Outer Limits 4x4 Board

got to make some new tail shafts and was wondering wich way to go and ur thorts its on a zook that I plane to run patrol diffs and a sr20 auto set up on prob around 175 to 200 kw

for got to ad that I plan for big flex

I reckon using Unis.

Size for size uni's are stronger.

PigDog wrote:on a zook that I plane to run prob around 175 to 200 kw

That would be interesting.. how many would be out there pumping out a genuine 200rwkw??

at the end of the day thea won't be much zook left but hell that's half the fun and with the patrol diffs the pumpkin will be central compared to the zook's off set will this combined within big flex be to much for the uni and should I just use a weeker Cv in the rear

The issue won't be with handling the power but handling the flex. Uni's have shone in that area in the past. I have seen some wonderful advancements in CV technology to get extra deflection and strength, but for this I would be going the Uni.

As for 200rkw, that is going to be a really peaky motor to be at 300kw at the fly wheel as you will loose about 30% through the auto and the big Patrol diffs. Not what I would have through would go well in the rocks.. Unless you are using Nitrous to get this, then

- David

Uni's
http://www.ctmracing.com/

the motor use to make 200kw at the fly but its coped a bit of a floging since and seen a tree at high speed but it still runs good so I would think its some whea between 175 and 200kw but nitros dose sound fun

I thought that Antunac, Dobbin etc were putting chev power, crazy flex and sticky mumma tyres through CV's reliably.

is it going to be used on road? if so, you will need to use unis or invest in some very high end CV's. a regular front/rear axle CV is not designed to turn at 4x axle speed.

He never mentions rwkw, which is a big difference to fwkw. I think by 200kw he means fly. A 200rwkw SR will be a >5000rpm screamer, not a crawler.

For the record, > 200rwkw is fun, real fun....

yer it will be on the road every now and then at least until it is destroyed lol

dumbdunce wrote:is it going to be used on road? if so, you will need to use unis or invest in some very high end CV's. a regular front/rear axle CV is not designed to turn at 4x axle speed.

yeh what he said. A cv in a tail shaft application spins 400% faster(depending on diff ratio)than where they are designed to go. They will over heat, seize and expload in more pieces than a space shuttle (in that order) when driven at road speed. The more angle and road speed makes all this happen sooner.

commodore has used CV joints in their tailshafts since the VB 1979 so have jeep (cheerokee front shaft ) and toyota (rav 4 v6 2008) so i don't think speed will be a problem.

hiy6o wrote:commodore has used CV joints in their tailshafts since the VB 1979 so have jeep (cheerokee front shaft ) and toyota (rav 4 v6 2008) so i don't think speed will be a problem.

what angle of deflection can you get from them, the answer is not alot.

hiy6o wrote:commodore has used CV joints in their tailshafts since the VB 1979 so have jeep (cheerokee front shaft ) and toyota (rav 4 v6 2008) so i don't think speed will be a problem.

They are made differently, if compared side by side u can see the difference.
Dont use a commodore tail shaft cv, they are way not strong enough.

20% votes for CVs, wtf?

There is no question which is stronger.

chimpboy wrote: 20% votes for CVs, wtf?

There is no question which is stronger.

which is stronger?

really depends on the uni size

As said above , a cv which runs generally flat will not over heat and will last a lifetime in vehicle's without a great deal of deflection. They also have less load. A cv will not last very long at a sharp angle because they will overheat , become notchy and eventually fail. Centrifigal force will break the boot and you will loose your lubrication once the grease melts.

Vehicles such as glen dobbins vehicle where driven for short distances with the cv's fitted at high speed , and the vehicle's were generally driven at the lowest ride height lessening the angle on the cv's.

What length zook are you intending on running your patrol diffs in , the longer the better , also a zook transfer won't handle that sort of HP , also tyre size will affect drive line strength , I broke 3 transfer case with 35 inch tyres , with a 1.3 litre engine.

I ran a cv in my zook on the front and rear tailshafts , but due too many failures went back to uni , where I had no failures.

This was done by angling the transfer case down and sideways to ease the rear angle , allowing and uni tailshaft to be used , but still keeping the front cv , which was a 1.3 zook cv , welded to the tailshaft.

With your patrol diff being in the middle you are having to overcome two offsets , which will give a wicked vibration.

Just some food for thought , Cheers Paul.

hiy6o wrote:commodore has used CV joints in their tailshafts since the VB 1979 so have jeep (cheerokee front shaft ) and toyota (rav 4 v6 2008) so i don't think speed will be a problem.

Don't know about the commodore or the Rav - but the Jeep front shaft is NOT a CV, it's a double cardan shaft.

FWIW, Pajero NL swb use a CV in the rear driveshaft, at the transfer end.

redzook wrote:

chimpboy wrote: 20% votes for CVs, wtf?

There is no question which is stronger.

which is stronger?

really depends on the uni size

bingo!

just purely comparing - correlation of abuse, size V size they seem very similar. EG a D44 CTM shaft is of equivalent strength to a Toyota Longfield (both the same working envelope). BUT beware CV's generally don't like external forces applied to them (as much) as in when a tailshaft is getting driven into a rock face when trying to launch up a ledge.

IMO stick to unis as they are easy and cheap to replace on the trail...