Outer Limits 4x4 Board

g'day guys
i have recently purchasd a 91 dual cab hilux ln106 with no mods at all.
my plan is to make it a decent off road truck i dont want 18" of flex etc but i want to be able to do decent tracks being confident that im not going to stuff the lux
i was just wondering what you guys thought would be the first step to take?
i know a good set of tyres and some decent driving skills goes a long way and i want to be able to run 33's with no scrub on full tuck.
any advice or ideas would be really aprreciated.
cheers mick

Lockers.

IMOP lockers would be the first step as you can drive alot of tracks standard just with lockers, then go around a 3" suspension lift and 33's

Do a search as everyone has their own opinions on suspension, but i liked my EFS/rancho kit i got off superior engineering when i first lifted my truck, but locktup do good kits and so do a few other places..

brad

And make sure you wide track it. Feel so much more stable and better stance.

wide track what domean by that like wheel spacers, wider diff , etc r is there actually a wide track kit you can use sorry mate im just getting into the scene

Yer mate. For the rear you use s IFS diff housing( out of a IFS Hilux it's 3" wider.) it's complete boot up Abd all yOu need is the handbrake cable to suit.

Then for the front you use IFS HUBS( where the wheel mounts to with the wheel bearings inside) then you get a IFS WIDENING KIT(a spacer and bolts) which spacer your brake rotor to factory position because the wheel mounting flange is further offset giving you a INCREASE IN WHERL TRACK.

Giving you a total wheel track gain of 3" with no excess loaf on bearings from wheel spacers or massive offset rims. You can always use then after if you want to go wider but at least the way described is LEGAL(as far as I am aware)

ahhk dosnt sound like a hard job at all and would be good to have that extra stability espically with the lift in and high center of gravity .
so after the the few replys i have got, i rekon im going to go between 2-6" lift a locker and wide track tbe lux as well for extra stability.

QUESTIONS
1.what would be the best way to get the lift a mixure of spring lift and body lift or shackles and lifting blocks etc etc..
2.locker should i go front or back and why

any help or advice would be great and i know there are probably posts out there on this subject but i have searched for hours on end to no avail
cheers mick

Mate of mine has 2inch shackles with longer springs, high steer the.wide.track kit mentioned before and dual cases. And soon twin lockers.

If I was on a budget I'd start with decent protection and spring lift first especially the bash plate for the transfer then widening kit with 60 series offset rims and decent tires. Then Go for lockers and then dual transfers if you're real keen.

You don't need HI steer and you don't need duel cases. All you nEed is 3" lift for 33s

This would be my plan of attack
-3" suspension lift(2" springs And 2" shackles) with dropped draglink Nd adjustable torque rod
-33" tyres of your choice.
- lockers( twins preferably but rear first if you can't get both)
-wide track kit
-crawler gears
-HI CLEARANCE crossmember(trans And gearbox mount)
-CV and AXLE upgrade in the front

Good driver !!!



brooksy

mick t wrote:ahhk dosnt sound like a hard job at all and would be good to have that extra stability espically with the lift in and high center of gravity .
so after the the few replys i have got, i rekon im going to go between 2-6" lift a locker and wide track tbe lux as well for extra stability.

QUESTIONS
1.what would be the best way to get the lift a mixure of spring lift and body lift or shackles and lifting blocks etc etc..
2.locker should i go front or back and why

any help or advice would be great and i know there are probably posts out there on this subject but i have searched for hours on end to no avail
cheers mick

1- better off going for just the spring lift, as said 2"raised springs and 2"extended shackles this give you the 3" lift for the 33's
2- always go rear locker first, most of you traction is needed when you go uphill and when you do majority of the tracks weight is on the rear axles.. Plus if you went front locker first without the rear locker (lsd's in hilux's rear are crap) you WILL break the cv's unless you went cromo axles/cv's front.

IMOP body lift is a fair bit of work to do properly and is not as much of a benefit off road as what spring lift will be.

The other thing is with 33's you will find you will want to lower the gearing down a bit, the most effective to bring it back to standard ratio (or close) is to change the diff centres front + rear which are a no modification direct changeover mod, by the time you sell your old centres it wont have cost much/ if anything.. This is much cheaper then crawler gears and with 33's twin transfers are a bit of an overkill..

