Outer Limits 4x4 Board

Recently spent $5,000 + rebuilding a P76 for my 1988 Rangie with R380. Not a bad engine, except for the fuel economy (26L/100km or 270kms from my standard 70L tank - oouch!). This was the same as its 3.5 predecessor, which the new motor borrowed the EFI top end from. So in some respects I'm better off with the extra torque and power with no increase in fuel consumption. But it's a long way from the 10L-15L/100km I'd like to achieve for my touring purposes.

While looking through 1 of several engine magazines, I noticed any number of NEW 350 Chev Vortec 330hp engines with most stuff on them and 12 months warranty for $4000 - $6000, depending on specific designation (all carbied at that price).

I've heard that these engines (Gen III) can return really good fuel economy figures (11L/100km) when cruising.

Are these Chev type V8 petrols worth considering before I go back to my original diesel plan? Price, fuel economy and torque being my main concerns. I know Marks Adaptors in Melbourne supply adaptor kits for Chev V8 to Range Rover conversions.

Thanks in advance, Nigel

$5K later and 26L/100km.... what a joke...
my old carby 3.5L on 35's with 4.5 diff ratios returns about 18L/100km's and that is not taking it easy either.....

Why are you running an efi setup that is designed for a 3.5L engine on a 4.4L.... surely after spending 5K on a rebuild you would have gone with an aftermarket ECU that would fuel the motor a little better

The flapper style AFM is apparently quite adaptable to larger engines as long as the fuel pressure is increased appropriately. Putting in a rising rate fuel reg will be my cheap bastard fix until i can put in a proper EFI system.

i'd just bang a quadrajet on it... but that is just me...
yes TUFFRR you are correct... but you did not go for an all out, no expense spared rebuild as I assume nigel did...

well, that was the plan.....

The 4.4 was meant to be a cheaper option than a 4.6 but in the end i think it really didn't make much difference.

I'm running 3.54 standard rover diffs with 33" tyres. Maybe I should go to 4.1: 1 diffs. to bring things back to norm.

But what about the Chevs?

in my opinion they are too heavy... but that is just my opinion... some blokes run em and put heavier springs in... but i like the fact that i can carry my short motor from the carport to the work bench

I have a 80 RR with a worn 3.5 L with a Holley 350 and a 4 speed gearbox and I have a 99 GMC 1500 with a 5.3L Vortec V8 (LM7).

The RR gets about 19L/100 km but that includes a bit of short trips and town stuff. The GMC gets about 11-12L/100 km doing the same driving.

The GMC weighs about 2400 kg approx. I'm not sure what the RR weighs but I am sure others here can fill you in.

I think the Vortech engine are really great. The 96 to 98 model pickups has a 5.7L V8 that was good and from 99 onwards they had a 5.3L V8 that is even better. More power and better fuel economy. The pre 96 engines had a centre port injected that is not much chop. These engine are all cast iron blocks unlike the LS1 which is a aluminum block.

I would go injected if you are going to run one of these engines.

26l/100k's is not good. Even my 3.9 EFI is better, which is scary.

I average about 23L/100k's, but I do drive like a leadfoot a bit and flog the shit out of it. On a good day I get 20L/100k's when I an a bit more consevative with the right foot.

All Rangies have shit fuel economy, some worse than others!!!

Trav

And i thought 16ltr/100 was bad on my EFI 3.5. Maybe its not that bad afterall. But its still going ASAP. Its too slow. Im going with a holden 5ltr EFI and either the ZF if i can get it beefed up a little or otherwise a T700 4spd auto.

Gday Tony,
Im doing the same 5L but im going to push the ZF and see what happens.

Regards
Robg65

I recently enquired to marks adaptors a while ago about the gen3/ls1 v8 transplants and they don't make kits for this particular engine, only the earlier chev v8's (ie when they were iron blocks). However, castlemain (??) rod shop make a transmission adaptor for the gen 3 to ZF box but i think you still have to get custom engine mounts etc.

My personal preference would be the gen 3 as its only a tad heavier than the rover v8's and has huge power and torque with better fuel economy. Only problem is they cost about $7500 with a computer whcih is to much for me .

One thing to remember is that putting a heavy engine up font may ruin you on road handling as the light weight alloy block was part of the rangies setup to get a centre of gravity low and in the middle of the vehicle. But if you don't mind the handling differneces go for a 5L holden efi. Can be brought for about $3500 from wreckers with all extras in good condition. And theres heaps of spare parts available.

Nigel,

I am still ring a satd 3.9 EFI with a Wolf 3D computer and i use well under 20l per 100K's now but before i was using 30+ L per 100... so for under 1k (i already had the computer) so now i have a rangie that runs 33" on road and 35 ET's off road (goes better on 35") because of 4.11 diffs... I have plenty of power no on and off road and it's a lot lighter on my back pocket to run her now...

