how big your motor is but the bigger the alternator the more engine power it will take to operate it.
I don’t think this will need to be a major consideration but it might pay to find out.
Cheers

raqmuq you should have only posted this question in one section...

chimpboy wrote:

ozy1 wrote:i would highly recomend you upgrading the alternator first to something with a little more output,

i have a GQ patrol, with 4 spotties, and the fan on, my voltage meter drops below12V's when at idle, and it drops quickly, works fine when moving thou

Sorry for the thread hijack, but it's probably valuable info anyway - what's the rated output of your alternator ozy?

GQs appear to have come with a few different ones from what I can tell.

Jason

been a while since i have been here, i believe my alt is a 60 amp model, dont quote me, cause im not sure,
-my headlights are 100!low beam and 130W high beam, (looking at 22Amps on high beam here)
-i have 4 spotties, 2 at 130W and 2 at 100W (so looking at an amp draw of around 35 amps here)

so just in lighting i have used 55amps

plus there is a heap of other power in the truck being used,like fridge, Stereo system, rock lights, reverse lights, but i try not run evrything at once.

Shawn

Alternators are rated at a maximum output this is not what can be produced continously without smoke.

Thanks guys, they got a bit narky in gerneral tech about what I asked, guess I just wanted an answer so I tried two sections 1st... Anyway, I'm not overly on the percentage of engine loss I'll suffer from whakin' on a bigger 'turbine', anyone sorta know something about this? My 1600 goes hard as it is, my diff ratios are low as f@rk so she pulls like a frieght train atm... If I do upgrade to a bigger alternator, will I have to compensate with heavier cableing? Also, anyone that's zook savvy, what's a good fit that's RELIABLE in say 100amps?

Hi raqmup, there might be a cheaper and quicker way around the problem. I don’t know what an alternator will cost you but for around $150 you could change your driving light globes to Phillips Crystal Vision globes. They are power rated at 55 watts but putout the equivalent of 100 watts.

I have 6 driving lights on my Rangy and all are fitted with the Phillips Crystal Vision globes. I didn’t change over to save power, I have 2 IPFs on the bumper and with 130 watters, they were just ordinary and someone told me to try the Phillips globes and I was hooked.
They are not as bright as the 130 watters but they more that make up for it by the WHITE light they produce.

I’m out west a lot and these white lights allow me to see roos heap sooner than I could with the ordinary globes.

By using the Phillips Crystal Vision globes, you would probably not need to up grade your alternator so you would save any way.

Just an idea, cheers.

Drivesafe, you're a champ...
I'll give that a whirl! I'm at repco autoparts, so I can get 'em cheap!
Unsure what brand globes the XGT's use out of the box, but I'll change them over to cut down the power draw...

Hi raqmup, be warned not all globes are the same. I tried a set of the Narva globes first and there was no noticeable difference between them and the ordinary globes and somebody else, else where commented along the same lines.
I’m not specifically pushing the Phillips globes, just giving you a heads up to do a bit of snooping before you part with your hard earned cash.
Cheers

I can't believe your removing the globes out of the XGT's and downgrading to the phillips globes. Why pay all that money for the spotties in the first place when you could have bought some cheap sh#t ones for super cheap?

toughnut wrote:I can't believe your removing the globes out of the XGT's and downgrading to the phillips globes. Why pay all that money for the spotties in the first place when you could have bought some cheap sh#t ones for super cheap?

So what brand of globe do Lightforce fit as standard?

I know I've got some Philips globes in my main beams and they are a lot brighter than the Narva and Osram globes they replaced, but the same wattage. (I'm not sure what model Philips globe they are though?)

Hi touhgnut, as murcod has also found, the Phillips are much better lights.
I’ve used Hella globes, Narva globes, the 130 watt globes that come with the IPF driving light kits and a number of other brands. I’ve been driving vehicles with 6 driving lights on them, for just over 20 years and with the exception of the 2 IPFs I’m running on the Rangie now and two 250 watt landing lights I had years ago, I have always had Hella 181 driving lights and as such can get a pretty good idea of any differences in light quality and nothing has come anywhere near giving as clear a light as these Phillips do.
The IPFs came with 130 watters and the 55 watt Phillips still give out a better light.
I don’t know what you used but I am yet to find a globe that works better than these.
Cheers

Haven't changed them over as yet, they're not even on my rig yet fella's, so I'm not parting with any $$'s 'till I finish researching what I need to do... Drivesafe and murcod, thanks for the advice so far, as I mentioned previously, auto elec's is one of the only area's I stuggle with in regards to my zook, so any good advice is appreciated! I'm not here to waste anyone's time or preach about how good any 1 thing is, so at least this threadis making progress

If I want to run a bigger althernator , I'm not concerned about a power drop in the motor- it's got more than enough... Sooo, apart from bosch ones- which I've seen catch fire.... what are semi-decent or decent ones to look at that would fit on a vitara motor without major fabrication/modification work?

raqmup wrote:If I want to run a bigger althernator , I'm not concerned about a power drop in the motor- it's got more than enough... Sooo, apart from bosch ones- which I've seen catch fire.... what are semi-decent or decent ones to look at that would fit on a vitara motor without major fabrication/modification work?

You've probably seen them catch fire because some ... er ... let's say "ambitious" person is trying to run 1000w of lights from a 50amp alternator.

RoldIT wrote:You've probably seen them catch fire because some ... er ... let's say "ambitious" person is trying to run 1000w of lights from a 50amp alternator.

Nah, one or two blokes that where going in the outback challenge had it happen and bosch were prepared to do jack shiate about it, Bosch reckoned it was BS they'd made up...

Unsure what ones to look at atm

Didn't mean to offend anyone. I just can't understand why you'd pay big $$$$ for an awsome set of lights and then skimp on the fitment. The whole reason the lightforce XGT's are so good is because of the wattage they put out and the quality of the reflectors. As I said why pay big $$$ for a set of lights only to change the globes. You guys are all talking about spotties that have nothing on lightforce so the replacement globes may work a treat in those. I can't comment on other brands but I can say the any comparisons that have happened have all looked favourably on lightforce. This is for a very good reason. They are an outstanding light. I'm just confused as to where this thread was leading when your talking about skimping on the fitment of a $500+ pair of lights

I'm not going to skimp on globes, just really had a hard time with this whole load thing, advice is taken- I haven't acted on anything just as yet, hence why I'm seeking advice on different solutions. I'm pretty open minded and I'm not impulsive in my actions. All sounds good so far, if I can't sort out a decent alternator, I may try the phillips globes as a trial.

I saw on one of the other threads that a bloke had put twin batteries in and ran them at 24V and then ran that through a converter to I think about 14V which gave him around 1800 - 2000 CCA. This may be a bit more than you were thinking.

you will find that the XGT's globes can't be retro-fitted with any globes off the shelf from any parts store as they are a plug-in type globe specific to lightforce lamps, I wouldn't go nuts with wattage as I was once a 1000watt on the car type, now have +60 osram H4's, quality hella H4 inserts and a pair of XGT's 1 spot & 1 spread filter which gives me plenty of spread and about 800m of usable long distance light on the road. This is the best set-up I have had on a car to date. Just my 10c worth.