Brad

Their is no need to go higher than 3-4" lift. The rest comes down to your ability to pick correct lines & throttle control.



brooksy

Brad i was running 33 with a 2.4 Dsl and found it a little slugish yes but you can deal with it. yes putting 4.56 gears would be but it wont be to much of a issue with the 4.3s. yes crawler gears would be nice but there is no need for Duels

old lux wrote: - lockers( twins preferably but rear first if you can't get both)

Im my 10yrs of owning wheeling and competing in the 4x4 scene, i would never fit a locker to the rear if i only had one locker to fit.. it would be going in the front with no hesitation..
reason being - when you climb / rock crawl your front wheels are the pulling wheels the rear wheels dig.. if you have an open front centre and a locked rear you tend to dig holes and bury the ass... With a locker in the front you have both fronts with traction pulling up the hill and not burying the ass of the truck...

Im sure other will disgree with me.. this is my experience ... Most will disagree due to them not wanting to breake CVs.. simple solution 1. drive sensable, 2. LONGFIELDS..

matt

MogLux wrote:

old lux wrote: - lockers( twins preferably but rear first if you can't get both)

Im my 10yrs of owning wheeling and competing in the 4x4 scene, i would never fit a locker to the rear if i only had one locker to fit.. it would be going in the front with no hesitation..
reason being - when you climb / rock crawl your front wheels are the pulling wheels the rear wheels dig.. if you have an open front centre and a locked rear you tend to dig holes and bury the ass... With a locker in the front you have both fronts with traction pulling up the hill and not burying the ass of the truck...

Im sure other will disgree with me.. this is my experience ... Most will disagree due to them not wanting to breake CVs.. simple solution 1. drive sensable, 2. LONGFIELDS..

matt

I was thinking more then just rocks. If he plays in the mud a rear is switched permanently on where a front is only switched on momentarily. And that's the same with sand. Also rutts ita more useful in the rear.

I do understand what your saying tho.

I too would go a locker in the front before the rear if I could only afford one! Then you could always weld the rear until you could afford one for the rear.

old lux wrote:

MogLux wrote:

old lux wrote: - lockers( twins preferably but rear first if you can't get both)

Im my 10yrs of owning wheeling and competing in the 4x4 scene, i would never fit a locker to the rear if i only had one locker to fit.. it would be going in the front with no hesitation..
reason being - when you climb / rock crawl your front wheels are the pulling wheels the rear wheels dig.. if you have an open front centre and a locked rear you tend to dig holes and bury the ass... With a locker in the front you have both fronts with traction pulling up the hill and not burying the ass of the truck...

Im sure other will disgree with me.. this is my experience ... Most will disagree due to them not wanting to breake CVs.. simple solution 1. drive sensable, 2. LONGFIELDS..

matt

I was thinking more then just rocks. If he plays in the mud a rear is switched permanently on where a front is only switched on momentarily. And that's the same with sand. Also rutts ita more useful in the rear.

I do understand what your saying tho.

As i said others would disagree and thats fine... but in my experience and what iv wheeled.. mud, rocks and sand.. i would only ever fit a llocker to the front..
no matter what terrian one in the rear will always dig and the front will pull...
For mud..... thats just nasty anyway ... and all it does is f$%# your car..

I live in Darwin bro. Up in the NT all we have is mud. No hills no rocks( 2 or 3 at most)

cheers for the replys guys the reasoning behind the front locker makes alot of sence to me i never really thought about it brfore and yer i prefer to try and stay away from the mud ( if possible ) .
On the lift subject i'd love to do spring and shackle but i no to many boys who have been done for extended shackles and as my hilux is my daily driver 80% of the time want to try and avoid that option, so would a body and spring be the next most effictive option ? or should isave that bit extra and get something like the efs 3" lifted springs ?

cheers mick t

brooksy wrote:Good driver !!!



brooksy

true that , all the accessories in the world cant help a useless driver

MogLux wrote:

old lux wrote:

MogLux wrote:

old lux wrote: - lockers( twins preferably but rear first if you can't get both)

Im my 10yrs of owning wheeling and competing in the 4x4 scene, i would never fit a locker to the rear if i only had one locker to fit.. it would be going in the front with no hesitation..
reason being - when you climb / rock crawl your front wheels are the pulling wheels the rear wheels dig.. if you have an open front centre and a locked rear you tend to dig holes and bury the ass... With a locker in the front you have both fronts with traction pulling up the hill and not burying the ass of the truck...

