Polyairs,effect on full flex?correct setups for heavy tourer

[Bingham]

Had a look but nothing come up on the effect of airbags in the rear of 2 x mates utes getting ready for cape. With my limited understanding with the airbags is that while all good at minor to medium flex at full airpressure they should be fine but full flex would be limited ?

So in 95% of scenarios they would be fine but for arguement sake the Old Tellegrah line is fairly washed out and cut up the benifit of lifting the rear to carry canopies might be offset by a slight lack in flex?????????????????????????

Not talkign your dad towing a boat to fraser etc using only mild flex but more for if full flex was needed then have no choice but to sacrifice height??

Thoughts ok but Facts preffered .

[hillbilliywheelchair]

dont go poly air go propper air bags as they usally have alot more strech and if your realy worryied about flex but a cross link valve in (links the to bags together their for when 1 bag gets forced up it forces the other down)

[mick80]

If u have weight it will flex !!
Cheers mick

[mick80]

Fact!!!!!!!
Cheers mick

[oldmate]

It depends what poly airs you have. The kind that sit in a coil are not connected to the top or bottom mounts. So they will not limit down travel. They may limit up travel if you have too much air in them/not enough weight in the back.

Then there are the polyair setups for leaf spring types that are mounted to the axle and chassis. There is potential for limiting flex, but I can only assume poly air took that into consideration and made the bags long enough for the travel of a given setup. They do have different setups for standard height and 2 inch lifts. Only way to be sure is to flex your truck right up, measure the axle to chassis clearance and then compare that to the fully extended position of the poly air assembly.

[mick80]

It depends what poly airs you have. The kind that sit in a coil are not connected to the top or bottom mounts. So they will not limit down travel. They may limit up travel if you have too much air in them/not enough weight in the back.

Then there are the polyair setups for leaf spring types that are mounted to the axle and chassis. There is potential for limiting flex, but I can only assume poly air took that into consideration and made the bags long enough for the travel of a given setup. They do have different setups for standard height and 2 inch lifts. Only way to be sure is to flex your truck right up, measure the axle to chassis clearance and then compare that to the fully extended position of the poly air assembly.

Agree check b4 leaving
Cheers mick

[bru21]

They are rubbish, old mans carked it in 1 year.

[GaryP]

What a load of crap just because 1 set carks it does not mean they are rubbish. Most problems are caused by faulty fitting. I have run them for the past 4 years, in that time they have done the canning cape and
simpson a couple of times and about 100k on the road. They will probably last as long as the vehicle will

[Bingham]

I am not getting them. I went EFS 3 inch front and 4 inch rear to factor weight in (big roof top tent and full arb bar tool boxes 2 fridges esky etc) and not limit flex . I felt it would have to in a coil setup limit flex to some degree. We spend all this cash on getting flex then i felt stiffining them up defeated the purpose sort off.

Was specifically talking mates two utes which will be heavy to full presssure airbags doing the cape as went 2 inch lift. May only need full flex 5 times on trip but if you dont have could mean you dont go forward or get a little tippy..... Just interested to know.

If they run 28psi?? or whatever it is at full flex up you be running 50psi? then so much as a twig rubs it and ...... ??

I appreciate for the caravan boys they sensational but just asking question...

But sounds like most reckon they should still be ok. Cross over pipe makes a fair bit of sense also.

[mickbeny]

Hi all...The OTL is over rated as a tough 4wd track,Subaroo's do it with ease.They even put a dozer thru the Gunshot every couple of years.Its a must do track though.

I got Pollyairs in the back of my ute,They do not restrict flex if set up properly.Mine have been on my latest ute for 5 yrs now and no issues what so ever.

[Bingham]

Am not concerned mate about OTL having done it also.... but hypotheitcally there or the frenchmans who knows what we might encounter there or on some back roads of the gulf....... especially when looking for trouble
Could be any 4wding scenario is the story.. Main point is limitations..

I did not see any libertys up there myself in saying this or wrx's

[oldmate]

It sounds like you want a locker

[mick80]

Am not concerned mate about OTL having done it also.... but hypotheitcally there or the frenchmans who knows what we might encounter there or on some back roads of the gulf....... especially when looking for trouble
Could be any 4wding scenario is the story.. Main point is limitations..

I did not see any libertys up there myself in saying this or wrx's

That was what I was thinking lol
Cheers mick

[mickbeny]

It sounds like you want a locker

Hi all...And a winch.LOL.

[mick80]

It sounds like you want a locker

Hi all...And a winch.LOL.

