Outer Limits 4x4 Board

Hi,

I am looking to replace the headlight on my Landcruiser 1992 as they are performing substandard and rusting on the reflector.

I was also looking at the HID upgrade kits on ebay.

I then read this site. I am concerned that installing HID will cause glare for other motorist.

http://www.intellexual.net/hid.html

So my question is, how do the HID perform?

Is there a lot of glare for other drivers?

What are the legal standings on using HID?

Since I have to replace the head light assembly, is there one which will come with the correct reflectors. Have the correct cut off, and be suitable for HID?

Thanks for any advice.

as far as new reflectors.

ARB have the IPF ones are these work great. even better with HID.

nicbeer wrote:as far as new reflectors.

ARB have the IPF ones are these work great. even better with HID.

Are they designed for HID, as in do they have the correct cut offs and block glare from other drivers.

Trev has HID's in his 60 series now, ask him what he thinks of them, last i heard he loves them,

he only bought the low beam kit, so in theory, illegal, but reckons most times now he doesn't need high beams at all,

I have spoken to trev already, and he said he does get flashed by other cars a bit. Since I need to replace the whole unit I was looking for something that could overcome the glare issue, which would mean less attention from the coppers and not pissing so many people off.

ozy1 wrote:but reckons most times now he doesn't need high beams at all,

Which means they're not adjusted properly, so he's a road hazard.

Toli wrote:I have spoken to trev already, and he said he does get flashed by other cars a bit.

Yep. Road hazard.

Anything constructive to add to assist me with doing this correctly Scott?

From what I have read, (Not sure if this is correct someone can correct me) is it is not just about adjustment. The reflector needs to be correct or it will throw light everywhere.

Toli wrote:Anything constructive to add to assist me with doing this correctly Scott?

From what I have read, (Not sure if this is correct someone can correct me) is it is not just about adjustment. The reflector needs to be correct or it will throw light everywhere.

I had similar problem only fitted HID to my hi beam but the light spread was shit I ended up going back to Halogen.

Toli wrote:Anything constructive to add to assist me with doing this correctly Scott?

From what I have read, (Not sure if this is correct someone can correct me) is it is not just about adjustment. The reflector needs to be correct or it will throw light everywhere.

I know you feel Scott is not being constructive but to be honest, I just don't think there is a correct or acceptable way to fit HID low beams without actively self-levelling lamps. High beam is more debatable (since you'll dip back down to low when other cars are around anyway) but afaik still not legal.

I really wanted to put HIDs in both my cars at one stage but I ended up concluding that it's a good spotlight upgrade only. The people selling the gear will say otherwise but they won't pay your fine for you.

Yes, glare is an issue for other drivers.
Yes there are legal ramifications.
You lights need to be self leveling and need to have a reflector designed for the hid globe.
I wouldn't recommend converting your headlights. All it does it create anger with other drivers and makes you constantly conscious of pissing people off. There isn't too many situations where you need your low beam to be that bright. And when those situations do occur maybe it's just safwer to slow down to a speed where your visibility is matched to the speed you travel.

Go the IPF replacements.

I had these on my old 4runner and they were absolutely fantastic.

I had the special globes in them, (can't rem,emmber what they were) but the outer rim glowed blue for a couple of minutes when they were switched off. You will not be sorry. As for the cost, close your eyes fork over the doe and relsh you new lighting on the first night run.

Cheers Chris

I have done a lot more reading and searching into it. I am waiting for some feed back from some US places I email next week so I will make a decision then.

If you need more light on low beam have you considered fog lamps? AFAIK, these normally have a very sharp low cut-off (so shouldn't blind oncoming traffic), and typically a good spread. Of course, it is illegal to run fog lights when visibility isn't low, but plenty of people seem to get away with it.

The next question then becomes how often do you need this extra light? In more than 20 years I can only think of one occasion when I would've liked better low beam light - on that occasion, I simply drove slower. But I will admit I don't do much long distance night driving. Not that I actively avoid it, I just don't seem to do it.

I would not bother with the fogs, as you said it is still illegal and in my opinion does not offer extra vision.

I am not after more low beam light, (standard lights when work properly were ok with the use of high beam) I was mainly interested in the difference the whiter light from HID makes to fatigue when driving at night. I don't drive at night much and do try to avoid it, but being a touring truck there are times when it can not be avoided.

Since I need to fix the lights no matter what I thought I would look into the HID's.

scott in my defence i have hid and yes they are bright yes. but they are fitted to a SOA 60 series with 35 inch tyres so even with head lights propley adjusted (as i have the equipment to do so)and 55 watt globes i get flashed i get people pulling up next to me shaking there heads and so on so on just people that have noting better to do with there lifes but hate 4wd you see these little rice burners with them fitted and they are bright even my cruiser wonder how many time they get flashed any way thats my 2 cents

mr304 wrote:scott in my defence i have hid and yes they are bright yes. but they are fitted to a SOA 60 series with 35 inch tyres so even with head lights propley adjusted (as i have the equipment to do so)and 55 watt globes i get flashed i get people pulling up next to me shaking there heads and so on so on just people that have noting better to do with there lifes but hate 4wd you see these little rice burners with them fitted and they are bright even my cruiser wonder how many time they get flashed any way thats my 2 cents

So, you know that your headlights will shine into other vehicles and distract other drivers, even when you are using globes which produce the maximum legal brightness, and you choose to run HID low beams anyway?

I would flash you and shake my head too.

Have you engineered your SOA and 35s?

mr304 wrote:you see these little rice burners with them fitted and they are bright

I dunno, I think they are much less of a problem on a lower sort of car.