Im sure other will disgree with me.. this is my experience ... Most will disagree due to them not wanting to breake CVs.. simple solution 1. drive sensable, 2. LONGFIELDS..

matt

I was thinking more then just rocks. If he plays in the mud a rear is switched permanently on where a front is only switched on momentarily. And that's the same with sand. Also rutts ita more useful in the rear.

I do understand what your saying tho.

As i said others would disagree and thats fine... but in my experience and what iv wheeled.. mud, rocks and sand.. i would only ever fit a llocker to the front..
no matter what terrian one in the rear will always dig and the front will pull...
For mud..... thats just nasty anyway ... and all it does is f$%# your car..

I aggree with this aswell. Although many many other people dissagree. It depends on the wheeling your doing. On a steep ledge 90% of the time you can bump your front wheels up and over, but without a winch or front locker youll never make it. Lsd's are good when no big articualtion is envolved. Thats what I explained to my father during the arb locker demo. It already has F&R air lockers. Then they say this is as far as you will get with out lockers. But the rear is now an open centre and not lsd. I found the lsd's good in my lux and patrol when shimmed. Obviously nowhere near as good as a locker. But certainly and shit load better than an open centre.

See for me 90% of the tracks i drive are with a rear locker only (unless i need F&R lockers), as i still like the ease of steering when front is unlocked
But thats my opinion, but i have alot of rear flex and my rear tyres dont come off the track often so i have both rear drive and front..

Even with cromo cv's n axles i am careful with when i use my front.

If you have good wheel travel alot of the time the front will crawl up a ledge without a locker any way (though i'm not as extreme as some)

Not after a argument, just my opinion.

Brad

Yeah the front will crawl up a ledge and sit on top. But I couldnt ever get my truck up and over. There is a theory in there somewhere. Front locker = up and over easy. My experience. But Id get dual lockers in a heart beat these days.

Alright, rear locker equals good traction for pushing up hills because of your weight transfer to the rear of the vehicle when ascending a hill, but a front locker also helps keep you on the line you wanted in the first place , there is no pount trying decent hills if you can't puck and maintain a line, imop both lockers are equally important

mick t wrote:g'day guys
i have recently purchasd a 91 dual cab hilux ln106 with no mods at all.
my plan is to make it a decent off road truck i dont want 18" of flex etc but i want to be able to do decent tracks being confident that im not going to stuff the lux
i was just wondering what you guys thought would be the first step to take?
i know a good set of tyres and some decent driving skills goes a long way and i want to be able to run 33's with no scrub on full tuck.
any advice or ideas would be really aprreciated.
cheers mick

I honestly think you have already said what you need to do. A good set of tyres and some skills. You don't need lockers to go out and learn basic off road driving. Pick your tyres first, then you may have to go for some new suspension to take them. A 2-3"kit on a lux is all you would need I reckon (Lux guys can advise further).

I think learning to drive without lockers goes a long way to driving better with lockers down the track as you aren't as dependent on them. Let's face it, unless he no brains at all, he isn't going to try a 6' step up on his first trip out, so why have the gear for that. If you're worried about getting stuck, go with a mate or get a winch.

Most importantly, enjoy it.

Definately agree with that aswell. I would highly recommend people go out with out lockers and learn to drive to their and their truck capabilities. Then when you cant go any further, add lockers. You can get yourself into some serious trouble with lockers and no clue.

Agreed^^^^

First trip it did with lockers and my ute ended up leaning against a rock wall on it's side

yer ihave about 30 tripsup my sleve driving mates 4wd's but never driven with lockers before wanna do a few trip in my lux before i put one in.
Also RUF conversion ive been reading up on it have any of you done this to a lux and would you recomend it or shouldi just go lifted springs?
cheers mick

Just buy mine and be done with asking questions....

If all you want is a Capable truck that doesnt cost a fortune, you dont have to do much. If you want 33's and wider stance then buy the tyres and get plenty of offset on your rims, similar offset and cheaper. Dont bother with wide track, not yet anyway. As for lift, you dont need more than 3", and i only have a front locker, that said if you cant afford better axles and cv's then a rear is probably better. A low profile gearbox x member makes a huge difference as does reduction gears