Outer Limits 4x4 Board

g'day guys im looking at putting a 5 link in my paj but im haveing trouble finding info about the setup of them, does anyone know where i can find a suspension geometry calculator or anything to help me set it all up. and help would be great thanks Ryan.

Why a a 5-link over the more traditional 4 or 3 links?

I can't think of a reason to run a 5 link if one of the other setups will fit in the available space.

That said, you could probably plug your numbers in to the 4 link calculator and get it fairly close. You may get funky roll axis and roll centre figures though. Same detail with the 3 link calc.

well ill be using johnny joints so i wont have any binding issues and i just prefer having an extra link on the top for safety more than any thing, so it has 2 bolts up top instead of it all just relying on the one top link bolt, imagine if it snapped for some unknown reason on the road doing 100km total mess, this is why i want to go with the 5 link and have 2 uppers and 2 lowers with panhard.
Cheers Ryan.

well ill be using johnny joints so i wont have any binding issues and i just prefer having an extra link on the top for safety more than any thing, so it has 2 bolts up top instead of it all just relying on the one top link bolt, imagine if it snapped for some unknown reason on the road doing 100km total mess, this is why i want to go with the 5 link and have 2 uppers and 2 lowers with panhard.
Cheers Ryan.

what did Franks have after the live axle conversion?

that was 5 link iirc with a bundera diff in it

95shorty wrote:well ill be using johnny joints so i wont have any binding issues and i just prefer having an extra link on the top for safety more than any thing, so it has 2 bolts up top instead of it all just relying on the one top link bolt, imagine if it snapped for some unknown reason on the road doing 100km total mess, this is why i want to go with the 5 link and have 2 uppers and 2 lowers with panhard.
Cheers Ryan.

So go a 4 link. You get 2 uppers located to the diff by two separate bolts.


Anyway, it's your car regardless so you should build it however you want. Assuming it's for the rear I'd be modeling it off the 80 series or GQ rear ends as they both have decent handling characteristics and acceptable offroad performance.


AFAIK, heims or johnny joints are illegal for on road use too. Obviously, check with your engineer but that's what I was lead to believe. A very good alternative is GQ bushes. Approx. 30deg. of flex before binding and readily available.


If you could give a few more details regarding intended usage, what you like to wheel and preference for legality etc. it would be helpful. Also, there are hundreds, if not thousands of rigs that wheel extremely hard that are fine with a 3 link or A-arm setup. Just fyi.

v840 wrote:

95shorty wrote:well ill be using johnny joints so i wont have any binding issues and i just prefer having an extra link on the top for safety more than any thing, so it has 2 bolts up top instead of it all just relying on the one top link bolt, imagine if it snapped for some unknown reason on the road doing 100km total mess, this is why i want to go with the 5 link and have 2 uppers and 2 lowers with panhard.
Cheers Ryan.

So go a 4 link. You get 2 uppers located to the diff by two separate bolts.


Anyway, it's your car regardless so you should build it however you want. Assuming it's for the rear I'd be modeling it off the 80 series or GQ rear ends as they both have decent handling characteristics and acceptable offroad performance.


AFAIK, heims or johnny joints are illegal for on road use too. Obviously, check with your engineer but that's what I was lead to believe. A very good alternative is GQ bushes. Approx. 30deg. of flex before binding and readily available.


If you could give a few more details regarding intended usage, what you like to wheel and preference for legality etc. it would be helpful. Also, there are hundreds, if not thousands of rigs that wheel extremely hard that are fine with a 3 link or A-arm setup. Just fyi.

But 80 series and GQ rear suspensions have 2 lower + 2 upper + panhard = 5 links.

95shorty wrote:well ill be using johnny joints so i wont have any binding issues and i just prefer having an extra link on the top for safety more than any thing, so it has 2 bolts up top instead of it all just relying on the one top link bolt, imagine if it snapped for some unknown reason on the road doing 100km total mess, this is why i want to go with the 5 link and have 2 uppers and 2 lowers with panhard.
Cheers Ryan.

If it is properly engineered and constructed, why would this be an issue ?
The hardware to do this kind of thing right is readily available (a three link) ..

Bush65 wrote: But 80 series and GQ rear suspensions have 2 lower + 2 upper + panhard = 5 links.

Sorry, I didn't make myself very clear. I was saying that if he's made up his mind to go a 5 link then a GQ or 80 rear setup is a good starting point as they're both pretty good from the factory.

ahh sorry guys its for the front and i want to set it up like franks pajero but using johnny joints instead of the patrol type bushes, ive already bought the j/j anyway. i have flipped a early model hilux housing to get the pumpkin on the left hand side and im just waiting for some parts to turn up and ill be into it. ill probably use race runner coilovers for the suspension. this is why i was trying to chase some info for setting up the 5 link to get the anti dive and squat setup. after ive done the front then ill go ahead later on and do a dual triangulated 4 link rear end.

v840 wrote:A very good alternative is GQ bushes. Approx. 30deg. of flex before binding and readily available.

What GQ bushes You exactly think ??

Uh, again, I'm sorry, but I don't really understand what you're asking?

Are you asking which bushes? Lower control arm ones.


Are you asking why I think they're a good alternative? Well, for the reasons I outlined in my above post.


I think we got a bit "lost in translation" there. If you could specify exactly what you meant I can answer you better.

Lost on translation

v840 wrote:Lower control arm ones.

It was the answer - thanks

Are lower control arm bushes on both end of arm same ?

On the rear of a Y60/Y61 or GQ/GU, yes, Yes they are.

95shorty wrote:ahh sorry guys its for the front and i want to set it up like franks pajero but using johnny joints instead of the patrol type bushes, ive already bought the j/j anyway. i have flipped a early model hilux housing to get the pumpkin on the left hand side and im just waiting for some parts to turn up and ill be into it. ill probably use race runner coilovers for the suspension. this is why i was trying to chase some info for setting up the 5 link to get the anti dive and squat setup. after ive done the front then ill go ahead later on and do a dual triangulated 4 link rear end.

If ya flipped it, Won't it run backwards??? Buggies do this when the motor is in the back.

Instead of flipping you just want to swap the axles tubes for side to side. Rhett did this in his zuk buggy for the rear steer.

If ya flipped it, Won't it run backwards??? Buggies do this when the motor is in the back.

Instead of flipping you just want to swap the axles tubes for side to side. Rhett did this in his zuk buggy for the rear steer.[/quote]


hey this is what i done to the housing
http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/ftopic197209.php

Willy Hilux wrote:

95shorty wrote:ahh sorry guys its for the front and i want to set it up like franks pajero but using johnny joints instead of the patrol type bushes, ive already bought the j/j anyway. i have flipped a early model hilux housing to get the pumpkin on the left hand side and im just waiting for some parts to turn up and ill be into it. ill probably use race runner coilovers for the suspension. this is why i was trying to chase some info for setting up the 5 link to get the anti dive and squat setup. after ive done the front then ill go ahead later on and do a dual triangulated 4 link rear end.

If ya flipped it, Won't it run backwards??? Buggies do this when the motor is in the back.

Instead of flipping you just want to swap the axles tubes for side to side. Rhett did this in his zuk buggy for the rear steer.

I reckon you would flip the housing and rotate the third to acheive what is required.

Cheers