But I still think they suck. I even find them annoying on cars that were made with them, the "self levelling" is by no means perfect from what I can see.

I don't see the point at all on low beam. It is 100% unnecessary. It only makes sense to me for driving conditions where you would be firing up your spotlights anyway, hence why I think they are a great spotlight upgrade (but a pointless headlight upgrade).

Can anyone explain what benefits HIDs have on low beam? What is the situation where HID low beams are doing anything useful?

Yes I can answer this

Can anyone explain what benefits HIDs have on low beam? What is the situation where HID low beams are doing anything useful?

The main benefit for hid on low beam is that 95% of time driving is on low beam. Hid's reduce driver fatigue, the light is much easier on the eyes if the correct colour is chosen ie 4300k (not blue)
Yes hid's in your low beam are illegal regardless of self leveling / washers etc (unless the whole system has been ADR approved and there are no ADR approved aftermarket kits.) but so are halogen globes that increase the wattage by more than 30% so all 90/100 halogen globes are also illegal.

Yes, glare is an issue for other drivers.

agreed, depending on what wattage you are running. 55w is too high for your low beam. The new kits we have available now have shields around them to cut off the glare to oncoming traffic. But ther are not ADR approved and still not legal.
In answer to your original questions. You have the advantage of being able to upgrade your high beam to hid and keep low beam std if you wish to keep it all legal. My recomendation would be to replace the 4 reflectors with good quality ie Hella / ipf. Fit your low beam with a +50 or +90 halogen (these from hella are ADR approved) globe and upgrade your high beam to 35 or 50w hid.
Just contact me if you have any questions, i'm happy to help whenever I can.
Cheers
Steve

on4tou wrote:Hid's reduce driver fatigue, the light is much easier on the eyes if the correct colour is chosen ie 4300k (not blue)

I have heard this a few times now and I find it hard to swallow. Is there any evidence for it, other than the fact that more light = less fatigue? I've been completely unable to find any real research supporting the "easier on the eye" argument.

This is interesting:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1771460/

To be honest part of me just thinks: if you hate everyone else on the road so much why not just throw rocks at cars coming the other way? Why go to the expense of installing HID low beams, especially in a raised 4WD?

on4tou wrote:In answer to your original questions. You have the advantage of being able to upgrade your high beam to hid and keep low beam std if you wish to keep it all legal. My recomendation would be to replace the 4 reflectors with good quality ie Hella / ipf. Fit your low beam with a +50 or +90 halogen (these from hella are ADR approved) globe and upgrade your high beam to 35 or 50w hid.

Is there an H4 insert available with an incandescent low beam and an HID high beam? Or would this be shiat because the low beam is going to die long before the high beam and you'd have to replace the whole globe..?

This is interesting:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1771460/

yes it is

I have heard this a few times now and I find it hard to swallow. Is there any evidence for it, other than the fact that more light = less fatigue? I've been completely unable to find any real research supporting the "easier on the eye" argument.

i have read quite a few reports from Hella and Phillips and basically it come down to pupil dilation .

other than the fact that more light = less fatigue?

that is basically the answer

Is there an H4 insert available with an incandescent low beam and an HID high beam? Or would this be shiat because the low beam is going to die long before the high beam and you'd have to replace the whole globe..?

yes there is but you are left in the dark when the HID starts up and most of the manufacturers that i have had a talk with say the halogen globe is just 35w

To be honest part of me just thinks: if you hate everyone else on the road so much why not just throw rocks at cars coming the other way? Why go to the expense of installing HID low beams, especially in a raised 4WD?

i did advised him to hid high beam only
Steve

on4tou wrote:

To be honest part of me just thinks: if you hate everyone else on the road so much why not just throw rocks at cars coming the other way? Why go to the expense of installing HID low beams, especially in a raised 4WD?

i did advised him to hid high beam only

I know, I wasn't having a go at you. But if I get a chance I try to discourage people from putting HID low beams in, just as a fellow road-user.

Toli wrote: I am not after more low beam light, (standard lights when work properly were ok with the use of high beam) I was mainly interested in the difference the whiter light from HID makes to fatigue when driving at night. .

Have you investigated different colour globes? Usually identified by K's tempature in kelvin. ie 4300K , 7000K is this available? A low number (yellow) colour may be better for you than say 7000k (blue) there is a bit around in zenon gas. So maybe not the legal problems, and less $$
Once you are target it aint over til the people in blue finish and it gets expensive and inconvienent quick without even getting to problems for other road users.
They have been kind to you here y

I know, I wasn't having a go at you. But if I get a chance I try to discourage people from putting HID low beams in, just as a fellow road-user.

yer i know mate
but most new cars in the next 5 year will have them as standard
a 7000k globe would be s--t to drive with i think the ADR say you can not go above 4300k
steve

zackde wrote:

Toli wrote:Anything constructive to add to assist me with doing this correctly Scott?

From what I have read, (Not sure if this is correct someone can correct me) is it is not just about adjustment. The reflector needs to be correct or it will throw light everywhere.

I had similar problem only fitted HID to my hi beam but the light spread was shit I ended up going back to Halogen.

I found similar to Zackde. I fitted a Hi/Lo Hid kit to my 80series, I liked the light and found it definitely had benifits, ie better lighting of the road shoulder,and road surface close to the vehicle as well as lighting up the road further ahead.
I found it better for my eyes, but the spread was not correct and caused problems for other cars.
I couldn't get the balance between Lo beam an Hi beam focus correct, I had a ballast blow after about 6months, and went back to halogen globes.

If I wsa going to do it again, I would look for lights with the correct reflectors/lenses.