Outer Limits 4x4 Board

Just pulled some no name Chinese crap winch out of a a friends Patrol. ( he bought the car with the winch already fitted )

And yes it doesn't even have a name on it!!

It's stuffed. not because of the motor or gear box but cause the free spool won't lock or unlock as the engagement lever is shagged. probably been used half a dozen times if it's lucky.

Now Name brand Chinese winches like TJM, Ironman etc wouldn't have this issue as you can get parts for them. for the sake of a $5 part this winch is now scrap.

I could probably make a new one, but given the time required and machining costs, it's probably going to cost more than the winch did

Spend your $$ wisely guys



Rant over

It's not the same design as the "name brand" part, just made from inferior material? Can you find a "name brand" equivalent part to fit?

-Scott- wrote:It's not the same design as the "name brand" part, just made from inferior material? Can you find a "name brand" equivalent part to fit?

I've got a heap of TJM OX spares at work, it looks Similar not gunna hold my breath though.



Got the gearbox apart now, looks like it was lubricated with a combination of whale fat and cooking oil......smelly gunky crap

Whats the part look like?

I have rebuilt 3 warns already this year with the same issue

Id just try cleaning everything up, 99% chance its just the grease has got wet n gone hard. The only winch im yet to see get full of water stock is a Tmax

most of the cheapos are the same winch and alot of warn/tjm etc parts bolt straight on if not the bit are for sale on ebay

It's the free spool handle that's broken. on the bottom where it engages the drive dog it's broken off.

I think it's made from chrome plated Blu-Tac

I'll buy it off you for $5.00, I've got plently of time to make a new $5.00 part to get it going again.

Does it look simple to machine?

Can't weld to it, I'm going to see if I can get some tool steel tomorrow and dowel it. if that don't work I'll salvage the motor cable and solenoids for another winch to use on the car trailer and he'll be getting a new Premier or Tigerz

The "grease" some of the cheap winches comes with is closer to varnish IMO.... repack them with something decent ( and check the clearances whilst your at it..... )

Mine has been used occaisionally and over a few years and apart from crap assembly wasn't badly made.

A hour or so putting it together properly ( i made some brass shims ) and the thing performs well - and is a heap quieter as well.

I've seen people use excessive force on engagement levers - shit if the teeth aren't aligned then force isn't going to help.

why would anyone pay for a cheap Chinese winch?

You use winches to get out of situations when alone or when its a life depending situation and it needs to work flawlessly. I think Warn is bad enough quality as it is. Depending on a crap winch is 100x worse than not having one at all and not getting into the situation!

If it looks simple to machine, i could possibly make one for you. Mill/Lathe Unless you have the tooling. Just make another.

Black Bull wrote:I think it's made from chrome plated Blu-Tac

Does not matter whether it is a cheap or expensive they all need maintanance. The down fall is finding parts for a winch that has no name on it.

Cris

Black Bull wrote:Can't weld to it, I'm going to see if I can get some tool steel tomorrow and dowel it. if that don't work I'll salvage the motor cable and solenoids for another winch to use on the car trailer and he'll be getting a new Premier or Tigerz

Don't try and weld to it as it will not be any stronger as the parent metal is the weak point. make a new one or modify one that is close to the original dimension to one that you can obtain.

A picture would be handy.

SOMETTHING LIKE THIS YOU ARE LOOKING FOR ??

http://www.tigerz11.com.au/images/003.JPG

Edit: please resize pics before posting.

tigerz11 wrote:SOMETTHING LIKE THIS YOU ARE LOOKING FOR ??

http://www.tigerz11.com.au/images/003.JPG

I wanna know what the Electric Breast Expo is about on the paper

bru21 wrote:why would anyone pay for a cheap Chinese winch?

You use winches to get out of situations when alone or when its a life depending situation and it needs to work flawlessly. I think Warn is bad enough quality as it is. Depending on a crap winch is 100x worse than not having one at all and not getting into the situation!

The assumption that expensive = good isn't always the case IMO. Winches don't always get used when alone or for life threatening situations, in fact i've never used a winch in any situation that fits into that category.

I don't think a Warn is worth 4 (?) times my cheapy.... my opinion is that they are selling on a reputation that was created when they didn't have much competition but each to their own. Good on them - cash in on it, but some of the competion for Warn appear to be good products and at much reduced prices.

At some point you have to draw the line with the $$$, no winch is perfect - my thoughts are that any going winch is a damm site better than nothing - and i rather would have enough money left to get rid of the steel cable and use something that is definately a safety improvement.

Now that mines properly assembled ( and i admit it should have been assembled better right out of the box - but that's not a design issue ) its been a reliable unit that has done the job when its needed - regularly maintain it and its still in good condition internally.

Knowing the limits of what you have and how to use it is the only safe option.

MightyMouse wrote: 1) no winch is perfect -
2) my thoughts are that any going winch is a damm site better than nothing - .

1) agree
2) when its the only thing holding you up as its draggin you up some stupid slimey steep hill that if the winch does shit itself, and unspool you at 500kph backwards down that hill cause it failed, then no, not anything is better than nothing. I think thats wat he means. Any winch can do this. but I wouldnt put my $50k 4b and families life in the hands of a $100 aldi winch.