IMHO stay with a Rover motor they are cheap to buy and fix and easy to get parts for and best of all very light so you won't bend yr front end... ring around you will be very supprised!!!

HTH
Mick

Which after market computer system is best for a Rover type engine?
Mick, you mentioned Wolf 3D, are there any other better ones you've heard of. Which is best for handling a dual fuel setup? What do they replace - the whole Rover computer? Fill me in brothers!

Thanks in advance, Nigel

nigeljarvis wrote:Which after market computer system is best for a Rover type engine?
Mick, you mentioned Wolf 3D, are there any other better ones you've heard of. Which is best for handling a dual fuel setup? What do they replace - the whole Rover computer? Fill me in brothers!

Thanks in advance, Nigel

ok her we go...

which EMS is better... who the fark knows they all have there good and bad point the wolf is a very good all rounder...

I run the old version (can't buy it anymore)

But the new version allows you to run dual mapping fuel and ign so perfect for LPG / Petrol engines.. the way it can be setup is when u flick the fuel switch the wolf reads from the mem cartridge and changes fuel and ign maps so you get best of both worlds!! goto www.rankrotary.com.au for an idea on prices for the wold componants... it will off the top of my head will cost about $1300 for the ECU and controller software, sensors looms etc... then about the same to install it... these guys make there money on the Dyno so be prepared topay about $100 an hour for dynoing...... If you install the EMS yr self then you save about 1K...

The aftermarket EMS are 100% illigal!! but who the fark cares when you get power!!

There are few different options when it come to EMS systems... fuel only (crap) fuel and ignition is the best way you get yr torque from ign timing and spark etc... then there are fuel / ign and extras!! extra is thermo fan controll, aux inputs / outputs close loop control ( for better Eccomany) and a sh!t load more goto www.wolfems.com.au and have a read of what the wolf is able to do.... if you want the best go motec but pay the big bucks!!! and for a pooftine more power is not worth the extra $$$$ you will pay for it...

The best thing of all about after market EMS is NO FARKING LUCAS!!! u replace airflow meter with a $26 air temp sensor (everyone sells them) and for Eccomany you buy a hot wire O2 sensor for about $70 and yr done!!

HTH
Mick

Ive got the old 73 350 , in my project --
There is no comparison in the price for rebiulding --
the chevs a so cheap its freaky ,

I have only needed a few bits -- felpro full gasket set $85 moly rings $85
New water pump 79 - New block huggers headers $125 -

Hehe even brought a pair of BLING BLING Tall Chrome rocker covers New $45.

I did see one mob advertising BRand new blocks $1100 ,

Seems to me you could biuld a strong 383 strocker with aftermaket heads for 4/5 gs

I reckon any price for a rover bit is double that o the chev .

JMO,
Larry.


(Ps not saying it would be better for every one , MIne is going striaght gas
And only an occaisional driver sort of thing .)

i bought everything brand new for my 383. pro topline heads, scat crank, new block, machining, speed pro cam, pistons, bearings, gaskets, edelbrock intake, etc. everything for 5000. assembled it myself.

if you were to get someone else to build it, it would cost lots more, but this was the first engine ive ever built and it was pretty simple. would of been more work saving up 3000-4000 to build the thing. the money i saved here i spent 2000 on a twin gas research system. fuel injection is probably a cheaper option than this, but 35c/litre vs 95c/litre. it returns 20L/100kms (LPG too!!!).

puts out around the 400hp mark. the cam specs are pretty stock too. it has an economy/towing cam. i could of chosen a more mild-wild cam, but with the size it doesnt really need it. makes good power and torque all day without missing a beat.

i cant be happier with it.

MaccA

There is somthing wrong witg your set up to get 25ltrs per 100K, as for your question I know of an 94-96 LT1 long motor only done 5000k's and the guy only wants $1800 for it :> As for your question don't bother with the holdern 5l even the injected one, it will improve your econ from your present state but the power increase will be min at best and weight will be a fair bit. Your are best to go with a 5.7ltr chev which is lighter the 010 blocks a bit heavier but not much will have heaps more torque and power and will greatly improve your fule econ from 25ltrs per 100k they. A well built 010 will last far longer and take way more abuse than a 3.5 or 4.4 I have had both of those motors while the 4.4 was good I now have chev :> you can get a kit for $395 from Castle main rod shop, I think a new very heavy duty clutch from Direct Clutch in brisbain is worth $320 the mounts are childs play. I guess the thing that you have to remeber the more power / torque you have and the lighter your car is the better your crusing econ will be :> Chevs may be a little heavyer than you 4.4, but you get an alloy bellhousing instead of a super heavy cast one! little things like that make the difference in weight not so bad, especialy when you are looking at the possiblity of double the HP for the same dollars and with a chev you get your dizzy at the back of the motor where they belong in a 4x4, not right at the frount next to the fan there one chev like that don't bother with them though. If you have any more questions about cheving your rangie give me a pm :>