Outer Limits 4x4 Board

Hey guys,

I am in the process of building a hard core rock toy mainly for tuff truck. It may not be approved of as its a Suzuki Sierra cab on a gq patrol chassis with tube tray and loads of bar work.

What I would like to know is should I go full hydro or just assist for the front diff and what brands etc. I haven't played with hydro assist or full hydro so some pros and cons of either would be great.

Also thought whilst I was there I should rear steer it straight away, would it be possible to just put a front diff straight in the rear, does it not matter if drive shaft is offset etc. Just want to ask now rather than learn later that it can't be done this way.

Any help would be greatly appreciated

Regards
Mitch

Hydro Assist or Full Hydro... what size tyres you running, do you want it regoed, you need to give alittle more info... If its an unregoed car/buggy go full hydro.. Speek to Chris at Locktup for your hydro needs

rear steer.. no it doesnt really matter that you will have an off set diff centre as you are building a crawler .. mine runs rear steer with off set rear diff and didnt have any tailshaft or drive issues at tuff truck...

Thanks matt, its going to do event like tought truck but also willowgleen, toperi etc, will be registered still win wink I am concerned about just using a front diff in the rear as gear sets will be running backwards etc.
Also what can be done about the linkages being on the underside for nissan application etc.
As for tyres just 38 inch tyres for smaller comps and big tyres for tuff truck etc like 42s
Would still like to local wheel so assist I think for the front but yeh just let me know what u know and I can go from there

Regards
Mitch

unmass wrote:Thanks matt, its going to do event like tought truck but also willowgleen, toperi etc, will be registered still win wink I am concerned about just using a front diff in the rear as gear sets will be running backwards etc.
Also what can be done about the linkages being on the underside for nissan application etc.
As for tyres just 38 inch tyres for smaller comps and big tyres for tuff truck etc like 42s
Would still like to local wheel so assist I think for the front but yeh just let me know what u know and I can go from there

Regards
Mitch

Im using a front pinion in my rear diff now. No issues so far. looking for another front diff to use for rear steer atm. depending on motivation ill just run the diff as is or flip and cut the knuckles to have both pumpkins on the same side.
With the linkages do you mean the tie rod? if you run a gq diff you can use mq knuckles, if your running a gu youll have to make your own hi steer.

Use a 60 series diff for the rear steer, will drive on the correct side of the gears and long fields are available along with various steer arms and hub upgrades.

Yeh I'm not to keen on putting toyota gear under a patrol chassis. As for mq knuckles they make it high steer right.

Pretty keen to see a patrol rear steer just might have to sort out a deal on rams so I'm convinced to buy 2 at once andy more info would be great

Thanks guys

Regards
Mitch

If you want to be cheap with your rams I herd of a guy using rams off a tractor and a steering box out of a fork lift to get his hydro steer working on the cheap

How cheap is cheap sounds interesting. Just want a good price really with all hardware.

Still need to know what's required etc

Regards
Mitch

unmass wrote:Yeh I'm not to keen on putting toyota gear under a patrol chassis. As for mq knuckles they make it high steer right.

Pretty keen to see a patrol rear steer just might have to sort out a deal on rams so I'm convinced to buy 2 at once andy more info would be great

Thanks guys

Regards
Mitch

Yeah theyll make it high steer. I think matt is using tractor rams? just decide what size stroke you want and single or double ended, could try ebay then.

Rear steer in a patrol isnt the best idea IMO

The full chassis is too wide to accomodate rear steer to its full potential.

better off goin for a dig unit, unless narrowing the chassis is an option

Yeh I will be making chassis into a truggy style with coilovers and 4 link.

As for what ram size being stroke etc. What measurements do I need to take and also what pump etc to use

Has any one got some detailed pics of there set up.