Def a winch lol
Cheers Mick

[Bingham]

i and they have winches.....

and lockers are for girls Company cars dont need lockers

[mick80]

i and they have winches.....

and lockers are for girls Company cars dont need lockers

Girls??
Wtf!!
Cheers mick

[love ke70]

the thing with bags is, if your doing a bit of serious off road, drop some pressure out, and it will flex as well as it always did.
on my ute i have a long tray and alot of weight behind the rear wheels, so run every day 30psi with the work gear on board, if i head out wheeling with the gear on, i wont drop bag pressures and it will flex very well. the weight will force it to.
but like i said, if your concerned, just drop the pressures and when your back on the higher speed stuff, put the air back in, and all will be good for stability

[Bingham]

Thats my point mate is that if your 'loaded' and drop pressure all of a sudden the ass is sagging, dragging and potentially getting wet in the canopy or lifting wheels. Boys yesterday said without the airbags tray would easily drop 2 inches which is allot. 2 inches in a ute up there the previous trip was the difference between wet and dry gear in his canopy with some fairly deep crossings.

One of the utes is actually replacing the airbags with a new set as when he bought the truck one had a hole in it. Looking at the truck (almost like new) you wonder what brought about the hole....

Best option could encompass both inch longer springs in rear and run medium pressures in airbags as necessary.... can imagine the fun if airbags gave way mid trip.....

[mick80]

If they r loaded up that much they will flex!!
FACT!!!
Cheers mick

[oldmate]

Shouldn't need to drop pressures.

If reliability is a concern, just go with HD springs.

You are over thinking it

[Bingham]

Shouldn't need to drop pressures.

If reliability is a concern, just go with HD springs.

You are over thinking it

One of the lads with the heavier canopy went heavy duty springs and this made minimal difference / still sagged like sleeve of wizard They would likely suffice in the other lighter alloy canopy depending on how many beers etc your carrying. most of us loaded and ready but just wanted to throw it to the gallery

[fatassgq]

From experience (with the coil helper type bags inside the coil) they will not have any major effect on flex if set up correctly, especially with a lot of weight on board. It is not a lot different to running light coils in a light car and heavy coils in a heavy car. Generally the heavy car will out flex the lighter one anyway. Certainly with only a two inch lift your shocks will be the limiting factor before the bags will.

The pic to the left with gq on ramp actually had poly airs in it but was a bigger lift than you are talking.

Also you can get a kevlar bag to protect the air bag now thru airbag man or distributers (Superior Engineering for one) which may be a good investment for the kind of stuff you may encounter.

Brian

[love ke70]

makes me wonder how the bag got a hole in it too, ive had mine in for 3 ish years now. and once i put was welding about the fill line and put a hole in that without realising, and drove for a week with a bag that would keep going empty, and i still didnt manage to pinch it. i really think alot of the failures are due to incorrrect installs.
if your dropping 2 inches, it sounds about as heavy as my ute, and you wont have an issue with it not flexing.

and if your worried about water gettin into the tray, why not just lift the tray some more above the chassis? its not hard to make your own mounts, or just block them up higher with some RHS.

fat ass gq, do you know how much these kevlar sleeves are?


and one more question, as these utes sound really heavy on the ass end, have you guys considered bracing the coilmounts? like the kits superior sell, to stop you ripping the coil mount out of the chassis, which people have done up there.


cheers, andy

[fatassgq]

Very very good point about bracing the coil mounts. It is not a matter of if they will bend and eventually break but when.
Heavy gu's with airbag helpers seem to be the main culprit too.

I am sorry I do not know the price of the sleeves. I think they are only relatively new I only seen one set fitted to a vehicle.
Give airbag man a ring or the guys at Superior may be able to help too.

[love ke70]

do GQs tend to do the same thing? ive read conflicting info on it...

[fatassgq]

Personally I have seen a lot more GU's with this problem. In fact I don't recall seeing any GQ's with it but after all the beer and years I may have memory fade lol

GU's are probably more commonly overloaded these days as work trucks etc than GQ's so this may have something to do with it.

Either way it is far better to avoid than try and fix. It can be a real pain in the arse to get in and grind/weld/fix the mess it creates once the damage is done.

[Bingham]

Shouldn't need to drop pressures.

If reliability is a concern, just go with HD springs.

You are over thinking it

I dont want to say i told you so but i told you so........ Heavy duty rears and polyairs and both (1 with alloy canopy, 1 with steel) sagged like farkers... i was very dissappointed in polyairs. Both owners not to impressed with the saggy setups

Need 1 inch longer rear springs and airbags no questions.... that is all

[love ke70]

have you weighed the vehicles?
and obviously you have standard height bags and have put 4" or whatever lift your running blocks under the bag inside the spring?

[Bingham]

the bags in both utes are to suit the current 2 inch lift and will alter as needed with different springs.

Both utes be very heavy. Have not weighed either as yet. 1 maybe in next week when he is back.. My loaded wagon came in at 3.5t and cant see the utes to far behind