YMMV totally.

bogged wrote:

tigerz11 wrote:SOMETTHING LIKE THIS YOU ARE LOOKING FOR ??

http://www.tigerz11.com.au/images/003.JPG

I wanna know what the Electric Breast Expo is about on the paper

ah ah ,, wife had a baby 2 weeks ago ,,,they tell me i needed to buy a milk extractor thing ,,i rang the chemist asking for a electric breast milk extractor ,,,,got hung up on twice they thought i was a nutter

tigerz11 wrote: ah ah ,, wife had a baby 2 weeks ago ,,,they tell me i needed to buy a milk extractor thing ,,i rang the chemist asking for a electric breast milk extractor ,,,,got hung up on twice they thought i was a nutter

Ring back and ask for a breast pump for expressing milk. And maybe try asking this time without the heavy breathing... just sayin...

Tigerz, yeah it looks something like that but without the grooves. pin is offset to the outside more though, it's right on the edge and it looks like it need to be to get the travel required.

I've got an OX one here I'm going to try tonight. if that fails I'll dowel the old one.....then maybe a new winch

As to the Chinese V's Warn debate.....

I sell Premier, TJM OX, Warn and Ironman Winches. with the exception of the Premier they're pretty much of a muchness, I've got customers that use them and abuse them. maintained they're all good decent winches.

IF your going to go touring the country and want a winch "Just in case" sure buy the cheaper version. just make sure it gets maintained just like any other part of the vehicle.

The biggest difference between these "name" brand Chinese winches and the ones you buy at Aldi or supercrap is that their is warranty that is actually worth something and parts backup.

Tigerez11 is that free spool lever compatible with a warn low mount?
It looks pretty similar.
If it is how much?

cheers

badger wrote:Tigerez11 is that free spool lever compatible with a warn low mount?
It looks pretty similar.
If it is how much?

cheers

Im not sure ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,$1 plus freight

Black Bull wrote: I sell Premier, TJM OX, Warn and Ironman Winches. with the exception of the Premier they're pretty much of a muchness, I've got customers that use them and abuse them. maintained they're all good decent winches.

.

So you can get parts for Ironman winches?

please tell me i have a 12k pound winch with a water logged motor. The brush holder cleaned up ok but the brushes were damaged when i was trying to get them out of the holder.

Do the brushes come with the wiring cast into them?

I'm hoping to get new brushes and springs, or the whole assembly at the right price, if possible.

While the tigerz winches are appealing I'd rather salvage this one for a few more years of use.

bogged wrote:

MightyMouse wrote: 1) no winch is perfect -
2) my thoughts are that any going winch is a damm site better than nothing - .

1) agree
2) when its the only thing holding you up as its draggin you up some stupid slimey steep hill that if the winch does shit itself, and unspool you at 500kph backwards down that hill cause it failed, then no, not anything is better than nothing. I think thats wat he means. Any winch can do this. but I wouldnt put my $50k 4b and families life in the hands of a $100 aldi winch.

YMMV totally.

Valid points of course bogged however I would interject that most people buying and using these winches do so for light duty occasional use and would rarely put themselves into such a difficult situation in the first place and if they did think they could do so and thrash a cheap winch hard and regularly then they are kidding themselves.
Secondly it's good to hear you value your familys life so strongly which makes me wonder why you put your family into that situation in the first place. If you are undertaking such hardcore terrain where there is the possibility of that scenario arising and you have those thoughts in the back of your mind, I would think it is not the place for children etc in the first place.

oldmate wrote:

Black Bull wrote: I sell Premier, TJM OX, Warn and Ironman Winches. with the exception of the Premier they're pretty much of a muchness, I've got customers that use them and abuse them. maintained they're all good decent winches.

.

So you can get parts for Ironman winches?

please tell me i have a 12k pound winch with a water logged motor. The brush holder cleaned up ok but the brushes were damaged when i was trying to get them out of the holder.

Do the brushes come with the wiring cast into them?

I'm hoping to get new brushes and springs, or the whole assembly at the right price, if possible.

While the tigerz winches are appealing I'd rather salvage this one for a few more years of use.

Oldmate, have you taken the brushes to your local auto elec parts store? They can usually match most brushes with another make of part. I have also bought slightly oversized brushes and filed them down to suit with great success. Most brushes come with the wiring cast into them.

Well it gets better, Should have given up, but I'm trying to save moose some money, that and I owe him a big favour.
So anyways, had most of the gearbox soaking in some solvent to dissolve all the Dim Sum flavoured cooking fat it was lubricated with, Lo and behold the primary stage of the planetary is seized solid. the secondary not much better.
The planetary set is solid riveted together so not much hope of shimming and repairing it either.

So now I have a full post mortem.

Planetary set seized.
Caused solenoids to burn out. (To scared to look at the motor now!! even though it was working)
Caused Moose to whale on the free spool lever to try and unhook the tensioned cable and break it.

So now he has a rebuilt solenoid pack, a new freespool lever (yep the ox one fitted with a little Mod)
and a stuffed gearbox!

Oldmate I can ask about the brushes tomorrow if you like, have to order some stuff from them anyway.

All this talk of life and death situations......... way over dramatized.

if that's the situation you are buying a winch for then only the best will do, i'm sure there are megabuck ones out there ( still a risk in these "life and death" situations..... ). And it better be frequently maintained with new cable "just in case".

The vast majority of winching i've done / seen is pretty light duty and low risk ( except for the @#$% steel cable ) so as long as the winch works thats' cool - its done exactly what i needed it for.

Even with the best of equipment - things go wrong, if you don't manage the risk then no matter what your using your taking unnecessary chances.