Regards
Mitch

Pump u can get away with a falcon power steering pump there is heaps of info on here bout that there is a easy way to work out the ram ring locked up 4x4 and find out what size theres comes in buy theres or sorce 1 the same from a earthmoving /engeering shop there are a few options with that the ones that lift slashers up and down on the back of tractors would probally do it. steer box ring a forklift wrecker and see what they are worth. And 4 the rear depending how you wanted it to work I was thinking a 2 way control 1 for left and 1 for right as in 1 opens the ram and 1 returns it to closed position just a few ideas that I thought of when I was thinking of building something new

Thanks for the info it is really help full now just to start gathering parts I reckon.

Regards
Mitch

If your building it for Willowglen just remember u can run full hydro or rear steer.
There was a red 40 at Tuff Truck(dragtec?) that ran a GU in the rear. I think he just flipped the housing(castor doesnt matter at TT speed) and maybe swapped in a rear centre?

Not just gonna build it for willowgleen but if it doesn't comply ill just wheel with works 4 runner. Can u run hydro assist at willowgleen?

I think ill go assist so I don't get so many penalties at Toperi etc. As for tuff truck no holds bars if u wanna be competitive. Does any one have some photos for the rig from tuff truck with a nissan rear diff?

Regards
Mitch

unmass wrote:Yeh I'm not to keen on putting toyota gear under a patrol chassis. As for mq knuckles they make it high steer right.

Pretty keen to see a patrol rear steer just might have to sort out a deal on rams so I'm convinced to buy 2 at once andy more info would be great

Thanks guys

Regards
Mitch

A patrol diff is to piss weak for rear steer and so is a built 60 series diff. Your only real choices that will handle rear steer without constant breakages are Mogs, Dana 60s or Rockwells.

I looked into this pretty thoroughly before relising my only real choice was Mogs. You cant really build a GU diff to be that strong for going forward let alone in reverse, a built 60 series diff wil cost you the same as a Mog diff and there still not as strong and don't have portals.

If you want a well built reliable comp truck your going to have to get around this Nissan parts only crap or you will be in the pits more then your out.

Cheers Mick.

Yeh that's all well in theory to just put portal axles in but the cost factor would be rather high. When I get sick of fixing stuff which breakages are inevitable just look at every comp there is always someone breaking something than ill put mogs or portals in.

As Matt said he order mog diffs co he was sick of polishing a turd. If I had a fair bit $ore coin I would just order portals. But for now I'm going to stick with what I've got in nissan stuff until I'm over breaking stuff anyway.

Regards
Mitch

My point was the cost factor of getting a GU diff or 60 series diff to handle rear steer is dear to start with and will still fail. I personly would wait until you can afford to do it properly. There is no point in doing it on the cheap and blowing $1200 on entry fee plus all the other costs just to get to tuff truck and sit in the pits all weekend because you did it on the cheap.

You would be far better off building your rig as strong as you can and leaving the rear steer till later. There are plenty of competive trucks at tuff truck that don't have rear steer that get in the top 10 and some like Pirate have won it.

This is what i would do if I was in your shoes.

Cheers Mick.

Yeh good point I was just thinking about it coz I was doing a body swap etc. But at the moment I am probably just going to concentrate on sorting cab swap out with its new engine combo etc.

Just out of curiosity what are a set of mog diffs worth?

Regards
Mitch

I'm pretty sure Matt was getting his for about $4000 both steer diffs with factory lockers and I'm pretty sure he can get more for that price.

So when you look at the price of GU diffs and then add lockers the Mogs are probably cheaper. There's just a lot more fabrication to get them to work though.

Cheers Mick.

Cheers Mick I wish I had 4 grand need to sell my turbo falcon then and start saving. Where about did he say he was getting them from?

Regards
Mitch

Mates selling his rear steer gu diff

unmass wrote:Cheers Mick I wish I had 4 grand need to sell my turbo falcon then and start saving. Where about did he say he was getting them from?

Regards
Mitch

You would be better off PMing him about it as i'm not 100% sure on that mate. Here's the thread where he was talking about it.

http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/viewtopic ... 2&t=221986" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Cheers Mick.

WICKED wrote:Mates selling his rear steer gu diff

Hey mate what sort of coin does ur mate want for his gu rear steer diff?

Regards
Mitch